Help With Paganism?

[Sundance]

Greetings, everyone! Here's my situation:

Since I first encountered the concept of Polytheism as a younger boy, I'm deeply enchanted by it, though I've been on a ‘back-and-forth’ roller coaster about it, too. Two other concepts which have since drawn me are Pantheism and Animism. Recently, I discovered that one way I could bring them together is through a Nature religion, so I began thinking about how to find the expression of it that's right for me.

“Could Paganism be that expression?”

So, I open my heart and mind to you.
Are Pagan religions solely Earth-based
religions or is there more to them that I'm not comprehending?? What, then, is Paganism??


Another question concerns my heavy interest in ‘New Age Spirituality’ : would such interests be out of bounds for a Pagan or someone drawn to Paganism?

If you consider yourself a Pagan, how do you feel towards it?

Peace and Blessings.

 

[SabahTheLoner]

Hi there.

The umbrella of Paganism has quite a mix of beliefs, but all of the concepts you present are common among traditional Pagan beliefs. As far as I'm concerned, if you care about nature and believe that a connection to nature in a spiritual sense is important, you're pretty much a Pagan. I know that I had this sort of belief I kept internally within myself for a long time and Paganism was the thing that agreed with my world veiw when it came to spirituality. In fact I would say that Paganism leaves so much room for spiritual interpretation that there isn't really a wrong way to believe in nature.

Also sometimes Paganism is considered the same thing as new age spirituality. This is especially the case with specific branches of Paganism like Wicca and for NeoPagans who practice forms of magic or mysticism.

So the shorter answer is: I think you could technically call yourself a Pagan already but I do encourage you to explore the many forms of Paganism and give yourself some time in the religion as a practitioner to see how you personally feel about it. Read as much as you can, even if you think you read enough to understand, because a Pagan path is very much a path of the individual.

I too loved polytheism as a child and Paganism gave me the opportunity to exercise my longstanding beliefs while exploring new ones and incorporating ideas that I love and can agree to like polytheism but never before had a satisfactory reason to explore. Even though you're ultimately the judge of your own path, I think Paganism will be a good fit for you.

Have a good day (or night, depending on where you are).

 

[Sundance]

Thanks for the very helpful advice, @SabahTheLoner! I will take it to heart.

 

[Mindmaster]

Greetings, everyone! Here's my situation:

Since I first encountered the concept of Polytheism as a younger boy, I'm deeply enchanted by it, though I've been on a ‘back-and-forth’ roller coaster about it, too. Two other concepts which have since drawn me are Pantheism and Animism. Recently, I discovered that one way I could bring them together is through a Nature religion, so I began thinking about how to find the expression of it that's right for me.

“Could Paganism be that expression?”

So, I open my heart and mind to you.
Are Pagan religions solely Earth-based
religions or is there more to them that I'm not comprehending?? What, then, is Paganism??


Another question concerns my heavy interest in ‘New Age Spirituality’ : would such interests be out of bounds for a Pagan or someone drawn to it?

If you consider yourself a Pagan, how do you feel towards it?

Peace and Blessings.

Not to throw a wrench in the works, but there is even such a thing as classical paganism and neo-paganism - they're completely different. Classical paganism (reconstruction) doesn't adhere to the new age-y ideas that developed around the turn of the century. Technically, anything non-Christian is pagan (though the term was originally ONLY in reference to Roman polytheism) but the terms hellene (in reference to Greek polytheism, rather than Roman), goy, gentile, and heathen or similar were of course were used as well. All of those terms were interchangeable for most of history.

In classical paganism, the gods are individuals not manifestations of nature or force though they may preside over such things. The syncretic and pantheistic ideas were not typical of ancient beliefs, and these are a prime example of how different modern "neo-paganism" is from them. By that measure, the new spirituality really does not have credibility even though it would if you trace the lineage through the Hindu and other Eastern systems that these notions derive from. So, that's to say someone who is pagan now may have a lot more common with THAT than the actual historical religions who venerated the same gods/goddesses. The earth-based religions are presumptions as well, and modern inventions... It's important to know the distinction especially if you think a certain deity is important to you.

Modern nature paths are really fusions of several others, and you may as well roll your own if it pleases you.

 

[Sundance]

Not to throw a wrench in the works, but there is even such a thing as classical paganism and neo-paganism - they're completely different. Classical paganism (reconstruction) doesn't adhere to the new age-y ideas that developed around the turn of the century. Technically, anything non-Christian is pagan (though the term was originally ONLY in reference to Roman polytheism) but the terms hellene (in reference to Greek polytheism, rather than Roman), goy, gentile, and heathen or similar were of course were used as well. All of those terms were interchangeable for most of history.

In classical paganism, the gods are individuals not manifestations of nature or force though they may preside over such things. The syncretic and pantheistic ideas were not typical of ancient beliefs, and these are a prime example of how different modern "neo-paganism" is from them. By that measure, the new spirituality really does not have credibility even though it would if you trace the lineage through the Hindu and other Eastern systems that these notions derive from. So, that's to say someone who is pagan now may have a lot more common with THAT than the actual historical religions who venerated the same gods/goddesses. The earth-based religions are presumptions as well, and modern inventions... It's important to know the distinction especially if you think a certain deity is important to you.

Modern nature paths are really fusions of several others, and you may as well roll your own if it pleases you.

All of this sounds very interesting to me, MM! Thank you, man.

 

[Shiranui117]

Greetings, everyone! Here's my situation:

Since I first encountered the concept of Polytheism as a younger boy, I'm deeply enchanted by it, though I've been on a ‘back-and-forth’ roller coaster about it, too. Two other concepts which have since drawn me are Pantheism and Animism. Recently, I discovered that one way I could bring them together is through a Nature religion, so I began thinking about how to find the expression of it that's right for me.

Animism and Paganism go hand-in-hand. In fact, it's often said that one's relationship with nature spirits, housewights, one's ancestors, etc. was more prevalent and important in everyday life than one's relationship with the gods, because it was the spirits that you interacted with on a daily basis.

You might also be interested to know that many animistic religions believe in one overarching Creator God who created everything, such as Tengri in Mongolic and Turkic traditions. Taoism also has the Tao as the one pervading force that permeates the entire cosmos. Point being, I don't think pantheism is out of the question for a pagan at all.

“Could Paganism be that expression?”

So, I open my heart and mind to you.
Are Pagan religions solely Earth-based
religions or is there more to them that I'm not comprehending?? What, then, is Paganism??

Pagan religions are earth-based, ancestor-based, god-based and community-based.

Another question concerns my heavy interest in ‘New Age Spirituality’ : would such interests be out of bounds for a Pagan or someone drawn to it?

If you consider yourself a Pagan, how do you feel towards it?

I consider New Age to be Baby's First Paganism, personally. IMHO, it's a cobbled-together mishmash of stuff from astrology, Hinduism, Buddhism, shamanism, Jungian psychology and Wicca all thrown together in a pan, simmered on low heat, and then put into the oven until partially baked. I've dipped my toes in it, but as I am personally of a more reconstructionist bent, I don't find New Age stuff all that valuable to my particular path. Then again, New Age is sort of like the thing where everybody and their mother can claim to be giving you the real deal. Maybe everything I've run into has been someone's MUS (made up "stuff", for the polite word) that they were peddling, and New Age is actually something different from what I've seen. Just be conscious of what New Age is, and what it isn't, and decide if that's something you want to follow.

 

[Sundance]

Animism and Paganism go hand-in-hand. In fact, it's often said that one's relationship with nature spirits, housewights, one's ancestors, etc. was more prevalent and important in everyday life than one's relationship with the gods, because it was the spirits that you interacted with on a daily basis.

Word.

You might also be interested to know that many animistic religions believe in one overarching Creator God who created everything, such as Tengri in Mongolic and Turkic traditions. Taoism also has the Tao as the one pervading force that permeates the entire cosmos. Point being, I don't think pantheism is out of the question for a pagan at all.

I do so happen to find Daoism interesting. Tengrism, I faintly heard of, but from that brief description, it also sounds very cool.

Pagan religions are earth-based, ancestor-based, god-based and community-based.

Hmmmmmmm....groovy! My path, then, should be quite the adventure!

I consider New Age to be Baby's First Paganism, personally. IMHO, it's a cobbled-together mishmash of stuff from astrology, Hinduism, Buddhism, shamanism, Jungian psychology and Wicca all thrown together in a pan, simmered on low heat, and then put into the oven until partially baked. I've dipped my toes in it, but as I am personally of a more reconstructionist bent, I don't find New Age stuff all that valuable to my particular path. Then again, New Age is sort of like the thing where everybody and their mother can claim to be giving you the real deal. Maybe everything I've run into has been someone's MUS (made up "stuff", for the polite word) that they were peddling, and New Age is actually something different from what I've seen. Just be conscious of what New Age is, and what it isn't, and decide if that's something you want to follow.

I will not take your advice lightly, @Shiranui117. Thanks a million!

 

[The Kilted Heathen]

Two other concepts which have since drawn me are Pantheism and Animism. Recently, I discovered that one way I could bring them together is through a Nature religion, so I began thinking about how to find the expression of it that's right for me. “Could Paganism be that expression?”

In essence, yes. There are several Pagan religions that have Animistic traditions; those tend to be the ones that have truly been passed down through the centuries, though there's also a lot of fluff that pretends to be both animism and ancient. Generally, if it's hard to find, it's likely to be closer to the truth.

With pantheism, that's a view that some Pagans hold. There's few doctrines to say that you can't hold such a view. However there are a lot of traditions that are more firm in soft or hard polytheism (soft meaning they view some gods - such as Thor and Zeus - as the same god, different culture | hard meaning they view the gods as separate and individual beings).

Are Pagan religions solely Earth-based

I've honestly never understood this designation. What is "earth-based"? Paganism certainly worships nature, but this isn't limited to Earth; several Pagan religions also worship gods that govern the cosmos - and even gods that reside in separate dimensions such as the Nine Realms of Heathenry (Germanic Paganism)

Contrary to the notion that Paganism means "everything non-Christian", however, Paganism is Eurocentric. The only thing that this means is that core traditions and structures are based around pre-Christian European cultures; namely Germanic/Norse, Celtic, Greek, Roman, and Slavic. This does, of course, invoke a few knee-jerk objections:

"What, so I have to be European to be a Pagan?"

No, of course not. Paganism has demographics all over the globe. Yet even Heathens (the term for Germanic Pagans) in Mexico worship Thor in a Norse sense, rather than co-opting the deity to an Aztec cultural expression. It's all about culture, not nationality.

"Okay, what if I also worship Kali or practice [Indigenous] American beliefs?"

As there is no dogma or rigid doctrine in Paganism, there's nothing to say that Pagans can't include the practices of other cultures. What you do is really up to you. But, I wouldn't expect to go to an official Pagan gathering and see - for example - a blót (Norse sacrificial observance) in honor of Ra or Ganesh. Heck, some of them are even picky about honoring Loki at Heathen gatherings.

"What if I worship European gods, but don't identify as a Pagan?"

That's fine too. Nothing says that one must call themselves a Pagan. For example, many Hellenists (Greek Paganism) aren't too fond of the term Paganism. Most use it as a term of convenience. For example, primarily I identify as a Heathen. I accept association with the term Ásatrú, but for the most part the American public knows the term "Paganism". So, should it ever come up, I identify my religion as Paganism.

Another question concerns my heavy interest in ‘New Age Spirituality’ : would such interests be out of bounds for a Pagan or someone drawn to it? If you consider yourself a Pagan, how do you feel towards it?

Personally I think a lot of New Age stuff is a load of hogwash. It's people misrepresenting Asian (namely Hindu and Buddhist) and Indigenous American beliefs, and putting some holistic spin on them. It's them that we have to thank for the "what goes around comes around in this lifetime" Karma, as well as insistences on meditation and Chakras. It's seeped it's way into Paganism, but is really only implemented in Wicca. Which is it's own can-of-worm in the Paganism family...

Not to throw a wrench in the works, but there is even such a thing as classical paganism and neo-paganism - they're completely different.

Technically, Classical Paganism is that of the past; what came before Christianity. Everything in this modern revival - including reconstructionist paths - is "Neo-Paganism". The term is not well liked in any community, and so when it must be used the term "Contemporary Paganism" is preferred. But, for simplicity's sake, most just say "Paganism", and it's know that we worship in the modern era.

the new spirituality really does not have credibility even though it would if you trace the lineage through the Hindu and other Eastern systems that these notions derive from. So, that's to say someone who is pagan now may have a lot more common with THAT than the actual historical religions who venerated the same gods/goddesses.

I am really not sure what you're saying here; would you mind clarifying?

 

[Mindmaster]

I am really not sure what you're saying here; would you mind clarifying?

Most of the pantheistic ideas, eclectic pick-a-mix occultism, and ritual methods are not authentic. That's not exactly the same thing as saying they're not useful or valid, however. Also, concepts like three-fold rules are basically poor-mans karma (Eastern ideas), etc... Present and past, pagans probably venerate the same deities but there is a drastically different understanding of them. It's probably better to be a subject of another post, but it is nonetheless true. I was intentionally being a bit evasive to not derail from the thread... For example, a modern pagan may see the Goddess as being everywhere and through everything and that the different "names" God(dess) has are just different aspects of the same thing or they may only recognize a masculine or feminine energy . That would be in stark contrast to any historical view of the use of those figures, since they were seen as independent individual beings. Those ideas most come from the East where Brahman represented this idea, there was no western equivalent of this idea before the "Age of Reason" where a rekindled interest in all that was pagan in the past launched off some investigations into that matter and inspired writers to re-invent paganism proper. Simultaneously, these writers were also borrowing from newly translated works in the East the concepts that seemed to make sense to them. This initial "paganism" was nothing more than a parody. It became more serious around the start of the 20th century in works like "Aradia, The Gospel of Witches" and poetic works like "The White Goddess" Anyway, it's a pretty complicated subject...

 

[The Kilted Heathen]

Most of the pantheistic ideas, eclectic pick-a-mix occultism, and ritual methods are not authentic. That's not exactly the same thing as saying they're not useful or valid, however. Also, concepts like three-fold rules are basically poor-mans karma (Eastern ideas), etc...

Ah, of course. Most of those things, though, are really only problems within Wicca and it's numerous "paths". Which is why I said earlier that Wicca is a can-of-worms; they're very hard to categorize. Yes, they are rooted in Celtic and Norse traditions with their holidays and such, but they pull from practically everything and anything, to the point where they're just a mish-mash of practices.

So far as the "God and Goddess," no other Pagan group really does that. There are gods and goddesses, but not "The" aspects of them; for example a blót wouldn't honor Thor as "The God" and Sif as "The Goddess," nor would a goði and gyðja "call down" or "play the role" of those deities; they would just be honored and sacrificed to.

This initial "paganism" was nothing more than a parody. It became more serious around the start of the 20th century in works like "Aradia, The Gospel of Witches" and poetic works like "The White Goddess"

Which is ironic, as the "Gospel of Witches" is widely recognized as complete fiction.

Most modern efforts that I've seen are rooted at earliest to the 50's, but also in the late 60's when study into Classical Paganism broke from heavy romanticism (for example, the misrepresentation of Vikings with horns on their helmets).

 

[Mindmaster]

Ah, of course. Most of those things, though, are really only problems within Wicca and it's numerous "paths". Which is why I said earlier that Wicca is a can-of-worms; they're very hard to categorize. Yes, they are rooted in Celtic and Norse traditions with their holidays and such, but they pull from practically everything and anything, to the point where they're just a mish-mash of practices.

So far as the "God and Goddess," no other Pagan group really does that. There are gods and goddesses, but not "The" aspects of them; for example a blót wouldn't honor Thor as "The God" and Sif as "The Goddess," nor would a goði and gyðja "call down" or "play the role" of those deities; they would just be honored and sacrificed to.


Which is ironic, as the "Gospel of Witches" is widely recognized as complete fiction.

Most modern efforts that I've seen are rooted at earliest to the 50's, but also in the late 60's when study into Classical Paganism broke from heavy romanticism (for example, the misrepresentation of Vikings with horns on their helmets).

I see your point, but nearly all of the pagans are Wiccans.

As far as the Gospel of Witches, it is seen as influential either way... The "modern" traditions were founded off the basis of this material in some fashion, and some people hate that fact but it is what it is. To not mention that or the other work is simply to be disingenuous. Personally, I recommend to read them anyway and see if you come up with the same ideas as the founders of the various flavors of Wicca did. I mentioned them only because they were the impetus for everything that happened after that in regard to paganism, not because I think they're 100% legit. Whether it is Celtic or Norse, all we really have is the scraps that Christianity decided to leave us.

Theurgy or channeling, to ritually be the god/ddess, is as old as Egyptian, Roman, and Greek religions. I consider it legit, even if that isn't what you do. I know how it works...

 

[The Kilted Heathen]

I see your point, but nearly all of the pagans are Wiccans.

No, no they aren't.

The "modern" traditions were founded off the basis of this material in some fashion,

No, really only Dianic Wicca even acknowledges it. Anyone outside their group (or generously, Wicca as a whole) have no use for it whatsoever.

To not mention that or the other work is simply to be disingenuous.

I've never even heard of the second book you mentioned; that should give indication as to how impacting and influential it has been across Paganism as a whole.

Whether it is Celtic or Norse, all we really have is the scraps that Christianity decided to leave us.

I prefer to view it as what traditions survived Christianity, but yes--by and large all we have to go off are remnants. This does not make everything the same as Wicca, however. Some traditions have been started independent of the earlier works of Wicca and
Theurgy.

Theurgy or channeling, to ritually be the god/ddess, is as old as Egyptian, Roman, and Greek religions.

Do you have a source to show past practices of "becoming" a particular deity for a ritual?

 

[Sundance]

In essence, yes. There are several Pagan religions that have Animistic traditions; those tend to be the ones that have truly been passed down through the centuries, though there's also a lot of fluff that pretends to be both animism and ancient. Generally, if it's hard to find, it's likely to be closer to the truth.

Noted, RP. Do you know of any examples?

With pantheism, that's a view that some Pagans hold. There's few doctrines to say that you can't hold such a view. However there are a lot of traditions that are more firm in soft or hard polytheism (soft meaning they view some gods - such as Thor and Zeus - as the same god, different culture | hard meaning they view the gods as separate and individual beings).

Interesting.

I've honestly never understood this designation. What is "earth-based"? Paganism certainly worships nature, but this isn't limited to Earth; several Pagan religions also worship gods that govern the cosmos - and even gods that reside in separate dimensions such as the Nine Realms of Heathenry (Germanic Paganism).

Whoa! I never knew that! I might have to pose a question about that concept (The Nine Realms of Heathenry).

Contrary to the notion that Paganism means "everything non-Christian", however, Paganism is Eurocentric. The only thing that this means is that core traditions and structures are based around pre-Christian European cultures; namely Germanic/Norse, Celtic, Greek, Roman, and Slavic. This does, of course, invoke a few knee-jerk objections:

Hmmmmmmm...actually this description makes a ton of sense to me, RP. I don't have any objections, here.

"What, so I have to be European to be a Pagan?"

No, of course not. Paganism has demographics all over the globe. Yet even Heathens (the term for Germanic Pagans) in Mexico worship Thor in a Norse sense, rather than co-opting the deity to an Aztec cultural expression. It's all about culture, not nationality.

I didn't know this! Cool, man! Though, as a Black person, I must say that following a Pagan or Neo-Pagan religion is bound to be met with suspicion.

"Okay, what if I also worship Kali or practice [Indigenous] American beliefs?"

As there is no dogma or rigid doctrine in Paganism, there's nothing to say that Pagans can't include the practices of other cultures. What you do is really up to you. But, I wouldn't expect to go to an official Pagan gathering and see - for example - a blót (Norse sacrificial observance) in honor of Ra or Ganesh. Heck, some of them are even picky about honoring Loki at Heathen gatherings.

I will take note of this, RP

"What if I worship European gods, but don't identify as a Pagan?"

That's fine too. Nothing says that one must call themselves a Pagan. For example, many Hellenists (Greek Paganism) aren't too fond of the term Paganism. Most use it as a term of convenience. For example, primarily I identify as a Heathen. I accept association with the term Ásatrú, but for the most part the American public knows the term "Paganism". So, should it ever come up, I identify my religion as Paganism.

I love that! I think it does a great service to the diversity of Pagan traditions.

Personally I think a lot of New Age stuff is a load of hogwash. It's people misrepresenting Asian (namely Hindu and Buddhist) and Indigenous American beliefs, and putting some holistic spin on them. It's them that we have to thank for the "what goes around comes around in this lifetime" Karma, as well as insistences on meditation and Chakras. It's seeped it's way into Paganism, but is really only implemented in Wicca. Which is it's own can-of-worm in the Paganism family..

I see. To each his own.

RP, I think your answers are quite elucidating! Thank you immensely, dude.

 

[The Kilted Heathen]

Noted, RP. Do you know of any examples?

Well in the simplist of terms, Animism is the world-view that non-human entities have spirits. So you'll find it within several religions, but rarely have I seen people who solely identify as an Animist. For example it's a crucial view for Shaman, who's practices you can find in Slavic and Germanic Paganism - and even in Celtic here and there. It is the functional basis for practices such as Berserkergang, where the warrior takes on the spirit of a bear or a wolf (Ulfheðin) to help their effectiveness in combat or stealth.

Even for New Age religions like Wicca, it's an important function for things like Spirit Animals and - as I understand them - watchtower elements.

Whoa! I never knew that! I might have to pose a question about that concept (The Nine Realms of Heathenry).

I'd be happy to answer any questions you might have. I've even got a thread specific to Heathenry; Ask a Heathen.

I didn't know this! Cool, man! Though, as a Black person, I must say that following a Pagan or Neo-Pagan religion is bound to be met with suspicion.

Only from racists, really. I've known a couple black Heathens, even; while rare (the same with Asians practicing Paganism) it's not completely unheard of. Most black non-christians that I have associated with tend to gravitate towards Afro-Haitian religions like Voudon or religions like Kemeticism (Egyptian polytheism).

 

[Sundance]

Well in the simplist of terms, Animism is the world-view that non-human entities have spirits. So you'll find it within several religions, but rarely have I seen people who solely identify as an Animist. For example it's a crucial view for Shaman, who's practices you can find in Slavic and Germanic Paganism - and even in Celtic here and there. It is the functional basis for practices such as Berserkergang, where the warrior takes on the spirit of a bear or a wolf (Ulfheðin) to help their effectiveness in combat or stealth.

Even for New Age religions like Wicca, it's an important function for things like Spirit Animals and - as I understand them - watchtower elements.

Very groovy! Wait, Watchtower elements???

I'd be happy to answer any questions you might have. I've even got a thread specific to Heathenry; Ask a Heathen.

Thank you, RP.

Only from racists, really. I've known a couple black Heathens, even; while rare (the same with Asians practicing Paganism) it's not completely unheard of. Most black non-christians that I have associated with tend to gravitate towards Afro-Haitian religions like Voudon or religions like Kemeticism (Egyptian polytheism).

I see. Racism's not something I tend to enjoy much.

I notice that as well.

 

[The Kilted Heathen]

Watchtower elements?

When I was associated with a Wiccan military group, I was able to observe their rituals and whatnot. They assigned "elemental spirits" to each cardinal direction - fire, earth, air, water - and called to them as though they were sentient. It seemed to me like this was viewing these elements as having a spiritual essence.

 

[Sundance]

When I was associated with a Wiccan military group, I was able to observe their rituals and whatnot. They assigned "elemental spirits" to each cardinal direction - fire, earth, air, water - and called to them as though they were sentient. It seemed to me like this was viewing these elements as having a spiritual essence.

Interesting. What do you, as a Heathen, believe about the elements? Do you believe they have spirits to them or some kind of spiritual essence??

 

[The Kilted Heathen]

Within Heathenry, "the elements" don't really have much of a purpose or focus. The closest that it would get are the two primordial forces of Múspellsheimr and Niflheimr. However, with some insight from the game Jotun (which was actually very accurate to Norse mythology,) I'm working on developing functions for the "Norse Elements": Fire, Ice, Sky, Earth, Stone.

But no, they don't have spirits per se, in the animistic sense. Jörð is the embodiment of the Earth, for example, but that doesn't mean that every stone has a soul. Living things like trees are a little more muddied, but they're not generally regarded as having a sentience. More a primal sense of spirit.

 

[Sundance]

Within Heathenry, "the elements" don't really have much of a purpose or focus. The closest that it would get are the two primordial forces of Múspellsheimr and Niflheimr. However, with some insight from the game Jotun (which was actually very accurate to Norse mythology,) I'm working on developing functions for the "Norse Elements": Fire, Ice, Sky, Earth, Stone.

But no, they don't have spirits per se, in the animistic sense. Jörð is the embodiment of the Earth, for example, but that doesn't mean that every stone has a soul. Living things like trees are a little more muddied, but they're not generally regarded as having a sentience. More a primal sense of spirit.

Groovy, RP. This is very informative! Thank you a ton!

 

[Callisto]

Personally I think a lot of New Age stuff is a load of hogwash. It's people misrepresenting Asian (namely Hindu and Buddhist) and Indigenous American beliefs, and putting some holistic spin on them. It's them that we have to thank for the "what goes around comes around in this lifetime" Karma, as well as insistences on meditation and Chakras. It's seeped it's way into Paganism, but is really only implemented in Wicca. Which is it's own can-of-worm in the Paganism family...

I'm quoting the above solely as one example of Wicca being misconstrued in this thread with the same fallacies rampant in the Neopagan community. The majority of what is being called Wicca is not Wicca and never was. At best, those practices are wiccanesque and what people are referencing is Eclecticism which is the largest segment of Neopagans and is a mishmash of cobbled practices taken from pagan and New Age sources, among which Wicca is frequently borrowed from. Unfortunatley, many (but not all) of these Eclectics call their practices "Wicca" when they're no more actual Wicca than they are any of the other actual sources they've taken from. This is a trend that began in the late 1980s, Wicca dates back to the 1940s.

Wicca is not a New Age practice. It's an orthopraxic, initiatory polytheistic priesthood that maintains cultus to specific tutelary deities. However, many (but not all) Neopagan eclectics do incorporate New Age influences among the Wiccan and other sources they borrow from.