Tiberius
Well-Known Member
I'm saying that the dimensions we see are a property of the universe that we see.
Not space as we know it.
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Infinite time and space.
- Thread starter worsewicked
- Start date
I'm saying that the dimensions we see are a property of the universe that we see.
Not space as we know it.
Tiberius
Well-Known Member
Dimension is a measure of the amount of space.
What is going on in your mind? Are you disagreeing with me just to disagree? Do you actually think that something outside our universe that consists of dimensions utterly alien to us would be the same as what we see around us? Go do your own research. Start here: Dimension - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
How about infinite space?
I'm not disagreeing, I'm just not agreeing until I see evidence.
You said "not the same space" not "not the same dimension"... I don't doubt there will be objects that we don't see around us usually, how does that mean the space is different?
You seem to keep scooting off to the amount of space, I'm talking about just space itself.
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Photonic
Ad astra!
Ok, let me clear up some misconceptions.
One: 1 is imaginary when attempting to quantify something that has nothing to be compared to, 1 has nothing to represent, therefore it is 1 divided by zero. Zero isn't an actual number, but a lack of numbers. The problem here is it is more like undefined. Because it would be 1 divided by 0.
As we both know, division by zero is undefined no?
Which is why if you try to quantify time prior to the big bang, you simply end up with undefined. The multiverse theory is sometimes used to attempt to quantify spacetime prior to the big bang, by associating a common constant, this allows for representation in our own universe to quantify a mathematical model.
Also, I want to clear up one more thing. A vacuum in space is not empty, a vacuum cannot exist outside of 3(+)-space.
One: 1 is imaginary when attempting to quantify something that has nothing to be compared to, 1 has nothing to represent, therefore it is 1 divided by zero. Zero isn't an actual number, but a lack of numbers. The problem here is it is more like undefined. Because it would be 1 divided by 0.
As we both know, division by zero is undefined no?
Which is why if you try to quantify time prior to the big bang, you simply end up with undefined. The multiverse theory is sometimes used to attempt to quantify spacetime prior to the big bang, by associating a common constant, this allows for representation in our own universe to quantify a mathematical model.
Also, I want to clear up one more thing. A vacuum in space is not empty, a vacuum cannot exist outside of 3(+)-space.
Photonic
Ad astra!
You have no evidence yourself, so why bother?
Terrywoodenpic
Oldest Heretic
At the time of the "Big Bang" all space-time expanded to provide the room for matter to expand into. It continues to expand. If this is so, It can not yet have become infinite.
Matter warps space-time, it is this warping that is Gravity.
There is no reason to suppose that there can be only one universe
Matter warps space-time, it is this warping that is Gravity.
There is no reason to suppose that there can be only one universe
muhammad_isa
Veteran Member
What? How can there be space if there are no dimensions? A contradiction in terms, me thinks
In any case, you are trying to establish that there could be space / dimensions outside our universe .. no?
That's like parallel universe scenarios .. so what? So what if there were?
Does that change the universe we DO know exists in some way?
Tiberius
Well-Known Member
Sure. Show me some, then we'll talk.
Then perhaps you should go and look for yourself. I'm not going to do your homework for you. I'm not your mum.
Because the space is determined by the dimensions that make it up. If it is outside our universe, it will be made of different dimensions, and therefore will not have the same qualities. Therefore, different kind of space, or space (but not as we know it).
Get it?
Where did I talk about the amount of space when I said, "Do you actually think that something outside our universe that consists of dimensions utterly alien to us would be the same as what we see around us?"
How is that math even relevant to why time prior to the big bang you end up with undefined results? Explain a litte.
No, I do not believe in the multiverse hypothesis
Can you explain what a 3(+)-space is?
I'm not poeing, I'm not saying I'm believing the opposite. I'm waiting for you to provide evidence.
You are skirting my questions when you know exactly what I'm asking for, and then you call me a poe when I haven't even made a claim...
I have and found nothing, please copy and paste something that proves your point, or link something.
Photonic
Ad astra!
Math represents our ability to explain, if you can't model it through math, it cannot be explained.
Ever wonder why they called math the universal language?
3 represents the number of spatial dimensions, the (+) represents various theories that postulate more than 3 dimensions of movement.
Remember also, that time is the passage of events, there are no events that we know of prior to the big bang, so your concept of time does not and cannot apply.
I was following along, I understood what you basically said, but I found no reason why it equated to "time prior to the big bang is undefined" at all
Okay, thank you for your explanation on it, now I will reply to your last post:
Maybe there is a difference between space and vacuum that I'm not quite sure of then.
"That we know of" does not matter, we do not know a lot of things yet they exist.
There being no time, there be no passage of things, thus no expansion.
Photonic
Ad astra!
I was following along, I understood what you basically said, but I found no reason why it equated to "time prior to the big bang is undefined" at all
Okay, thank you for your explanation on it, now I will reply to your last post:
Maybe there is a difference between space and vacuum that I'm not quite sure of then.
My point is that your application of time isn't something that can be done without some serious changes to the definition of time as we understand it.
Application of our math simply doesn't apply, if it did we could model prior to the big bang, and not simply after it.
Why so?
What? Are you refusing to explain the reasoning behind the mathematics you used?
Photonic
Ad astra!
Time as humans define it is the passage of events, math is used to model this passage. Einstein modeled it as a dimension of forward movement that can only be measured by objects passing through it.
Our concept of time does not exist prior to the big bang except in such hypothesis that allows for something to exist outside of our universe.
I've explained myself well enough.
Why can't time exist without passing events though? Let's say no matter exists, just because nothing with mass is there, nothing is happening, doesn't mean there isn't time, just means there isn't time being recorded by a conscious being.