Hellish near death experiences

[Nous]

We're in a realm of equal and opposite reactions, so you might find we don't get what we expect always...

Watch the debates against Dr Eben Alexander by skeptics..Try debating atheists in a public chat area on this subject...

I came across Drs. Alexander and Moody in the Intelligence Squared debate: Do Realistic Interpretations of NDEs Imply Violation of the Laws of Physics? As I noted in the OP, I found that debate rather unsatisfying. There was a lot of dumb stuff on the other side of the table.

 

[Nous]

It was at 23; around 17 years ago.

Eat the wrong mushrooms, and stopped my heart.

Wow. Completely interesting. Were you resuscitated immediately? Did you recall your experience immediately upon being revived?

A lot of NDErs have difficulty afterwards, as they didn't want to "return". Was that the case with you?

 

[Nakosis]

This to me has the feeling of accuracy from my understanding of what happens after the body is dropped:

In near-death experience, man sees hell where he feels all the bad things he did to others

“I was being put into other people’s shoes as I was doing bad things to them.”

“I could see how insensitive I was to people and didn’t even know it. It was excruciating and overwhelming to relive things that I had forgotten about, or just didn’t care about. I was made to feel they way I made others feel,” he said.
...
“After a long time, my eyes began to burn so badly, I finally decided that it was worth it to put up with the bad flashes if I could just close my eyes for a while. I began to sob quietly as the flashes of my evil ways rushed in, and I heard a voice. It said, ‘If you ask him, maybe he will save you.'”

Jeffrey asked again and again for salvation.
...
“I was an alcoholic drug dealer that had become a thug,” he said. But he turned his life around. He no longer fears death, even after his hellish experience, because of his overarching, peaceful connection to the divine.

The subconscious mind keeps track of every misdeed we've done in life. The conscious self learns to justify or block all of those past misdeeds.

They say "Confession is good for the soul". Well yes, you acknowledge your past misdeeds, do some form of penance and come to terms with your past.

This is a very powerful “game” that you can play with the mind. It creates a coherent field between the heart and the brain, and it affords the mind the space to find the peace that it is looking for. Real change happens at this level, where the mind lives.

There are many ways to calm a negative energy without suppressing or fighting it. You recognize it, you smile to it, and you invite something nicer to come up and replace it.
~Thich Nhat Hanh

Making Peace With Your Past | Quantum Healing Hypnosis

 

[Kelly of the Phoenix]

During one dream of hell, I found Satan's keys in his office that lets you get out. He was rather irritated.

 

[Nous]

BTW, @wizanda , did your NDE have anything to do with you becoming a vegan?

 

[wizanda]

Were you resuscitated immediately?

God asked if i wanted to come back, and woke up on my bedroom floor with my tongue, and lips all blue.

Did you recall your experience immediately upon being revived?

Yes vividly, and still seems yesterday.

A lot of NDErs have difficulty afterwards, as they didn't want to "return". Was that the case with you?

I'm signed off work for being suicidal; which is basically like being homesick.

did your NDE have anything to do with you becoming a vegan?

Was first veggie as a child of 8/9 years old, as found it inhumane.

Now after doing catering, and realizing the science behind nutrition, know it is illogical to eat animal products... Took me until 29 tho to quit meat, and vegan since 35.

In my opinion.

 

[DennisTate]

Wow, I was not familiar with Rawlings' work. I began the video. I don't care for the preachy message. I will look him up.

To be perfectly blunt......
I am not thrilled with his preachy style either
because I have became convinced of eventual universal salvation but........
Dr. Rawling's had not gotten to that place at the time of that video......
and I believe that he was doing the very best that he could with what he knew at that time.

I do admire his courage......
even if he was unaware of:

Christian Andreason's Near-Death Experience

h. Who goes to heaven?

In the end ... believe it or not (sigh of relief), everyone gets to come home! Heaven is a place of ultimate LOVE. When we have learned how to become individuals that base our entire existence and consciousness around manifesting LOVE, we then become capable of entering the domain of the higher Realms of Heaven. If we do not practice Love, we can only go so far and we will be made to incarnate somewhere out there in God's super Universe again and again (unlimited times) until we learn.

 

[Nous]

God asked if i wanted to come back, and woke up on my bedroom floor with my tongue, and lips all blue.

Again, wow. It seems you're fortunate in a couple of different ways. I do hope you feel fortunate.

It's surprising to me how quickly the brain shuts down so quickly after the heart stops beating--about 15-30 seconds.

What were your beliefs or worldview before your NDE? I was a complete idiot when I was 23, and still mostly an idiot. I can only imagine that if I had had some sort of NDE at 23 I would have had to undergone a radical change in my worldview.

I'm signed off work for being suicidal; which is basically like being homesick.

I do hope you overcome your homesickness. It isn't difficult to understand homesickness. On the other hand, I find the universe beautiful in so many ways. But what is this thing? I don't know.

 

[Nous]

To be perfectly blunt......
I am not thrilled with his preachy style either
because I have became convinced of eventual universal salvation but........
Dr. Rawling's had not gotten to that place at the time of that video......
and I believe that he was doing the very best that he could with what he knew at that time.

I do admire his courage......
even if he was unaware of:

Christian Andreason's Near-Death Experience

I've learned to overlook the preachy message of several of the NDE researchers. Rawlings' findings that you note (70% of NDErs not remembering) is intriguing and important, as, of course, there is the issue that so few people who've been clinically dead actually do report an NDE.

 

[QuestioningMind]

This to me has the feeling of accuracy from my understanding of what happens after the body is dropped:

In near-death experience, man sees hell where he feels all the bad things he did to others

“I was being put into other people’s shoes as I was doing bad things to them.”

“I could see how insensitive I was to people and didn’t even know it. It was excruciating and overwhelming to relive things that I had forgotten about, or just didn’t care about. I was made to feel they way I made others feel,” he said.
...
“After a long time, my eyes began to burn so badly, I finally decided that it was worth it to put up with the bad flashes if I could just close my eyes for a while. I began to sob quietly as the flashes of my evil ways rushed in, and I heard a voice. It said, ‘If you ask him, maybe he will save you.'”

Jeffrey asked again and again for salvation.
...
“I was an alcoholic drug dealer that had become a thug,” he said. But he turned his life around. He no longer fears death, even after his hellish experience, because of his overarching, peaceful connection to the divine.

I suppose that it's interesting to learn about the types of things that a human brain had hallucinate about when on the verge of shutting down, but I hardly see how it's relevant to reality.

 

[Windwalker]

I suppose that it's interesting to learn about the types of things that a human brain had hallucinate about when on the verge of shutting down, but I hardly see how it's relevant to reality.

If you have ever had an NDE experience of any type, it completely changes everything in how you think of reality. That's how it's relevant.

 

[Windwalker]

This to me has the feeling of accuracy from my understanding of what happens after the body is dropped:

In what ways? Can you share what your understanding is?

 

[David1967]

It was at 23; around 17 years ago.

Eat the wrong mushrooms, and stopped my heart.

Do you remember what kind of mushrooms they were?

 

[Nous]

I suppose that it's interesting to learn about the types of things that a human brain had hallucinate about when on the verge of shutting down, but I hardly see how it's relevant to reality.

Obviously you are not familiar with the evidence.

 

[blü 2]

Obviously you are not familiar with the evidence.

It's always seemed to me that if NDEs were not simply artifacts of the traumatized brain, but represented a reality external to the subject, then we should expect some aspects of reality to appear in the reports by subjects. Much the same is true of OBEs.

So we have no authenticated cases of a subject returning from an NDE with new remote knowledge of reality. Grandpa may meet the subject at the pearly (or sulfurous) gates, but he doesn't manage to pass on where his lost will may be found, for example.

Without some evidence of this kind, the hypothesis that the phenomenon is purely the product of the brain stressed by trauma, anoxia, or some other purely physical circumstance, is the only one with any objective credibility.

Not least because all the others require magic.

 

[Nous]

It's always seemed to me that if NDEs were not simply artifacts of the traumatized brain, but represented a reality external to the subject, then we should expect some aspects of reality to appear in the reports by subjects. Much the same is true of OBEs.

So, in other words, you are also not familiar with the evidence in the peer-reviewed literature.

 

[blü 2]

So, in other words, you are also not familiar with the evidence in the peer-reviewed literature.

If you're saying that the peer-reviewed literature contains an authenticated case of the subject returning from an NDE with new remote knowledge of reality, then please refer me to it.

If there's no such case, then you've offered no reason for me to amend my previous comment.

A nebulous argument from authority ─ an airy wave of the hand at wholly unspecified 'peer-reviewed literature' ─ won't cut it.

 

[Nous]

If you're saying that the peer-reviewed literature contains an authenticated case of the subject returning from an NDE with new remote knowledge of reality, then please refer me to it.

I don't know what that means.

The peer-reviewed literature documents that people can have lucid experiences including complex and logical thought processes, form memories, and veridical perceptions not acquired through sensory organs during clinical death or the seconds immediately after resuscitation, when there is insufficient electrical activity and oxygen in the brain to maintain even fundamental cardiac and respiratory functions, much less the global cerebral activity commonly assumed to be necessary for such lucid experiences, logical thought processes and memory formation.

 

[QuestioningMind]

If you have ever had an NDE experience of any type, it completely changes everything in how you think of reality. That's how it's relevant.

If you've ever had a hallucination that you can't distinguish from reality, then you'd be aware of how the brain can play tricks on you and would make you question the validity of any NDE.

 

[QuestioningMind]

Obviously you are not familiar with the evidence.

Actually, I've read quite a bit on the subject.