History reapeats itself.

[Engyo]

Honor they held higher then themselves and to others. This falls under defending whats right.

You are going to have to explain this, becasue it makes NO sense as you have stated it.

 

[it's_sam]

Others called it love, and defended in that name. This is a system and to me is a religion.

 

[LuisDantas]

Isn't it a bit too broad a statement to equate love with religion? They are not quite one and the same thing.

 

[it's_sam]

You are going to have to explain this, becasue it makes NO sense as you have stated it.

I'm not sure i could without frustrating you more. perhaps just expand on your defense and you might find what your missing.

 

[it's_sam]

It is broad though LuisDantas I'ts worldwide, and very difficult to hold as a single thought without compressing it.

 

[Engyo]

Others called it love, and defended in that name. This is a system and to me is a religion.

So the slaveowners loved their slaves; the Conquistadores loved the Inca and the Aztecs; the Crusaders loved the Arab and the Levantine; the Boer loved the kaffirs; and on and on and on?

No thanks, I'll pass on that kind of love.

 

[Duck]

I'm sorry do you know anything about WW2? Rome?? WHOA man talk about sociopath. Lets kill and murder for a mere laugh, then afterwerd we'll all go hop into a brothel and sleep with eachother after gorging ourselves to the point of bloated. FUN!

Read much christian propaganda? Rome wasn't all gladiator death matches and orgies. Or is tailgating, boozing it up at the football game and going clubbing afterward different because there aren't hookers or death involved?

As many right wingers are fond of saying, one must look at things in social context. Rome was perfectly moral, by the standards and ethics of ROME. Roman society and beliefs are not the same as those found in modern America. Which by the way wasn't very far removed in its behavior prior to 1865. I will grant that I don't know of any gladiator combat held on American soil between slaves, but slavery is slavery, it is a dehumanizing social construction and evil.

The behavior of Japan during WW2 is not that different than the behavior of other Imperialistic countries towards a conquered territory. I admit repulsive to my eyes, but the fact is, Japan was not doing anything wrong by her standards, and in fact the only real problem with Japanese Imperialism is that they were about 80 years late to the game of Empire. Or do you really think that the British behaved much differently in India? Or in Egypt? Or Iraq? Read up on the history of the United States in dealing with Native Americans? Or in the Philippines? Australian treatment of Aborigines? Hopefully you get the point.

 

[Duck]

Honor they held higher then themselves and to others. This falls under defending whats right.

Invading another country, destroying their religion and society, stealing their resources and making slaves of their people is "defending whats right"? Wow. SOMEONE has listened too much to the republican rhetoric about "preemptive war."

 

[it's_sam]

Read much christian propaganda? Rome wasn't all gladiator death matches and orgies. Or is tailgating, boozing it up at the football game and going clubbing afterward different because there aren't hookers or death involved?

As many right wingers are fond of saying, one must look at things in social context. Rome was perfectly moral, by the standards and ethics of ROME. Roman society and beliefs are not the same as those found in modern America. Which by the way wasn't very far removed in its behavior prior to 1865. I will grant that I don't know of any gladiator combat held on American soil between slaves, but slavery is slavery, it is a dehumanizing social construction and evil.

The behavior of Japan during WW2 is not that different than the behavior of other Imperialistic countries towards a conquered territory. I admit repulsive to my eyes, but the fact is, Japan was not doing anything wrong by her standards, and in fact the only real problem with Japanese Imperialism is that they were about 80 years late to the game of Empire. Or do you really think that the British behaved much differently in India? Or in Egypt? Or Iraq? Read up on the history of the United States in dealing with Native Americans? Or in the Philippines? Australian treatment of Aborigines? Hopefully you get the point.

So because the victims didn't say anything it's ok? Just let em keep on doin what they do cause in their eyes it's ok? Yes "tailgaters, and clubbing" is death and a downward spiral. The most dangerous thing to do in america is drive and how many do it drunk? How many people O.D. in clubs from drugs they "didn't know" were bad? How many women get raped at these clubs because they were enebriated and couldnt defend themselves? This is ok? Japan convincing residents on the islands they controlled to kill themselves and their family if the americans breached is ok? They told them we were going to rape and torture them uncaringly and do the same to their children and the soldiers were forced to watch them jump off cliffs and stumble upon full families sliced accross the throat. You find that to be just "a part of life"? i will always disagree im sorry.

 

[it's_sam]

Invading another country, destroying their religion and society, stealing their resources and making slaves of their people is "defending whats right"? Wow. SOMEONE has listened too much to the republican rhetoric about "preemptive war."

That was their point of view I'm just including it as a system/religion as a whole.

 

[LuisDantas]

Maybe it is just me, but I feel a bit lost in this thread. It feels like half of the things meant are not actually being said.

 

[Duck]

Maybe it is just me, but I feel a bit lost in this thread. It feels like half of the things meant are not actually being said.

Truthfully, I have to agree. I thought that I knew what I was arguing against, but apparently what I thought I was arguing against isn't what I read in the post.

I don't know, I think that I will just troll this thread for a while and see if I can decipher the argument before trying to contribute again.

 

[it's_sam]

The problem is we have no defense for the facts.

 

[LuisDantas]

Which facts? And why would we want a defense from them?

 

[Engyo]

Feels like this to me..........

 

[it's_sam]

and for me too

 

[Duck]

So because the victims didn't say anything it's ok? Just let em keep on doin what they do cause in their eyes it's ok? Yes "tailgaters, and clubbing" is death and a downward spiral. The most dangerous thing to do in america is drive and how many do it drunk? How many people O.D. in clubs from drugs they "didn't know" were bad? How many women get raped at these clubs because they were enebriated and couldnt defend themselves? This is ok? Japan convincing residents on the islands they controlled to kill themselves and their family if the americans breached is ok? They told them we were going to rape and torture them uncaringly and do the same to their children and the soldiers were forced to watch them jump off cliffs and stumble upon full families sliced accross the throat. You find that to be just "a part of life"? i will always disagree im sorry.

I have all ready said that I find these things reprehensible (behavior of the Romans, and Japanese during WW2.) but just because I find them to be so, doesn't change the fact that those societies for whatever reason found them acceptable. Most likely, had I been raised in those societies, I would be put off by any number of things done in modern America.

 

[it's_sam]

maybe your just missing where im comming from, from your perception. But it simply is in me as i stated in "proof our father is real."

His heartbeat is his people that follow the path they see. His mind is in the words of those peoples love for him and what he gave to us to explore. His feet is the conversation of his people moving and growing in its range. His body is the care his people will give to others in need. His emotions are expressed in the art we make from his glory. His eyes are the light that gives us sight, we see him as much as he see's us. We live with him as much as he lives with us, his life is real and ticking and growing along with all of us. To say this isn't real is beyond a defense, but we will try and help everyone understand.

 

[whataboutmythinking]

People have always been saying, well if you believe there is a god then prove it. That is where they are mistaken. Just because you can't prove it like you can prove that a basketball bounces by bouncing it doesn't mean you can't prove it. You can. Everybody talks about "body language", "feminine intuition". These are widely accepted ideas that there is something else out there beyond what we normally experience through our five senses and through thought or speech. Another way of experiencing god is the feeling you get when you see a beautiful sunset and are rendered speechless.

 

[it's_sam]

I have all ready said that I find these things reprehensible (behavior of the Romans, and Japanese during WW2.) but just because I find them to be so, doesn't change the fact that those societies for whatever reason found them acceptable. Most likely, had I been raised in those societies, I would be put off by any number of things done in modern America.

Japanese had a morale code of honor and still do very strictly. To me they put this above themselves and that counts as a system/religion "how i see it".