I'm Leaving

[Heyo]

I'm making this post since I'm Staff.

Please don't PM me about staff stuff as I won't be here.

I am so, so ****ing sick of this place. It's degenerated to the point that argument based on sound logic is now being dismissed.

It's full of people who will call anyone who disagrees with the MSM a conspiracy theorist.

It's full of people who are too old to understand how much things have changed. The medium age on here must be Boomer.

It's too Woke and despises anyone who has even vaguely conservative views.

I've been called racist, homophobic and other slurs used against people like me.

I am tired of having to defend views that were considered mainstream until yesterday.

Sick of people piling on me.

Tired of the one-sided nature of this forum.

Too many rebels here as well, too many people who have come here for a kind of refuge for heterodoxy. People here cannot even define Christianity. Barely any Catholics and mainstream Protestants. Almost no Muslims.

Too many Atheists who are really here to pick on religious people.

Too many people here who despise orthodoxy simply on the basis that it's orthodox.

Too much crap and not enough critical thinking.

Take care. If anyone is bothered I'm rival25 on Discord.

I agree that the debate culture has suffered in the past month, even so I am on the opposite side of you on most issues.
You are one of the few faithful debaters on the right as well as on the religious side. And even though we usually disagree, I respect your views and the way you defend them. I hope you'll return after the climate here has cooled down.
(RF is only mirroring RL, I see increasing conflict outside also.)

 

[IndigoChild5559]

Wow I just came back here to see who had added me on Discord

I created a discord account specifically to find you there, and just was not able to navigate the site. I tried entering your rival25 name and it came back nothing. I tried adding you as a friend, and that didn't work either. I found the site highly frustrating. I assumed there would be a list of chat rooms or forums, and could find none.

 

[Rival]

I created a discord account specifically to find you there, and just was not able to navigate the site. I tried entering your rival25 name and it came back nothing. I tried adding you as a friend, and that didn't work either. I found the site highly frustrating. I assumed there would be a list of chat rooms or forums, and could find none.

Join the Religious Forums Discord Server! join here and I will add you as a friend.

 

[Rival]

(RF is only mirroring RL, I see increasing conflict outside also.)

Weird, as this is not what I see. My bf is 21 and has no issues with me being against ssm, anti-feminist, etc and just doesn't really care. If I say such things here people blow up.

 

[Augustus]

I'm making this post since I'm Staff.

Please don't PM me about staff stuff as I won't be here.

I am so, so ****ing sick of this place. It's degenerated to the point that argument based on sound logic is now being dismissed.

It's full of people who will call anyone who disagrees with the MSM a conspiracy theorist.

It's full of people who are too old to understand how much things have changed. The medium age on here must be Boomer.

It's too Woke and despises anyone who has even vaguely conservative views.

I've been called racist, homophobic and other slurs used against people like me.

I am tired of having to defend views that were considered mainstream until yesterday.

Sick of people piling on me.

Tired of the one-sided nature of this forum.

Too many rebels here as well, too many people who have come here for a kind of refuge for heterodoxy. People here cannot even define Christianity. Barely any Catholics and mainstream Protestants. Almost no Muslims.

Too many Atheists who are really here to pick on religious people.

Too many people here who despise orthodoxy simply on the basis that it's orthodox.

Too much crap and not enough critical thinking.

Take care. If anyone is bothered I'm rival25 on Discord.

Don’t go

But if you do, I wish you the best

 

[Rival]

Don’t go

But if you do, I wish you the best

Sorry man, I've had enough. I support the socially unacceptable political candidate so now I'm scum.

Hope you're well.

 

[Augustus]

Sorry man, I've had enough. I support the socially unacceptable political candidate so now I'm scum.

Hope you're well.

The thing that hath been, it is that which shall be; and that which is done is that which shall be done: and there is no new thing under the sun.

 

[SalixIncendium]

Sorry to hear you got caught up in the political fray. I, for one, will miss your presence here, not that I've been around much lately...

...and the progression of this thread pushes me closer to the precipice.​

There are those here who I feel should reflect on their perceived level of self-importance and self-righteousness and how it affects those they interact with...

...and how it will ultimately affect them.​

 

[Guitar's Cry]

Sorry to see you go, @Rival . Despite not often agreeing with you, I enjoyed your posts and perspective.

 

[ImmortalFlame]

Woke is forcing people to live in an increasingly socially left wing world where they hate the things conservatives love and seek to do. Woke hates nuclear families, it hates the social norm of heterosexuality, it seeks to include the most bizarre and deranged fetishes as socially acceptable, it tells women that being a single mom is acceptable. It seeks to destroy the very way of life of conservatives and treat us like scum.

"Woke", when used by the political right, is a slur used by weak-minded people to denigrate positions they disagree with without actually making an argument, often because they can't.

But, putting that aside, I think what's really telling here is the number of people who don't want to be on a debate forum because it happens to feature a number of people who disagree with them, and the fact that so many of those people happen to Conservative says less about the space being unfriendly to their view as much as, to me, it demonstrates a fundamental weakness in the character and opinions of those Conservatives.

Of course, I can't speak to your specific experiences. It could be that you're receiving actual abuse regularly, and if that is the case I support you leaving the space. But I don't see that from this thread, and certainly not this post. You genuinely seem to be openly admitting that you're leaving the space because not everyone agrees with you, and some - in your opinion - are a bit mean about it.

I've had fiery debates with you in the past, and I've also had fairly reasonable ones. I think, at the very least, you are a genuine person who holds to their own position, although I happen to think your positions have a fundamentally weak foundation. I don't think you're scum, but if you're this unwilling to accept the notion that people on a debate forum disagree with you, perhaps you're not as confident in your own positions as I thought you were, and perhaps debate isn't something you should be engaging in.

I wish you all the best, and hope - as with all of us - you find a space where you can grow and learn to become the person you want to be.

Sorry to see you go, @Rival . Despite not often agreeing with you, I enjoyed your posts and perspective.

The above is a more diplomatic and less verbose way of saying what I wrote above, so if you take anything away from this post (if indeed you read it at all), just take it as that.

 

[Rival]

"Woke", when used by the political right, is a slur used by weak-minded people to denigrate positions they disagree with without actually making an argument, often because they can't.

But, putting that aside, I think what's really telling here is the number of people who don't want to be on a debate forum because it happens to feature a number of people who disagree with them, and the fact that so many of those people happen to Conservative says less about the space being unfriendly to their view as much as, to me, it demonstrates a fundamental weakness in the character and opinions of those Conservatives.

Of course, I can't speak to your specific experiences. It could be that you're receiving actual abuse regularly, and if that is the case I support you leaving the space. But I don't see that from this thread, and certainly not this post. You genuinely seem to be openly admitting that you're leaving the space because not everyone agrees with you, and some - in your opinion - are a bit mean about it.

I've had fiery debates with you in the past, and I've also had fairly reasonable ones. I think, at the very least, you are a genuine person who holds to their own position, although I happen to think your positions have a fundamentally weak foundation. I don't think you're scum, but if you're this unwilling to accept the notion that people on a debate forum disagree with you, perhaps you're not as confident in your own positions as I thought you were, and perhaps debate isn't something you should be engaging in.

I wish you all the best, and hope - as with all of us - you find a space where you can grow and learn to become the person you want to be.


The above is a more diplomatic and less verbose way of saying what I wrote above, so if you take anything away from this post (if indeed you read it at all), just take it as that.

I'm too confident in them sometimes. I have discovered views I have that I consider basic fundamentals are not shared because I am a semi social darwinist and semi biological determinist, when the current trend seems to be constructivism. Half the people here are working on assumptions I just can't fathom.

But I wish I could disagree without being considered a bigot. I wish people would be happy to accept that I disagree with say ssm without telling me that is homophobic. I have been here over a decade and generally revel in debate, but I dislike the idea that now there's a socially accepted and unaccepted viewpoint.

One gets the idea that woke people think of people like me as analogous to 19th c. slave owners standing up in favour of slavery while the rest of enlightened society sees how wrong it is and one day in future everyone will come to their senses and agree with woke positions and remark at how barbaric our grandparents were and why couldn't they just see it.

It's impossible to debate someone with such a worldview because they've already decided the future belongs to them. I can't abide the idea that everything progresses to be morally better.

I can find no common ground. No one agrees even on the basics. So I've stopped trying.

I do also have some views that are genuinely controversial and I expect pushback on those, yet it seems to be the smaller issues that folks attack me over. There was a thread on here where a small majority supported allowing gay siblings having sex. I was attacked along with others for pointing out that this is depraved.

 

[RabbiO]

@Rival -

Three boards and a real life is about all I can handle. I’ve watched your journeys with interest. You still retain the qualities that are reflected in the Hebrew name Chana. I’d love a way to drop you a line every now again, to check in and see how you’re doing. Either way, just know that I am among the many who will miss you here.

Be well, stay safe, be open to all that is good.

L’shalom.

 

[Father Heathen]

Woke is forcing people to live in an increasingly socially left wing world where they hate the things conservatives love and seek to do. Woke hates nuclear families, it hates the social norm of heterosexuality, it seeks to include the most bizarre and deranged fetishes as socially acceptable, it tells women that being a single mom is acceptable. It seeks to destroy the very way of life of conservatives and treat us like scum.

Oh. So a strawman.

 

[ImmortalFlame]

I'm too confident in them sometimes.

But I wish I could disagree without being considered a bigot. I wish people would be happy to accept that I disagree with say ssm without telling me that is homophobic. I have been here over a decade and generally revel in debate, but I dislike the idea that now there's a socially accepted and unaccepted viewpoint.

I understand that, and it can be hard to see things from someone else's perspective when that perspective seems so antagonistic to you. I try to remember the name of a fallacy I read about - if there is a name for it. It's the fallacy that trying to make someone feel bad or idiotic for their position is, to a degree, irrational, because it's less likely they'll be able to come around to your way of thinking. Like, even if you or I were wrong about something, how much less likely are we to realise (or admit to) it if the other person is also calling us stupid? It would be like going "Oh yes, I agree, I'm an idiot". Vitriol is very often poison in debate for that reason.

One gets the idea that woke people think of people like me as analogous to 19th c. slave owners standing up in favour of slavery while the rest of enlightened society sees how wrong it is and one day in future everyone will come to their senses and agree with woke positions and remark at how barbaric our grandparents were and why couldn't they just see it.

All I can really say is, as a declared "woke gremlin" myself, I don't personally see it like that. I think there's always degrees, and I think the disconnect between my position and, I would assume, many people like yourself is less that you're coming at the subject from a "I want to make the worst possible world for x and y groups" position, and more just as a disagreement over HOW to make the world better, for whom, and where the fundamental axioms in our positions lie. Being a non-religious person, it's hard to understand or align my thinking with people whose axioms are fundamentally religious in nature, but I'm working on at least understanding the position and being as accommodating as I can to it. I can't speak for others, though. It could be that this isn't very common in people who think like me.

It's impossible to debate someone with such a worldview because they've already decided the future belongs to them. I can't abide the idea that everything progresses to be morally better.

I think I can see why that may seem difficult. Kind of links to the above - like, how much more likely are you to adopt someone else's point of view if that point of view also entails you accepting that your entire way of thinking, or your entire moral system, is irrelevant?

I can find no common ground. No one agrees even on the basics. So I've stopped trying.

Maybe your axioms are just difficult to relate to? There are certain religious positions which are, almost by design, difficult for people outside of that view to come to terms with.

I do also have some views that are genuinely controversial and I expect pushback on those, yet it seems to be the smaller issues that folks attack me over. There was a thread on here where a small majority supported allowing gay siblings having sex. I was attacked along with others for pointing out that this is depraved.

That does seem pretty weird. I'd be with you on that one.

At least that's one axiom we share!

 

[TagliatelliMonster]

All the best, @Rival

As for the complains about the "progression of the thread"....

I'ld just like the point out that the OP was kind of dripping with passive aggressiveness and plenty of not-so-covert verbal aggression aimed at groups of people. I'm sure plenty of people felt targeted and insulted by it.

Upon reading the OP, I already knew that people would come out and push back against it.
Let's be honest here... the OP wasn't exactly a friendly goodbye letter but rather a collection of frustration, borderline slander and great animosity aimed at unnamed people, who themselves likely know who they are.

To then use the replies as if it is "confirmation" of what the OP states, is kind of hypocrite in my opinion.
The way I see it, it's more a species of reaping what was sown.

Oh well.
I repeat: all the best @Rival

 

[Rival]

Oh. So a strawman.

This is how I experience woke.

 

[Rival]

All the best, @Rival

As for the complains about the "progression of the thread"....

I'ld just like the point out that the OP was kind of dripping with passive aggressiveness and plenty of not-so-covert verbal aggression aimed at groups of people. I'm sure plenty of people felt targeted and insulted by it.

Upon reading the OP, I already knew that people would come out and push back against it.
Let's be honest here... the OP wasn't exactly a friendly goodbye letter but rather a collection of frustration, borderline slander and great animosity aimed at unnamed people, who themselves likely know who they are.

To then use the replies as if it is "confirmation" of what the OP states, is kind of hypocrite in my opinion.
The way I see it, it's more a species of reaping what was sown.

Oh well.
I repeat: all the best @Rival

I agree to an extent, but a simple "**** off we won't miss you" would have been more honest.

Also, if those people know who they are they are better than me because I hadn't any particular people in mind.

 

[TagliatelliMonster]

I agree to an extent, but a simple "**** off we won't miss you" would have been more honest.

Also, if those people know who they are they are better than me because I hadn't any particular people in mind.

FYI, I felt targeted also. I could have easily felt insulted as well.
But I have elephant skin.

And clearly you are upset. A break at least will serve you well, I'm sure.

 

[an anarchist]

I'm making this post since I'm Staff.

Please don't PM me about staff stuff as I won't be here.

I am so, so ****ing sick of this place. It's degenerated to the point that argument based on sound logic is now being dismissed.

It's full of people who will call anyone who disagrees with the MSM a conspiracy theorist.

It's full of people who are too old to understand how much things have changed. The medium age on here must be Boomer.

It's too Woke and despises anyone who has even vaguely conservative views.

I've been called racist, homophobic and other slurs used against people like me.

I am tired of having to defend views that were considered mainstream until yesterday.

Sick of people piling on me.

Tired of the one-sided nature of this forum.

Too many rebels here as well, too many people who have come here for a kind of refuge for heterodoxy. People here cannot even define Christianity. Barely any Catholics and mainstream Protestants. Almost no Muslims.

Too many Atheists who are really here to pick on religious people.

Too many people here who despise orthodoxy simply on the basis that it's orthodox.

Too much crap and not enough critical thinking.

Take care. If anyone is bothered I'm rival25 on Discord.

Logged back in to reply to this post even though I intended on taking a longer break from participating on this site.

I want to offer advice in an empathetic nature.

I believe you either have to surround yourself with people who are either open minded (or at the very least have similar views), or you gotta keep your trap shut about what you really feel and believe.

Believe it or not, my views are more extreme than I represent on this site at most times. When the “extremeness” of my views shines through my mask, I am “piled on”.

My advice is that I wish to point out the nature of the situation. What you do? I don’t know obviously. I keep my trap shut because I want friends and want to feel like part of a community. It seems you wouldn’t want to do this though, and I commend you for it.

(Oh, I know my transition period from being a religious person to an irreligious person was full of threads created by me bashing religion. I do feel like such content can be appropriate in a site like this, but tempered and measured, which I struggle doing at time.)

We didn’t interact much, but I hope you the best regardless. Don’t worry about reciprocating the feeling.

 

[Rival]

FYI, I felt targeted also. I could have easily felt insulted as well.
But I have elephant skin.

And clearly you are upset. A break at least will serve you well, I'm sure.

I'm not breaking. I've already asked several times for my modship to be revoked. I'm replying to be cordial in this thread and when it dies I have books to read, classes to attend, and a boyfriend to shag. I genuinely hate this place. I wish the 60s Boomer people would leave and we could have some Trad Zoomers instead.