IRS Admits They Targeted Conservative Groups

[esmith]

It seems that the IRS has admitted targeting conservative groups.
IRS apologizes for targeting conservative groups
Tea Party rejects the apology and the House have voted to investigate.
IRS Admits to Targeting Conservative Groups - ABC News

 

[tytlyf]

I don't see the problem. The IRS was targeting "PAC's" that had certain buzz words. I could see some people abusing meaningful people for monetary gain. $arah.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Not surprising. I'm in favor of doing away with the IRS as a part of simplifying and streamlining tax laws.

 

[Revoltingest]

They also targeted Jewish groups.

It does point to the great potential for abuse when we have such an extraordinarily complex tax structure enforced by a powerful
arm of government (which can punish citizens with no trial) serving political purposes (eg, under Nixon, under Obama). Some are
OK with harassing right leaning groups, but the worm eventually terms, & the left will be back under the lash.

 

[Reptillian]

I've had nothing but good experiences with the IRS.

I would think the Tea Party and other conservatives would be worried about all the extra spending that will come from investigating the IRS.

 

[Revoltingest]

I've had nothing but good experiences with the IRS.

I've had no bad experiences at Russian roulette, but that wouldn't convince me it turns out well for all.
The IRS has been a royal pain for me, even in years I'm not audited.
But still....should we tolerate their being an enforcement arm for whichever party reigns?

 

[Reptillian]

I've had no bad experiences at Russian roulette, but that wouldn't convince me it turns out well for all.
The IRS has been a royal pain for me, even in years I'm not audited.
But still....should we tolerate their being an enforcement arm for whichever party reigns?

Russian roulette you have a sixth of a chance, with the IRS it's on the order of what...one in a half billion? We should completely overhaul how we do taxes because several people out of three hundred million get screwed over? (I'm just playing Devil's Advocate here)

 

[Revoltingest]

Russian roulette you have a sixth of a chance, with the IRS it's on the order of what...one in a half billion? We should completely overhaul how we do taxes because several people out of three hundred million get screwed over? (I'm just playing Devil's Advocate here)

1st: The odds of being screwed over by the IRS many orders of magnitude greater than 1 in 500,000,000.
2nd: The costs imposed by IRS compliance affect all who keep books & strategize for that purpose.
3rd: To simplify taxation has great benefits for all, over & above curbing the potential for political abuse.

Do you agree with Tytlyf that what the IRS did is acceptable?

 

[Alceste]

Hang on a minute - are purely political election financing groups actually tax exempt? Both those articles mention that they are not.

If I was working in an office with the responsibly for vetting applications for tax exempt status and political groups were not eligible for it, I suspect I'd be passing tea party applications up the command chain for additional scrutiny myself, along with anything else that was obviously purely political.

 

[Revoltingest]

The net was cast wider than thought.....
IRS targeted groups that criticized the government, IG report says

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Russian roulette you have a sixth of a chance, with the IRS it's on the order of what...one in a half billion? We should completely overhaul how we do taxes because several people out of three hundred million get screwed over? (I'm just playing Devil's Advocate here)

Just to throw out a few reasons to counter the devil's advocate, and why the IRS just needs to be done away with and replaced with a progressive tax that has separate rates for all income levels: it needs to be done because the best solution is almost always the most simple solution, and our tax code is anything but simple. And it's not just several people that get screwed, every single American citizen is screwed by tax laws that allow for the middle class and lower-upper and much of the mid-upper class to bear a disproportionate tax burden, while the upper-most upper class enjoys a tax rate intended for those at a much lower income level. Even plenty of corporations dodge enough taxes through various laws and loopholes to not have to pay anything.

 

[Dirty Penguin]

Has anyone read the the requirements of the 501c4? Sounds to me like all of them..Tea Party and Democrats don't really fit the requirements. I guess we'll have to wait for the report but it sounds to me as if the IRS, considering the uptick in applications, was just doing their job. Shucks....didn't they ultimately approve the majority of those requesting tax exempt status?...and wasn't it back in 2004 when they did something similar to the NAACP and a Church (can't remember all the details on those)..?

 

[Revoltingest]

Has anyone read the the requirements of the 501c4? Sounds to me like all of them..Tea Party and Democrats don't really fit the requirements. I guess we'll have to wait for the report but it sounds to me as if the IRS, considering the uptick in applications, was just doing their job. Shucks....didn't they ultimately approve the majority of those requesting tax exempt status?...and wasn't it back in 2004 when they did something similar to the NAACP and a Church (can't remember all the details on those)..?

The problem is that it appears to be selective doing of their job.
Why else did the IRS issue an apology?
GOP reaction in IRS case spurs calls for probe, apology
http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Govern...Them-Confidential-Docs-On-Conservative-Groups
Did you support Nixon's use of the IRS to target opposition too?

 

[Alceste]

The problem is that it appears to be selective doing of their job.
Why else did the IRS issue an apology?
GOP reaction in IRS case spurs calls for probe, apology
Progressive Group: IRS Gave Us Conservative Groups' Confidential Docs
Did you support Nixon's use of the IRS to target opposition too?

It's politics. You offer an apology whenever someone demands it, basically. Especially when you have a huge media contingent all banging in unison on the same drum and the optics are bad. The tail wags the dog.

 

[Falvlun]

Did you support Nixon's use of the IRS to target opposition too?

The comparison is utter BS.
For one, this had nothing to do with the president.

For two, this appears to have more to do with various difficulties in implementing the tax code regarding non-profits, particularly with the political non-exemption issue and the explosion of "political" non-profits after the Citizens United ruling, than an actual conspiracy to undercut conservatives. That it did was more a byproduct rather than the actual intention.

For three, the IRS was the one to blow the whistle on itself. They realized that this had been an issue, and had been revising their evaluation process in an effort to make it more impartial. Ooh! Such a big conspiracy!

For four, not one conservative group actually lost its non-profit status as a result of this. So, it sounds like a whole much of crying about milk that never was even spilt.

Educate thyself: Everything you need to know about the IRS scandal

 

[Revoltingest]

The comparison is utter BS.
For one, this had nothing to do with the president.

For two, this appears to have more to do with various difficulties in implementing the tax code regarding non-profits, particularly with the political non-exemption issue and the explosion of "political" non-profits after the Citizens United ruling, than an actual conspiracy to undercut conservatives. That it did was more a byproduct rather than the actual intention.

For three, the IRS was the one to blow the whistle on itself. They realized that this had been an issue, and had been revising their evaluation process in an effort to make it more impartial. Ooh! Such a big conspiracy!

For four, not one conservative group actually lost its non-profit status as a result of this. So, it sounds like a whole much of crying about milk that never was even spilt.

Educate thyself: Everything you need to know about the IRS scandal

I am more familiar with the IRS than you could ever imagine. And the issue is not so clean or benign as you present it.
You miss the point of partisan audits entirely, since it is not so much what is found, but rather the process itself.
You've never been thru a compliance audit I presume?
Tis pure coincidence that the IRS just happens to serve the needs of the party in power? Nay, whether Obama was
personally behind it (which I don't believe), he sets the tone for what happens under his administration, eg, increased
persecution of whistle blowers, increased secrecy, increased warrantless wire tapping.

 

[dust1n]

Just to throw out a few reasons to counter the devil's advocate, and why the IRS just needs to be done away with and replaced with a progressive tax that has separate rates for all income levels: it needs to be done because the best solution is almost always the most simple solution, and our tax code is anything but simple. And it's not just several people that get screwed, every single American citizen is screwed by tax laws that allow for the middle class and lower-upper and much of the mid-upper class to bear a disproportionate tax burden, while the upper-most upper class enjoys a tax rate intended for those at a much lower income level. Even plenty of corporations dodge enough taxes through various laws and loopholes to not have to pay anything.

Um... I am a little confused. If you did away with the IRS and replaced it with a progressive tax, who exactly is enforcing law and collecting taxes?

 

[Alceste]

I am more familiar with the IRS than you could ever imagine. And the issue is not so clean or benign as you present it.
You miss the point of partisan audits entirely, since it is not so much what is found, but rather the process itself.
You've never been thru a compliance audit I presume?
Tis pure coincidence that the IRS just happens to serve the needs of the party in power? Nay, whether Obama was
personally behind it (which I don't believe), he sets the tone for what happens under his administration, eg, increased
persecution of whistle blowers, increased secrecy, increased warrantless wire tapping.

These were not audits. The organizations applied for tax exempt status. The IRS had a duty to review the applications to make sure they are eligible. If they say they did a crappy job to begin with but they're trying to do a better job now, who am I to argue? If these political campaign PACs didn't want to be subjected to IRS scrutiny, perhaps they should not have requested IRS scrutiny by applying for tax-exempt status, particularly since they are apparently not really eligible for it.

I think it's really funny how conservatives assume that since the IRS was involved, it must have been an audit. Even the links in the OP don't claim anybody was audited. They were asked questions about the activities of their organizations, and the questions were obviously designed to establish whether or not campaign financing and electioneering was their primary activity (in which case they are not eligible for tax-exempt status).

 

[dust1n]

Heard it on the radio this morning. I'm suppose to feel sorry for openly political groups for not being able to register 501(c), why exactly?

 

[Mister_T]

Oh goody, one more excuse for Congress not to do anything for the next couple of years.