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High cost of education

factseeker88

factseeker88
According to the Latest Time Magazine, the average amount a 2014 graduate owes in student loans is $33,000, 10 percent over 2013.

That's a terrible load for a young person to carry. Why Doesn't the Republican House do something about it instead of fostering false accusations and doom and gloom predictions, something they would be proud of, not just dirty politics as usual.

:yes::yes::yes:

[FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]factseeker88[/FONT]


“[FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]What we think, or what we know, or what we believe is, in the end, of little consequence. The only consequence is WHAT WE DO.” John Ruskin (1819 - 1900) [/FONT]
 

ScottySatan

Well-Known Member
University should be expensive. Look at all of the service that they provide. They babysit the children 24/7. Look at the facilities they have to maintain. The chemicals they hand out to kids in chem lab.

It's getting more expensive now because now everyone wants to go to college and they have to expand to accommodate.

Universities are now also finding themselves legally liable for more things than they used to.

I believe a partial solution is to bring back more vocational training and apprenticeships.
 

Amechania

Daimona of the Helpless
According to the Latest Time Magazine, the average amount a 2014 graduate owes in student loans is $33,000, 10 percent over 2013.

That's a terrible load for a young person to carry. Why Doesn't the Republican House do something about it instead of fostering false accusations and doom and gloom predictions, something they would be proud of, not just dirty politics as usual.

:yes::yes::yes:

[FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]factseeker88[/FONT]


“[FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]What we think, or what we know, or what we believe is, in the end, of little consequence. The only consequence is WHAT WE DO.” John Ruskin (1819 - 1900) [/FONT]

Do what?
 
A

angellous_evangellous

Guest
My education cost about $200k, give or take. I paid for about $125k of it.

So far earning that much within a reasonable amount of time looks pretty bleak.

PhD - New Testament and Early Christian Literature
MA - Religion
BA - Religion
AA - English

I'd buy $33k debt on ebay. Gratefully. Heck, I could take three of those and still come out ahead.
 

BSM1

What? Me worry?
My education cost about $200k, give or take. I paid for about $125k of it.

So far earning that much within a reasonable amount of time looks pretty bleak.

PhD - New Testament and Early Christian Literature
MA - Religion
BA - Religion
AA - English

I'd buy $33k debt on ebay. Gratefully. Heck, I could take three of those and still come out ahead.


Wow! Maybe you should have worked in a couple of welding classes :yes:.
 

StarryNightshade

Spiritually confused Jew
Premium Member
Personally, I'm for universalized education; whether K-12 or university. However, until that day comes, if ever :rolleyes:, I'll reap what I sow and pay back what I will inevitably owe in loans. Which, by the end of my (hopeful) Masters program, should be up to $60,000. :eek:
 

Whiterain

Get me off of this planet
My education cost about $200k, give or take. I paid for about $125k of it.

So far earning that much within a reasonable amount of time looks pretty bleak.

PhD - New Testament and Early Christian Literature
MA - Religion
BA - Religion
AA - English

I'd buy $33k debt on ebay. Gratefully. Heck, I could take three of those and still come out ahead.

Share you're widom with the good people of Religious Forums!

I'm sort of jaded with the american education system as well as it being
used as a tool for industries, like the military.

God damn if you have to go to war to get an education.

Prestige is understandable but it's outrageous the ridicule many professionals
may go through.
 

Valjean

Veteran Member
Premium Member
These college debts are a new thing. State Universities used to be free or nearly so.

Education is an investment. The government could make money covering college costs, in increased tax revenues alone. The post war GI bill, for example, made money.

Things went South when corporations realized they could make money from education if they could take funding out of the government's hands, privatize it, and charge what the market would bear.
 

LegionOnomaMoi

Veteran Member
Premium Member
Why Doesn't the Republican House do something about it instead of fostering false accusations and doom and gloom predictions, something they would be proud of, not just dirty politics as usual.

There are things that both parties could do, but for the most part the problem is that colleges and universities can rely on companies to require a college degree even if it is absolutely, completely, and totally irrelevant to the job. In fact, I have a friend who works for a university and whose bosses have asked her to finish her degree in women's studies so that they can promote her to higher admin positions. When I was an undergrad and would work part time for the advising department the advisors could get away with telling students to think about grad school as they had a better chance of getting a enough money from teaching fellowship, scholarship, or other venues to make close to minimum wage but have their education paid for and end up looking better on paper for a job after. Moreover, I saw large numbers of those who hadn't been in school for over 10-30 years going back to school to get a degree they didn't need to compete with those with less experience but who had pieces of paper saying they had learned something about an irrelevant topic.

For years, it has been a buyer's market for employers. They can, in general, require a college degree (along with other skills/experience that are relevant but can be set higher than needed) and find a pool of applicants meeting these from which to higher. Until companies stop requiring a college degree when none is needed and/or start taking certification courses and the like more seriously colleges/universities can demand the tuition and fees that they do and know that parents will pay, students will go into debt for years, and in general that they can depend upon people handing them absurd wads of cash for a largely worthless piece of paper.

There was a time when it looked like things might change. Vocational schools, online universities, etc., sprang up and offered a cheaper and more convenient alternative to spending 2 or 4 years getting a degree in psychology, sociology, history, classical languages, etc. However, mainstream universities fought back. They began to create continuing education colleges such as Harvard Extension school, Boston University's Metropolitan college, the online and continuing education courses offered by the University of Massachusetts at Amherst, Lowell, Boston, & Dartmouth. These offered students certificate courses, online courses/degrees, and the possibility of obtaining degrees from "real" universities. They did this before most employers were able to start taking online universities seriously and they matched the prices of tech schools offering certification but offered consumers their "name brand" ("Boston University" rather than "IT Tech", regardless of how meaningless this distinction is). As a result, they were able to maintain the fiction that they offer something superior to the burgeoning online universities and other alternatives.

At the same time, they created or contributed to free education. MIT has "channels" on iTunes, YouTube, and their own site which are videos of actual MIT courses complete with supplementary material (at least on their own site). Ivy League schools like University of Pennsylvania offer free courses via e.g., courser.org and often with the option to pay some cash to get a signed and certified piece of paper authenticating that they passed. Thus online universities had to compete not only with extension/continuing ed. colleges & programs offered by mainstream universities but also the ability to take courses for free. In other words, they now offered only a piece of paper for a huge price tag to separate them from someone who studied even more and for free. The fact that almost all degrees amount to is a piece of paper obtained solely to get a job that is irrelevant to what they learned (and often to immediately forget) continues to be ignored.

Finally, there was a time in which politicians really could have made a difference. When high schools in the US started to become popular and public, the question over what they were or should be intended for came up: should they be oriented towards vocation, or should they be designed to prepare students for university/college? Unfortunately, the side supporting the latter one. Universities/colleges are for most just really, really expensive vocational schools that don't actually teach a vocation but do require a time commitment anywhere from 4-8 times longer. The vast majority of students go to college to get a job, and the vast majority of degrees are irrelevant to any field outside of academia.

Similar problems exist elsewhere. In the UK, for example, the only real difference is that the loans are (pretty much) all from a government office.
 
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Valjean

Veteran Member
Premium Member
I say, get a trade first, then, with a means of support, go for what's interesting.
 

StarryNightshade

Spiritually confused Jew
Premium Member
I say, get a trade first, then, with a means of support, go for what's interesting.

I'm actually looking into it. I'm looking into a few Labor Unions where I live and seeing if they have any branches out where I want to go to school.
 

Alceste

Vagabond
I went to a vocational school. $15,000 for one year, which some folks at the time considered expensive for tuition. A degree would have cost much less in tuition per year, but much more over several years required to complete the program. Not only in tuition but in lost income from being in school instead of working.

As it happened, I paid my debt off in less than a year working in the industry I actually trained for. Barely anyone I know who went to university can say that.
 

ScottySatan

Well-Known Member
I went to a vocational school. $15,000 for one year, which some folks at the time considered expensive for tuition. A degree would have cost much less in tuition per year, but much more over several years required to complete the program. Not only in tuition but in lost income from being in school instead of working.

As it happened, I paid my debt off in less than a year working in the industry I actually trained for. Barely anyone I know who went to university can say that.

What was that trade, and is that still likely to happen?
 

JayJayDee

Avid JW Bible Student
Here is a documentary on the U.S. Education system. It pinpoints the problems of public education and puts the blame for the failure of the system squarely where it should be. Some things have been updated since this was released in 2010, but this was a real eye-opener to me.

It shows what happens when money is spent in the right places at the right time in a child's life.....



 
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