"Humans are born as atheists"

[paarsurrey]

Muslims commonly believe everyone is born Muslim.

The word "muslim" is generic, one who believes and submits to G-d or offers himself to be immersed in the attributes of G-d as a human could be immersed by obeying Him. Or the one who feels (felt) at peace or attuned, very naturally and in all the norms, in the attributes of G-d as a human could be, such a person is muslim whether he was born in the times of Adam or even before.
Regards

 

[First Baseman]

The Christian people who follow the ideology of Paul, believe Jesus a god, while Jesus himself did not believe that he was god, he could not as he was a Jew. Just to differentiate from them I write G-d, omitting the vowel.
Thanks and regards

Jesus Himself said "I and my Father are One." Yes, He did say that He is God, that's why the Jews wanted to stone Him on more than one occasion.

You are quite wrong, sir.

 

[First Baseman]

The funny part is that Paul is older than the gospels. Therefore, the concept that "Jesus is God" is older than the concept that "Jesus is not God." so, it's quite likely (since Paul was a Jew) that Jesus-as-God was a known concept while Jesus was alive.

See my post above this one.

 

[sojourner]

Human sacrifice, ritual rape, slavery... are these cultural aspects you seek to promote and/or introduce into civilized society?

Not everything European conquerors and missionaries did on those continents was good, but history does credit them with modernizing and uplifting those peoples.

It also credits them with subjugating them and committing violence against them, the results of which are still being felt today. Human sacrifice, ritual rape and slavery are no worse than mass shootings, date-rape, and systemic violence in our own country. The term "poor savages" is part of that violence, because it assumes that you are on some higher plane than they on the humanity scale, which just ain't true.

 

[viole]

Natural is very natural. Belief in G-d is very natural, not believing in G-d is artificial or man-made.
Regards

I agree. Belief in G-d, or any other imaginary agent, is a natural adaptation.

Ciao

- viole

 

[PackJason]

I am not sure. It is like saying that crying all night and throwing spaghetti sauce all over the place is the default position.

Ciao

- viole

Can can one believe in something if they have never heard of said thing? One cannot believe in something they have never heard about, therefore disbelief is the default.

 

[sojourner]

This is rapidly decaying into a greater theological debate, which can sometimes get quickly nasty. May I suggest we take a break for awhile and pray on it?

It was a greater theological debate to begin with.

 

[sojourner]

Can can one believe in something if they have never heard of said thing? One cannot believe in something they have never heard about, therefore disbelief is the default.

No, that would make "ignorance" not "disbelief" the default. One can't make a value judgment of belief either way if a thing is unknown.

 

[paarsurrey]

Doesn't matter what they believe about everyone. What matters is what everyone is able to cognate about themselves.

What is your understanding of the word "to cognate"? Please give your own understanding not from a lexicon or a dictionary.
Regards

 

[PackJason]

No, I don't "not believe in them." I simply don't know of them, so I don't know whether I might believe in them or not. Ignorance and disbelief are two completely different things.

You have a lack of belief because you have never heard of them. Maybe I should have used "lack of belief" instead of "disbelief."

But that's just semantics anyway because to be an atheist, all one needs is a lack of a belief in a god or gods.

 

[sojourner]

What is your understanding of the word "to cognate"? Please give your own understanding not from a lexicon or a dictionary.
Regards

Cognition is the function of the brain that allows learning, making value judgments, understanding, and the development of the self.

 

[Grumpuss]

It was a greater theological debate to begin with.

Oh Lordy, it can get worse though. Someone could talk about the ethics of eating aborted babies or something. One thing at a time LOL

 

[sojourner]

You have a lack of belief because you have never heard of them. Maybe I should have used "lack of belief" instead of "disbelief."

But that's just semantics anyway because to be an atheist, all one needs is a lack of a belief in a god or gods.

No, I don't have a "lack of belief." What I have is a "lack of knowledge." Belief is a function of assigning value. One can't assign value, either plus or minus, to something that is not conceived.

 

[PackJason]

Oh Lordy, it can get worse though. Someone could talk about the ethics of eating aborted babies or something. One thing at a time LOL

I already ate, but thanks.

 

[paarsurrey]

And yet people seem to have no problem with calling a baby a "Christian child" or a "Muslim child."

One aspect of "a muslim child" means not sinful by birth as the Christian would believe but innocent and normal child.
Regards

 

[viole]

Can can one believe in something if they have never heard of said thing? One cannot believe in something they have never heard about, therefore disbelief is the default.

Well, the first who believed in imaginary deities must have made them up. Otherwise, they would not have been the first.

And I doubt that we heard of gods from our fishy ancestors.

My claim is that if humanity would reboot, it would still start believing in gods. For belief in conscious agencies, when there is no evidence of them, is ingrained in our brains. For evolutionary reasons.

Ciao

- viole

 

[PackJason]

No, I don't have a "lack of belief." What I have is a "lack of knowledge." Belief is a function of assigning value. One can't assign value, either plus or minus, to something that is not conceived.

Lack of belief and lack of knowledge.

Agnostic atheist.

 

[paarsurrey]

In this case what matters is that a baby just isn't capable of believing much of anything concerning spirituality or conceiving what it is, regardless of what Muslims think about it. To think everyone is born a Muslim is just incorrect thinking.

One may like to read the post#277 in this connection.
Does it help?
Regards

 

[Grumpuss]

I already ate, but thanks.

Ha- me too. But I hope at least your lunch didn't include human fetus!

 

[PackJason]

Well, the first who believed in imaginary deities must have made them up. Otherwise, they would not have been the first.

- viole

I think the people who first made up gods were the first people trying to figure out what life and the cosmos were all about. They were not scientifically minded and saw no problems with jumping to impressive conclusions. Whoever's story sounded the best to the rest of the tribe, their story would stick and a hierarchy is started.