How the media failed women in 2013

[Saint Frankenstein]

The media only uses the body type that sells.

Its pretty much what it does with everything.

As if that's what people demanded in the first place. They create demand and the masses clamor for it. That's the basics of marketing.

 

[Me Myself]

Well, then the question IMO that ought to be asked is why? And how is the media complicit in pervading stereotypes in its messages?

Why the media displays what sells?

Well, for profit of course.

About stereotypes, the thing is that "the media" is not one entity.

Each individual media puts what sells.

If somene feels "diverse" and use a fat black bald woman to seek a product, most people would assume the commercial is some kind of parody.

Simply using different races would be nice though. That happens to some degree when your target tends to be more concentrated on one specific race. If not, yes, the use white, because they are the most universally liked.

Their objective is to use what will work for sales. If sexual appeal becomes more diverse ( which happens increasingly more on each generation ) you will see different races as sex appeal on ads.

 

[Me Myself]

As if that's what people demanded in the first place. They create demand and the masses clamor for it. That's the basics of marketing.

You are right, people were so unatracted to each other before media :biglaugh:

Were it not because God ordered it, Adam and Eve would have never had sex, they were just so asexual

 

[Me Myself]

As if that's what people demanded in the first place. They create demand and the masses clamor for it. That's the basics of marketing.

Ah! Wait, okay now I think I get where maybe you are coming from.

There have always been preferred body types on cultures.

Always.

There are also tendencies across cultures: the young are usually favored, the characteristics that come along from great estrogen levels or great testosterone levels for women and men accordingly too.

One in one hundred may have an exception here and there, but in general the hourglass figure is preferred and the young and also symetry, across cultures living very far away frim each other, so this are inherent biological drives in humans,

 

[Me Myself]

That's the basics of marketing.

ThIs is a grave grave misconception.

The basics of marketing are figure out what people want and then figure out how to give it to them.

Have you studied marketing in any way?

 

[Sha'irullah]

I find the video 99% pathetic and only a few points caught my eye as note worthy but the rest of it was merely complaints about the objectification of women which men somehow desire. That is like saying it is wrong to think about something you like. Men objectify women, that is that. No amount of complaining will change that.

What about women's rights? Equal pay and abortion issues? Considering that the video criticizes people for making breasts jokes I have a feeling whoever made this video really lacks any true intelligence on what qualifies as important for women's rights.

It even criticizes a video game for featuring a strip club, a game which is heavily male orientated. Nothing is wrong with any of the issues being brought up, tis sad knowing that feminism is so poisoning now.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

ThIs is a grave grave misconception.

The basics of marketing are figure out what people want and then figure out how to give it to them.

Have you studied marketing in any way?

I'm not sure why you replied in three posts. But, anyway.

I don't think you understand how marketing works in modern Western capitalist societies. Do you think that people were desiring anorexic white women as a bastion of female beauty and sexuality before the fashion industry (the heavy hitters of which are mostly a bunch of gay men and heterosexual women in the first place) marketed it to the masses as "trendy"? No. Media tells us what's "cool" or "trendy" and the people are influenced by it. You have to understand some basic mass psychology in order to succeed at it. They create both the supply and the demand. Marketing is psychology and nothing more. They implant desires into people where they weren't there in the first place.

This isn't some hidden secret. There's even been an award-winning documentary series about this issue:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Century_of_the_Self
You can watch it here: http://vimeo.com/61857758

It's a form of mind control or perception engineering, if you will.

 

[Me Myself]

I'm not sure why you replied in three posts. But, anyway.

I don't think you understand how marketing works in modern Western capitalist societies. Do you think that people were desiring anorexic white women as a bastion of female beauty and sexuality before the fashion industry (the heavy hitters of which are mostly a bunch of gay men and heterosexual women in the first place) marketed it to the masses as "trendy"? No. Media tells us what's "cool" or "trendy" and the people are influenced by it. You have to understand some basic mass psychology in order to succeed at it. They create both the supply and the demand. Marketing is psychology and nothing more. They implant desires into people where they weren't there in the first place.

This isn't some hidden secret. There's even been an award-winning documentary series about this issue:
The Century of the Self - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
You can watch it here: Adam Curtis: The Century of the Self on Vimeo

It's a form of mind control or perception engineering, if you will.

Again, have you ever studied marketing? I dont live on a oriental socialist society and I studied marketing as a western capitalist. I can understand and explain to you most of your misconceptions but I d like to know what I am working withh here.

Selecting the model of beauty in vogue now would be terribly inefficient for many media.

McDonalds would love everyone thinking fat is sexy, so would a lot of food industries.

The media adapts with times and the people. Skinnies didnt become sexy because of " "the" media" , the became sexy because of an interactive relationship between what people see and what people want to see.

Do you understand yes or no that the hourglass figure that is preferred in many or most advertisings is one that has been preferred throught cultures? Do you understand or no that most cultures find symetric to be sexier than non symetric? Do you understand the youth has been preferred to the old since ever?

I am not talking about individual desires. I love milfs, I am attracted to different skin tones too and I know of friends that prefer titless buttless women.

The general tendency cross cultures though, do you understand that it exists, yes?

It is not efficient to create a model of beauty just because.

The put a model you find sexy next to a soap so that you will like THE SOAP.

That is how advertising works. They are not putting the model there so you find that soecifical body type sexy, its a lot cheaper to FIND OUT which bodytype you like and put it next to their soap so you find THE SOAP "sexy" and go buy it.

 

[Me Myself]

The media did not create the bodytype society finds sexy.

The media used it to sell soap.

Just as it uses love, fun, guilt, etc to sell to or atract people accordingly.

Its not efficient to ignore what people find sexy today and create an entirely new sexy and THEN sell you soap. The efficient thing to do is use what people like, attach it to to soap, and sell it. Its both cheaper and more effective.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

Again, have you ever studied marketing? I can understand and explain to you most of your misconceptions but I d like to know what I am working withh here.

Selecting the model of beauty in vogue now would be terribly inefficient for many media.

McDonalds would love everyone thinking fat is sexy, so would a lot of food industries.

The media adapts with times and the people. Skinnies didnt become sexy because of " "the" media" , the became sexy because of an interactive relationship between what people see and what people want to see.

Do you understand yes or no that the hourglass figure that is preferred in many or most advertisings is one that has been preferred throught cultures? Do you understand or no that most cultures find symetric to be sexier than non symetric? Do you understand the youth has been preferred to the old since ever?

I am not talking about individual desires. I love milfs, I am attracted to different skin tones too and I know of friends that prefer titless buttless women.

The general tendency cross cultures though, do you understand that it exists, yes?

It is not efficient to create a model of beauty just because.

The put a model you find sexy next to a soap so that you will like THE SOAP.

That is how advertising works. They are not putting the model there so you find that soecifical body type sexy, its a lot cheaper to FIND OUT which bodytype you like and put it next to their soap so you find THE SOAP "sexy" and go buy it.

Boy, you really don't understand what's going on here. Do you understand mass psychology and propaganda or not? You seem to think that the masses actually have some control over the perceptions that are sold to us. Don't you ever wonder why advertising is usually based around feeding off people's insecurities? "Can't get it up and please your partner (implication: you're less of a man)?! Well, here's a pill for you!" "Don't have a hard, fit body (implication: you're an unattractive, disgusting slob)?! Well, here's a diet/pill/surgery for you!" Buy this, buy that in order to feel happy, attractive, cool, trendy and accepted. Don't want to play the game? Well, you're an outcast! You're not a slave to the hottest brands! Marketing and public relations in both politics and corporate profit is simply psychological manipulation.

Don't try to play me for a fool. I've been looking into this issue for years. You're wrong about how it works and the people who do it would laugh at your ignorance.

Read:
http://blog.hubspot.com/marketing/psychology-marketers-revealing-principles-human-behavior
Consumer Psychology - The Science of Consumer Behavior
Psychological Marketing Business Tactics: Big And Small Business Ideas
Consumer Behavior: The Psychology of Marketing
http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog...marketers-manipulate-you-without-your-knowing

Marketers today are learning how to reach down into the wiring of the brain itself, to manipulate us at a level that we do not consciously perceive and cannot control. Science has come a long way in recent decades. There is a new kind of marketing called neuromarketing that actually uses brain scans to measure how our brains react to certain stimuli. We are in danger of marketers using the information gained from these new techniques to come up with ways to sell us things and make us do things and we may in many cases be literally unable to resist.

Oh, and you mentioned fast food and obesity:

But today we have an epidemic of obesity, the result of food-company marketing. The companies have learned to literally manipulate our metabolisms to the point where many of us cannot resist overeating. When you have a third of all of our people obese and another third seriously overweight it is obvious that the problem is not "self-control." The problem is systemic and beyond an individual's ability to control. Don't we as a society have an obligation to step in and correct this?

Dave Johnson: Should We Ban Manipulative Marketing?

I wonder if negative body images in the media could have something to do with the rise of eating disorders among young people? Nah, it just can't be true!
http://www.nedic.ca/knowthefacts/scbinfluences.shtml
http://www.upi.com/Health_News/2010...eating-disorders-increase/UPI-53941291099454/

The literature confirms that children and adolescents are particularly vulnerable to messages and images conveyed through the mass media. Many children and adolescents cannot discriminate between what they see and what is real. For instance, young people are often unaware that digital technology and manipulation in the fashion industry use air brush and digital enhancement to portray the ‘ideal’ female and male body. These images promote unrealistic standards that are impossible to achieve.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2792687/


Need more information? I think I've gotten my point across well enough. You're just wrong. Very wrong.

 

[Me Myself]

Boy, you really don't understand what's going on here. Do you understand mass psychology and propaganda or not? You seem to think that the masses actually have some control over the perceptions that are sold to us. Don't you ever wonder why advertising is usually based around feeding off people's insecurities? "Can't get it up and please your partner (implication: you're less of a man)?! Well, here's a pill for you!" "Don't have a hard, fit body (implication: you're an unattractive, disgusting slob)?! Well, here's a diet/pill/surgery for you!" Buy this, buy that in order to feel happy, attractive, cool, trendy and accepted. Don't want to play the game? Well, you're an outcast! You're not a slave to the hottest brands! Marketing and public relations in both politics and corporate profit is simply psychological manipulation.

Don't try to play me for a fool. I've been looking into this issue for years. You're wrong about how it works and the people who do it would laugh at your ignorance.

Read:
http://blog.hubspot.com/marketing/psychology-marketers-revealing-principles-human-behavior
Consumer Psychology - The Science of Consumer Behavior
Psychological Marketing Business Tactics: Big And Small Business Ideas
Consumer Behavior: The Psychology of Marketing
http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog...marketers-manipulate-you-without-your-knowing
Dave Johnson: Should We Ban Manipulative Marketing?

Need more information? I think I've gotten my point across well enough. You're just wrong. Very wrong.

I have studied marketing and social communication in college. Thats pretty much all I ve studied. You have..l watched... Documentaries? Seriously?

I can see how confused you are. You are confused as to what you think I am saying what you think you know and how they both work.

Of course advertising guides us to do things, but what you dont understand is the mechanism. Otherwise, wouldnt think they "constructed" the body type all by themselves.

Again, McDonalds would love to sell you fat is sexy.

Please tell me why its not doing that and never did.

I am expecting a direct answer. Why dont all the fatty food industries start selling fat is sexy today?

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

I have studied marketing and social communication in college. Thats pretty much all I ve studied. You have..l watched... Documentaries? Seriously?

I can see how confused you are. You are confused as to what you think I am saying what you think you know and how they both work.

Of course advertising guides us to do things, but what you dont understand is the mechanism. Otherwise, wouldnt think they "constructed" the body type all by themselves.

Again, McDonalds would love to sell you fat is sexy.

Please tell me why its not doing that and never did.

I am expecting a direct answer. Why dont all the fatty food industries start selling fat is sexy today?

I updated my post. Go back and look at it. I don't care where or what you studied in college. Doesn't mean you're right, because you're not.

 

[Me Myself]

I updated my post. Go back and look at it. I don't care where or what you studied in college. Doesn't mean you're right, because you're not.

Of course you think I am wrong, you dont understand my stance. You havent even thought well yours as much as you think you have.

I made a direct question:

Why hasnt McDonalds sold you a fat bodytype as being sexy?

A lot of people avoid McDonalds specifically because they dont want to look fat, so if it was so easy, why havent they done this?

You need to think critically instead of puling documentaries I am afraid. Its good that you see them and the studies, etc, but you need to think critically too.

Please answer the question.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

Of course you think I am wrong, you dont understand my stance. You havent even thought well yours as much as you think you have.

I made a direct question:

Why hasnt McDonalds sold you a fat bodytype as being sexy?

A lot of people avoid McDonalds specifically because they dont want to look fat, so if it was so easy, why havent they done this?

You need to think critically instead of puling documentaries I am afraid. Its good that you see them and the studies, etc, but you need to think critically too.

Please answer the question.

McDonalds doesn't need to sell you a concept of "fat" being sexy, because they've already succeeded in hooking people into their brand through other techniques. Since mass society is programmed to view "fat" as ugly and horrible, it would actually be harmful for them to do such a thing. It would create cognitive dissonance. In fact, all the people shown in fast food ads are young and thin. They meet the acceptable social standard of beauty. This apparently makes people think that they can eat all the fast food they want and it won't effect their body size/shape. Like those Carl Jr.'s commercials with the "hot" blonde, skinny models acting like whores with cheeseburgers? You really think those models eat food like that? They might, but you can rest assured that they're puking it up right after! Nevertheless, we still have ended up with an epidemic of obesity in which fast food shares much of the blame.

 

[Me Myself]

McDonalds doesn't need to sell you a concept of "fat" being sexy, because they've already succeeded in hooking people into their brand through other techniques. Since mass society is programmed to view "fat" as ugly and horrible, it would actually be harmful for them to do such a thing. It would create cognitive dissonance. In fact, all the people shown in fast food ads are young and thin. They meet the acceptable social standard of beauty. This apparently makes people think that they can eat all the fast food they want and it won't effect their body size/shape. Like those Carl Jr.'s commercials with the "hot" blonde, skinny models acting like whores with cheeseburgers? You really think those models eat food like that? They might, but you can rest assured that they're puking it up right after! Nevertheless, we still have ended up with an epidemic of obesity in which fast food shares much of the blame.

GREAT! YES!! exactly!

No one will buy it. They are PROGRAMMED to think fat is ugly.

Now two more easy questions:

1-Do you think McDonalds is the only brand that is limited by what people are programmed to think?

2-Before mass media, were people being "programmed" by any other thing or people? Are people that never see mass media not "programmed" at all? Is mass media the sole director of "programming"? (Kay okay more than one ere but they are very related)

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

GREAT! YES!! exactly!

No one will buy it. They are PROGRAMMED to think fat is ugly.

Now two more easy questions:

1-Do you think McDonalds is the only brand that is limited by what people are programmed to think?

2-Before mass media, were people being "programmed" by any other thing or people? Are people that never see mass media not "programmed" at all? Is mass media the sole director of "programming"? (Kay okay more than one ere but they are very related)

Mass media is probably the biggest influence in the lives of people in the West, particularly America. But the principles of control that they make use of go back centuries. It's nothing new.

It's just that my original point was that people do not naturally desire these things. Brands/companies sell it them by using manipulative psychological techniques. That was what I was saying. When it comes to perceptions of beauty, the media certainly does have a role in shaping it. Humans are essentially herd animals and have a strong desire to fit into a larger group where their individual identity is subsumed into the whole. So they take, for example, people's natural desire to be physically attractive and mold it to fit an image that they want you to buy into. So I wasn't saying that those social standards of beauty necessarily arose organically, as you seem to interpreting that underlined sentence.

The real question is why "they" choose those specific images/models/concepts to sell people. It's very strange.

 

[Me Myself]

Mass media is probably the biggest influence in the lives of people in the West, particularly America. But the principles of control that they make use of go back centuries. It's nothing new.

.

Good! But now you probably will want to use more accurate words.

They dont "control" . They "influence" . The difference is very blunt, trust me.

Making a commercial would be extremely easy if the media "controlled" the people.

The thins is that each INDIVIDUAL( that word is extremely important there) media has a limited range of influence.

They will influence what they see as important and CONFORM what they seem as unimportant or innefficient to try to change.

As you masterfully said, McDonalds already got people hooked on their burgers by means OTHER than telling them fat people are sexy. Doing so would mean McDonalds would have to GO AGAINST ALL THE OTHER media that dont agree.

Why do other media dont agree? Well, ebcause as you said, the social standard of beauty is that fat people are less sexy.

Now, if the standard of beauty changed, it will do so by BOTH media gradual change and people's gradual change.

If the media changes tomorrow it will change back the day after that because of the ratings.

This is my point. The "media" is not evil. The media just is. Each individual media has its purposes and tries to fulfill them. Social causes and brands like dove are PART of the media and all the media generated stuff is made by people.

So, given that no individual media controls what people see as beautiful and that the collective media merely influences it (if almost all the media agree on one idea it will be a very big influence) then it ends being society, that creates this standard of beauty, through both media and individual interactions.

In short, the media is a reflection of society. If it werent, it would be dead.

It's just that my original point was that people do not naturally desire these things. Brands/companies sell it them by using manipulative psychological techniques. That was what I was saying. When it comes to perceptions of beauty, the media certainly does have a role in shaping it. Humans are essentially herd animals and have a strong desire to fit into a larger group where their individual identity is subsumed into the whole. So they take, for example, people's natural desire to be physically attractive and mold it to fit an image that they want you to buy into.

Theedia undoubtedly has a role on people's perception of beauty (and everything. Including, ironically, their perception of how "evil the media is" )

 

[Me Myself]

The real question is why "they" choose those specific images/models/concepts to sell people. It's very strange.

Follow the trend you used with the why does McDonalds not use fat be sexy models explanation .

You said the answer yourself. The media uses the

acceptable social standard of beauty.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

Follow the trend you used with the why does McDonalds not use fat be sexy models explanation .

You said the answer yourself. The media uses the

I'm more interested in why the media promotes an unrealistic standard of beauty. It's so unrealistic that it doesn't exist (Photoshopping, etc).

 

[Me Myself]

I'm more interested in why the media promotes an unrealistic standard of beauty. It's so unrealistic that it doesn't exist (Photoshopping, etc).

Because we humans promote an unrealistic standard of beauty.

For example, the most beautiful face would be oerfectly symetrical.

I dont think I need to say perfectly symetrical faces dont exist.

So the answer is simple, the socially acceptable standard of beauty is as unexistent as the "perfectly normal _____ " (family, gall, guy, marriage, sexuality, etc)

Folk sotiews talk about perfectly beautiful beings that dont exist in reality. The media is just an extension of us.