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I support unions, higher minimum wage and socialized medicine

MD

qualiaphile
Due to family financial issues, I have a second job working weekends at a warehouse.

It is a back breaking, blue collar and labor intensive job. I am going to probably work here for a few months to make a little extra cash and then quit. However there are guys who have been doing this for decades, many of them in their 50s. Many of my colleagues have arthritis, ligament tears and are hopped up on meds. Many of them had to go on employment insurance after debilitating injuries. Most are not in good shape because they eat cheap fast food and are overweight.

I cannot imagine doing this for so long, especially considering how labor intensive it is. I'm glad where I live there is free healthcare, the meds are subsidized and physio can be provided (although the standard of care is sub par for physio). I feel minimum wage should be even higher, especially for labor jobs. And I support unions, my job is non unionized but I would not make this a career if it was non-unionized.

As a conservative, I cannot imagine living and working in a society where everything was just based on free market economics. A state which wants the best of its citizens should reward them when they work hard. Such rewards can be in the form of higher minimum wages, socialized medicine and worker protection. This would ensure loyalty to the state as well, further strengthening it. Although competition would suffer, I think incentives can be provided to increase competition. But the overall standard of living should be raised.

Do you think fiscal politics can really be placed on the Left/Right spectrum? Or should they be classifications within their own right? Many fascist governments have had a lot of social programs, while the Democrats are actually quite capitalist.
 

Rival

Diex Aie
Staff member
Premium Member
I've been saying this since forever. For some reason people just don't get it.

I'm left economically and right socially.

These are clearly two separate issues and need to be treated so.
 

suncowiam

Well-Known Member
I'm left socially and right economically.

I'm not against social programs but the way its implemented just seems to be giving free cash out. I like to see some checks and balance to ensure that the resources are actually helping and improving the issue.

I've live through various stages of wealth. All I can say is that people will do best what is given to them. If they need to stay within a salary range to keep government housing or healthcare, then they will do so. It's almost like an artificial ceiling placed on them.
 
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MD

qualiaphile
I'm left socially and right economically.

I'm not against social programs but the way its implemented just seems to be giving free cash out. I like to see some checks and balance to ensure that the resources are actually helping and improving the issue.

I've live through various stages of wealth. All I can say is that people will do best what is given to them. If they need to stay within a salary range to keep government housing or healthcare. It's almost like an artificial ceiling placed on them.

I think there should be limits to some social programs: for example a young person, of able body and mind, should not be on welfare. There should be options for a two tier health care system as well, so that those who can afford should be able to get privatized health care.

What I guess I'm arguing for are safety nets. I make hourly almost twice as much at my day job, than I do on my weekend job. However my full time job is in an office, in an ergonomically designed chair, involving very little labor. I think I am okay with my taxes going towards safety nets.
 

Rival

Diex Aie
Staff member
Premium Member
There should be options for a two tier health care system as well, so that those who can afford should be able to get privatized health care.
This is how it is in the U.K. I think it works great.
 

metis

aged ecumenical anthropologist
Why is this in a "Conservative Only" forum as I would like to get involved as well?
 

Sha'irullah

رسول الآلهة
I am right both socially and economically :D
Raising minimum wage does post a particular issue, because of currency and its devaluation but most importantly the fact that doing so lowers the capability of smaller business. I find it unimaginable that a conservative would do something so damaging to small business.
 

MD

qualiaphile
I am right both socially and economically :D
Raising minimum wage does post a particular issue, because of currency and its devaluation but most importantly the fact that doing so lowers the capability of smaller business. I find it unimaginable that a conservative would do something so damaging to small business.

Some people cannot become owners. Some people have to work their whole lives in labor jobs for reasons out of their control. Working with some of them has been very eye opening.

A higher minimum wage can help some of them get by better. Maybe there can be exceptions made for small businesses, but most corporations could do with cutting the multi million dollar bonuses of their CEOs for the average worker.
 

Sha'irullah

رسول الآلهة
Some people cannot become owners. Some people have to work their whole lives in labor jobs for reasons out of their control. Working with some of them has been very eye opening.

A higher minimum wage can help some of them get by better. Maybe there can be exceptions made for small businesses, but most corporations could do with cutting the multi million dollar bonuses of their CEOs for the average worker.

Corporations get so many sources of income it is unfathomable, the only reason they exist is because of legal allowance of their system. To say they can afford to pay more to their employees is true but it is also true that what should be done for some should be done for all. Throw corporate powers at the free market and see how long they last.

They thrive on incompetence and can always find the Democrats to bail them out. The amount of taxes they pay along with secured jobs is why they are favorable for sources of income for social programs. Smaller business do not support this in mass, they are not centralized and piping with currency.

Your assertion of raising minimum wage is very contradictory as it is apart of a cycle. Raising minimum wage only ensures inflation. You would have to stabilize a currency before that is even fathomable. Just look at the amount of dollars removed from citizens through government programs and illegal immigration. It is absolutely ludicrous when you see it on paper.
 

StarryNightshade

Spiritually confused Jew
Premium Member
I've recently come around to supporting socialized/single payer healthcare @MD. I still am on the fence about raising minimum wage (at least to rates as high as $15 an hour). I'm neutral overall to unions. It really sucks that the American right isn't more open to socialized medicine. Oh wait, I forgot. That's statism. :p
 

TurkeyOnRye

Well-Known Member
Raising the minimum wage is a temporary solution for low income workers. Ultimately, it just devalues the wages of skilled laborers and increases inflation. The key is to increase the bargaining power of the working class. When workers have bargaining leverage, they will inevitably end up with better wages, benefits, and working conditions. The key to doing this, however, is fairly unclear. I'm a little bit skeptical of the power of unions these days. Back in the founding days of unions, they were effective, because they were composed not of payed representatives, but real workers with their balls on the line. Union representatives have little incentive to advocate for the people they represent. It's much easier to ensure that the workers you represent stay out of the bargaining process so that you can quickly settle contracts without much belly-aching.
 
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