Is blasphemy a thought crime, which will be punished on the last day of judgement?

[XIII-Legion]

Do you agree that blasphemy is a thought crime -- or sin against God -- which doesn't require one to have said or done anything.

Therefore, do you agree that those who are guilty of blasphemy will be brought to account on the last day of judgement: For those responsible would either go to perdition or be destroyed (Revelation 20:11-15, 21:8)?

 

[Shiranui117]

Do you agree that blasphemy is a thought crime -- or sin against God -- which doesn't require one to have said or done anything.

Therefore, do you agree that those who are guilty of blasphemy will be brought to account on the last day of judgement: For those responsible would either go to perdition or be destroyed (Revelation 20:11-15, 21:8)?

We will be punished for blasphemy if we refuse to repent of it. If we repent of any one of our sins, no matter what sin it is, whether it be blasphemy, murder, adultery, denying Christ, or whatever, then we will not be punished, but rather, we will be welcomed into Heaven with more joy than if 99 righteous people without need of repentance were to enter. If we repent of our blasphemy, then God will welcome us, clothe us with a purple robe, put a gold ring on our finger, hug us, kiss us, and kill the fatted calf for us, just as in the Parable of the Prodigal Son.

 

[XIII-Legion]

If we repent of our blasphemy, then God will welcome us, clothe us with a purple robe, put a gold ring on our finger, hug us, kiss us, and kill the fatted calf for us, just as in the Parable of the Prodigal Son.

But surely, repentance means that those who're guilty of blasphemy -- or whatever sins -- have undertaken not to repeat the same ever again; otherwise, repentance would have no meaning, and no value whatsoever.

Repentance is like making a promise or new covenant to renounce our blasphemy -- or renounce whatever sins we have committed -- but unless we stick to our promise, such "repentance" will have no affect, no meaning, and no value whatsoever.

By definition, repentance is null and void by those who renege on their promise or break the covenant; which is not "repentance" as such.

 

[Shiranui117]

But surely, repentance means that those who're guilty of blasphemy -- or whatever sins -- have undertaken not to repeat the same ever again; otherwise, repentance would have no meaning, and no value whatsoever.

Repentance is like making a promise or new covenant to renounce our blasphemy -- or renounce whatever sins we have committed -- but unless we stick to our promise, such "repentance" will have no affect, no meaning, and no value whatsoever.

By definition, repentance is null and void by those who renege on their promise or break the covenant; which is not "repentance" as such.

Yes, repentance in Greek, metanoia, means "to change one's mind and heart". Repentance by its nature involves a change in ourselves. But we will never be completely free from sin in this life, for "there is no one who lives and does not sin". The most important thing is that we confess our sins and do our best not to do them again. If we do, then we get up and try again. Pope Shenouda III of the Coptic Orthodox said it best: At Judgement, God will not ask us why we sinned. He will ask us why we didn't repent.

 

[XIII-Legion]

We will be punished for blasphemy if we refuse to repent of it.

But what about atheists who refuse to believe in God?

They have every opportunity to repent up until the time of physical death.

But once they are dead, it will be too late.

According to Christianity, people will "sleep" between the time of physical death and the second resurrection.

But come the second resurrection and the hour of judgement, it will already be too late to repent.

So my contention is that people will always have the opportunity to repent up until the time of physical death; but once they are dead, it will be too late to make amends.

Come the second resurrection, such people will go to perdition or annihilation (Revelation 20:10-15, 21:8).

 

[XIII-Legion]

[...] If we repent of any one of our sins, no matter what sin it is, whether it be blasphemy, murder, adultery, denying Christ, or whatever, then we will not be punished, but rather, we will be welcomed into Heaven with more joy than if 99 righteous people without need of repentance were to enter. [...]

But surely, there must be a limit as to how much God is willing, and prepared to forgive people of their sin.

You said whatever sin will be forgiven, as long as they repent; but I am in serious doubt as to whether this is true.

Take for instance, such an example as the Nazi holocaust. Are you suggesting that Hitler will not be punished as long as he repented of his sin?

But try saying that to an Orthodox Jew, and see what happens!

As I am sure, there are many who would be offended by the inference you can make, according to what you have said.

So I would be grateful if you could clarify this point, please.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

But surely, there must be a limit as to how much God is willing, and prepared to forgive people of their sin.

You said whatever sin will be forgiven, as long as they repent; but I am in serious doubt as to whether this is true.

Take for instance, such an example as the Nazi holocaust. Are you suggesting that Hitler will not be punished as long as he repented of his sin?

But try saying that to an Orthodox Jew, and see what happens!

As I am sure, there are many who would be offended by the inference you can make, according to what you have said.

So I would be grateful if you could clarify this point, please.

If course God forgives all sins when they are repented of with true contrition. So if Hitler repented of his sins with a contrite and sorrowful heart, he could go to Heaven. God's mercy is more than His wrath.

Where are you getting this from?

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

But what about atheists who refuse to believe in God?

They have every opportunity to repent up until the time of physical death.

But once they are dead, it will be too late.

According to Christianity, people will "sleep" between the time of physical death and the second resurrection.

But come the second resurrection and the hour of judgement, it will already be too late to repent.

So my contention is that people will always have the opportunity to repent up until the time of physical death; but once they are dead, it will be too late to make amends.

Come the second resurrection, such people will go to perdition or annihilation (Revelation 20:10-15, 21:8).

That's between them and God. God knows our hearts. Part of the problem is that theists aren't representing their beliefs as well as we should. We're supposed to be loving and merciful and how much of that do you see in the world? I can understand why someone would be an atheist.

"Christianity" doesn't teach that we go to "sleep" between death and the Resurrection. The Catholic Church teaches that we when die, we are judged and then go to Heaven, Hell or Purgatory. That is the Particular Judgment. What you're referring to is the General Judgment which comes at the conclusion of all things.

 

[Windwalker]

Do you agree that blasphemy is a thought crime -- or sin against God -- which doesn't require one to have said or done anything.

Are you worried about this?

 

[XIII-Legion]

Are you worried about this?

Nope; but why should I be worried?

But people who have sinned against God (and His Son Jesus Christ) are not required to have said or done anything; but thought crime is just as much a sin as any deed or word spoken.

And it is those who are guilty of blasphemy who ought to be afraid, concerned, and worried as to what will happen to them on the last day of judgement.

 

[Windwalker]

Nope; but why should I be worried?

In my experience when I hear people ask about "though crimes", as part of some exaggerated reading of the Bible, they're worried about having committed some sin in their thoughts and the consequences to them from some punishing God.

But people who have sinned against God (and His Son Jesus Christ) are not required to have said or done anything; but thought crime is just as much a sin as any deed or word spoken.

Where do you get this from? Where Jesus said if you have lusted in your heart for another woman you have committed adultery with her in your heart? Are you mashing this up with some Orwellian 1984 concept of "Thought Crimes", where the State is actually God reading your mind and bringing you to justice?

And it is those who are guilty of blasphemy who ought to be afraid, concerned, and worried as to what will happen to them on the last day of judgement.

I find the notion of a God you must be afraid of to be quite damaging to the psyche. There are many ways to understand the "judgment" of God which are far more healthy for the mind and soul. Too many children go to bed at night afraid of a God who reads their every thought worried about how bad a person they are. It's a putrid way to live ones life and does anything but draw you closer to God.

 

[Pegg]

Do you agree that blasphemy is a thought crime -- or sin against God -- which doesn't require one to have said or done anything.

Therefore, do you agree that those who are guilty of blasphemy will be brought to account on the last day of judgement: For those responsible would either go to perdition or be destroyed (Revelation 20:11-15, 21:8)?

can you define blasphemy?

 

[Shiranui117]

But surely, there must be a limit as to how much God is willing, and prepared to forgive people of their sin.

Absolutely not. God is infinite, as is His love and mercy. If there was a limit on how much God could forgive, then this would mean that sin, a glitch and an accident in creation, would be more powerful than God.

You said whatever sin will be forgiven, as long as they repent; but I am in serious doubt as to whether this is true.

Oh, but it is. There is absolutely nothing that can separate us from the love of God.

Romans 8:38-39:
38 For I am sure that neither death nor life, nor angels nor rulers, nor things present nor things to come, nor powers, 39 nor height nor depth, nor anything else in all creation, will be able to separate us from the love of God in Christ Jesus our Lord.

Take for instance, such an example as the Nazi holocaust. Are you suggesting that Hitler will not be punished as long as he repented of his sin?

Yes, this is exactly what I am saying. If Hitler had truly repented of his sins and spent the rest of his life bitterly bewailing his sins and the consequences they had, if he had given himself over to be punished for his crimes, if he had truly undergone sackcloth-and-ashes repentance, and done what little he could to even try to start righting the wrongs he had done, then God would have forgiven him. Not just forgiven him, but hugged him, kissed him, put a ring on his finger, slaughtered the fatted calf and made a feast to celebrate his return from death and sin. And God does the exact same thing with every one of us whenever we come to Him in repentance, no matte how many times we leave Him and come back to Him. He never tires of forgiving us and welcoming us back as His beloved children. No exceptions.

The saddest story in the Gospels is when Judas despaired of his sins and hanged himself, rather than seeking forgiveness and reconciliation from His Lord. It is sadder than the Cross, because the Cross was the victory that freed us from sin and death and opened for us the way to God. It is sadder than the story of Peter denying Jesus three times, because he immediately repented and was reconciled to Jesus after His Resurrection.

But try saying that to an Orthodox Jew, and see what happens!

God is not so hard-hearted as men. Even if the entire world didn't forgive Hitler, God would welcome him as a prodigal son if he repented, and the angels would have rejoiced that so great a sinner was not lost, but realized the error of his ways and came home. It is not the will of the Father that even the least of us should perish. Not Hitler, not Judas, not Stalin. There is nobody that God wants to perish, and therefore, there is nobody and nothing that God isn't willing to forgive.

As I am sure, there are many who would be offended by the inference you can make, according to what you have said.

So I would be grateful if you could clarify this point, please.

If there are any who are offended that every single one of us has the chance to be forgiven for the absolute worst sins we can even think of, then let them be offended. The way of bitterness and hatred is not a fun road to walk on. It destroys us.

 

[XIII-Legion]

If course God forgives all sins when they are repented of with true contrition. So if Hitler repented of his sins with a contrite and sorrowful heart, he could go to Heaven. God's mercy is more than His wrath.

Yes, I agree that Hitler can be redeemed; but not for the reasons you gave.

Basically, we have to understand that Jesus Christ will be God's supreme judge and executioner on the last day of judgement (John 5:22).

Hitler can be redeemed, if for no other reason than the fact Jesus wasn't among the victims of the holocaust.

However, I am not sure whether God would forgive all sins, even if a sinner were to repent of his sins with true contrition; which is on the basis of Romans 1:20.

Assuming this verse is true, then we ought to understand that God is made manifest by observation of the natural world, human societies, and the rules created by Man.

Although a criminal is entitled to appeal the death penalty, such appeal will not always be successful; and God's invisible nature is reflected by what we can observe in the Creation; which includes the rules of human society.

Therefore, we know that contrition will not always be successful to commute one's death penalty at the final judgement; since Jesus is God's sole appointed judge and executioner on the last day.

But since Jesus is a hundred percent human we know that the Son will exercise discretion within certain guidelines as regarding who should live, and who should die on the last day of judgement.

There is a certain degree of arbitrariness in the way that justice will be served at the final judgement; which is to be expected, since Jesus is human as much as other people are also human.

However, that's not to say that the rule of law doesn't exist in God's kingdom; but there is considerable leeway for Jesus to exercise discretion as to who should live, and who should die on the last day of judgement.

Just like the Enabling Act of 1933, which was the legal basis of the Third Reich. Such legislation gave Hitler almost unlimited powers to rule by decree, as defined by the rule of law.

Likewise, Jesus will have considerable autonomy, and will exercise discretion as regarding who should live, and who should die on the last day of judgement.

At this point, I must say that the only real difference between Hiter and Jesus (who is the God of this universe) is the fact that Hitler preemptively executed countless millions of innocent people who never so much as saw him; but Jesus would only execute those who've gone out of their way to provoke him for no apparent reason.

Therefore, I would tend to disagree with your assertion that God will forgive anyone who is willing to repent with true contrition; as we know that such death penalty cannot, and will not always be commuted to a lesser penalty.

Like it or not, the God of this universe is like a dictator who will forever rule with an iron fist and velvet glove. (Revelation 20:11-15).

 

[XIII-Legion]

If there are any who are offended that every single one of us has the chance to be forgiven for the absolute worst sins we can even think of, then let them be offended.

Yes, I agree with what you've said; but in practice, the death penalty cannot always be commuted to a lesser penalty (Revelation 20:11-15).

Jesus Christ will be God's sole appointed judge and executioner on the last day of judgement; so it's no good telling me that God would still "forgive the absolute worst sins we can think of"; as God does not judge anyone, but has delegated all judgement and authority to the Son (John 5:22).

So then, do you presume to know God better than Jesus Christ the Son of Man? (John 14:6)

 

[XIII-Legion]

can you define blasphemy?

Blasphemy is impious utterance or action concerning God or sacred things.

 

[XIII-Legion]

I find the notion of a God you must be afraid of to be quite damaging to the psyche.

But you speak for yourself. Who said I'm afraid of God? (John 14:6)

Too many children go to bed at night afraid of a God who reads their every thought worried about how bad a person they are. It's a putrid way to live ones life and does anything but draw you closer to God.

But do you presume to know God better than Jesus? (Genesis 25:23)

Like it or not, the God of this universe is a ruthless dictator who will forever rule with an iron fist and velvet glove; and there's nothing you can do about it (Deuteronomy 6:15; Revelation 20:11).

 

[Shiranui117]

Yes, I agree with what you've said; but in practice, the death penalty cannot always be commuted to a lesser penalty (Revelation 20:11-15).

Jesus Christ will be God's sole appointed judge and executioner on the last day of judgement; so it's no good telling me that God would still "forgive the absolute worst sins we can think of"; as God does not judge anyone, but has delegated all judgement and authority to the Son (John 5:22).

So then, do you presume to know God better than Jesus Christ the Son of Man? (John 14:6)

1: Jesus is God.

2: Those who know the truth and turn their backs on it in favor of the false religion of the Beast cannot be brought back, because they scorn what they know to be the way of salvation in favor of the way of destruction. God cannot forgive those who refuse to be forgiven.