Is European Christianity becoming more of a Godless religion?

[Aly Millard]

Hear me out, I have a few personal views why this may be true, no matter how much of an oxymoron the title is...

First of all, I am English so feel more comfortable talking about European Christianity as all we get over here about America is Hannity and Bill O'Reilly (not good for you...).

Anyway, the whole point of the Christian God is to be put above all others in life and to always think about him before yourself. Now, in the secular society that is Europe which apparently has a percentage of religious people at around 55% of which only around 30% attend church regularly and worship, people are beginning to think about the people around them more. No longer do the Christians of England care for their God, they hold others around them and their happiness above his. Latest example is the push for legalisation of Gay marriage (the most recent being in Ireland). People in America would think this unacceptable, not because they hate gays, but because they like to choose which parts of the Bible can be modernised. E.g. you wouldn't stone your daughter for having sex before marriage any more... In Europe, it seems the people have taken into their own hands the responsibility of updating the Bible to make it more inclusive for everyone in society. Is this a good or bad thing for you Christians? For non-believers, what do you think about what I said? Are American's kinder and more tolerant than we think you lot are?

As always, I respect people for who they are, no hate intended.

 

[jeager106]

We Americans are more kind and tolerant than Europeans think we are.
We are also more modern, more intelligent, better looking, specially American
women. We have more spendable cash, work harder, invent more, are better
educated, more sincere and have the National Football League!
You can have Obama.

(kidding of course)

 

[Unveiled Artist]

I honestly dont know. America has a deep rooted discrimination that minorities can see but majorities dont experiece but look from the outside. Were political in everything; and, religious wise, we try to seperate religion and government. Yet, the government allow gay marriage (which is good) but hide it under words like "civil union."

With the Bible, it is more groups than government that chose. Episcopalian allow woman priest and I think gay marriage. Catholic, Othorodox, Baptist,JW, etc wont have it. People pick from the bible a lot. America has always been involved in our affairs even though they say they are democrats.

Hear me out, I have a few personal views why this may be true, no matter how much of an oxymoron the title is...

First of all, I am English so feel more comfortable talking about European Christianity as all we get over here about America is Hannity and Bill O'Reilly (not good for you...).

Anyway, the whole point of the Christian God is to be put above all others in life and to always think about him before yourself. Now, in the secular society that is Europe which apparently has a percentage of religious people at around 55% of which only around 30% attend church regularly and worship, people are beginning to think about the people around them more. No longer do the Christians of England care for their God, they hold others around them and their happiness above his. Latest example is the push for legalisation of Gay marriage (the most recent being in Ireland). People in America would think this unacceptable, not because they hate gays, but because they like to choose which parts of the Bible can be modernised. E.g. you wouldn't stone your daughter for having sex before marriage any more... In Europe, it seems the people have taken into their own hands the responsibility of updating the Bible to make it more inclusive for everyone in society. Is this a good or bad thing for you Christians? For non-believers, what do you think about what I said? Are American's kinder and more tolerant than we think you lot are?

As always, I respect people for who they are, no hate intended.

 

[Aly Millard]

We Americans are more kind and tolerant than Europeans think we are.
We are also more modern, more intelligent, better looking, specially American
women. We have more spendable cash, work harder, invent more, are better
educated, more sincere and have the National Football League!
You can have Obama.

(kidding of course)

And there I was thinking us Brits were the sex idols of this world that everyone aspired to be like... Just saying, American girls are not as good looking as British women. You may have the image of what we call a chav in your mind but believe me, they are a small percentage of out population. Also, our education system is ranked higher than yours sooooooo.............. Also we invented football (soccer). We are crap at it but we can still claim we invented it which is the important thing... That's what we tell ourselves anyway

I hope this turns into a fully fledged debate about which Country is better, I would be chuffed to bits if that happened

 

[jeager106]

Yeah well we have a 2nd Amendment to our constitution thus a huge civilian
arms market.
We loose more Americans to violence than your country.
Of course Brits aren't allowed to own butter knives either.

 

[Aly Millard]

Yeah well we have a 2nd Amendment to our constitution thus a huge civilian
arms market.
We loose more Americans to violence than your country.
Of course Brits aren't allowed to own butter knives either.

Well we have a variety of political parties running for government that each have a high chance of having influence over the party in power. Everyone's voices are hear. We don't need knives, if we fight we do it old-style; with fists. At least we have the ability to support our own weight with our natural legs as we aren't so fat. We also have free health care meaning you are never alone. We have schemes that make it almost impossible to be homeless on our streets if you accept the help on offer and the poor are respected as much as the rich even though out society is very class driven as we truly appreciate the mess we would be in without them. This gives us the Liberalistic views that so make our country so accepting to people of all backgrounds races and that we shouldn't treat the less wealthy as dirt.

 

[Sultan Of Swing]

Hear me out, I have a few personal views why this may be true, no matter how much of an oxymoron the title is...

First of all, I am English so feel more comfortable talking about European Christianity as all we get over here about America is Hannity and Bill O'Reilly (not good for you...).

Anyway, the whole point of the Christian God is to be put above all others in life and to always think about him before yourself. Now, in the secular society that is Europe which apparently has a percentage of religious people at around 55% of which only around 30% attend church regularly and worship, people are beginning to think about the people around them more. No longer do the Christians of England care for their God, they hold others around them and their happiness above his. Latest example is the push for legalisation of Gay marriage (the most recent being in Ireland). People in America would think this unacceptable, not because they hate gays, but because they like to choose which parts of the Bible can be modernised. E.g. you wouldn't stone your daughter for having sex before marriage any more... In Europe, it seems the people have taken into their own hands the responsibility of updating the Bible to make it more inclusive for everyone in society. Is this a good or bad thing for you Christians? For non-believers, what do you think about what I said? Are American's kinder and more tolerant than we think you lot are?

As always, I respect people for who they are, no hate intended.

It's not a case of modernising some parts of the Bible etc., the sentence of stoning was of the Law to show the severity of sin, Jesus fulfilled this, there is no indication it's meant to be a law for future governments to come (indeed, Jesus stopped the stoning of the woman). The prescription against homosexual acts was re-asserted by Paul, so it's not picking an obscure reference from the Old Testament but just following what he considered had continued. (This does not speak on the legality of said issue, however, which is a different matter, just thought I'd clear up the 'modernising' bit.)

And I'd say it's a bad thing when Christians no longer have a grounding for themselves and choose to adapt whatever they believe to the subjective moral whims of modern society.

 

[metis]

One's Jewish and/or Christian approach to religion will be highly influenced by how we may look at the Bible. If one considers divinely inspired and inerrant, they'll likely have a different approach than one who sees the Bible as being more "human" than "divine".

 

[Riverwolf]

Hear me out, I have a few personal views why this may be true, no matter how much of an oxymoron the title is...

First of all, I am English so feel more comfortable talking about European Christianity as all we get over here about America is Hannity and Bill O'Reilly (not good for you...).

Anyway, the whole point of the Christian God is to be put above all others in life and to always think about him before yourself. Now, in the secular society that is Europe which apparently has a percentage of religious people at around 55% of which only around 30% attend church regularly and worship, people are beginning to think about the people around them more. No longer do the Christians of England care for their God, they hold others around them and their happiness above his. Latest example is the push for legalisation of Gay marriage (the most recent being in Ireland). People in America would think this unacceptable, not because they hate gays, but because they like to choose which parts of the Bible can be modernised. E.g. you wouldn't stone your daughter for having sex before marriage any more... In Europe, it seems the people have taken into their own hands the responsibility of updating the Bible to make it more inclusive for everyone in society. Is this a good or bad thing for you Christians? For non-believers, what do you think about what I said? Are American's kinder and more tolerant than we think you lot are?

As always, I respect people for who they are, no hate intended.

Well... a lot of our country's religious history is rooted in the puritanical churches getting away from you guys. I'm all for freedom of religion, but I honestly share the sentiment about puritanical attitudes even though not the method of its expression at that time.

But perhaps as a result of that, the "secular state" that is the US somehow does secularism far worse than you guys over the pond who have state churches. I seriously have no idea how that happens.

When it comes to the US and "tolerance", a lot of the ... problems, when compared to European countries, probably stem from the fact that our country is just geographically bigger. As a result, we have a massive amount of diversity, enough to probably fill all of Europe, but because we're all one country, we tend to think of whatever culture we grew up in as "America", rather than... "San Francisco Bay Area", in my case. The overall culture of Northern California very tolerant compared to, say, the Bible Belt (itself consisting of many subcultures).

"Kinder", however... no, people are pretty mean here, in California, at least. Especially when driving.

 

[abdulmanafyunus]

Agreed @ jeager106, Americans are more tolerant than Europeans.

 

[metis]

"Kinder", however... no, people are pretty mean here, in California, at least. Especially when driving.

Reminds me of a comment I made several decades ago when at a religious conference. The presenter asked how can we tell if what's being preached is having any effect, and my response was "Yes, watch how the parking lot empties out".

 

[A Vestigial Mote]

I wish the religious peoples of America (speaking mostly about the Christian majority here) were more accepting, and less judgmental - they're supposed to be, even according to their own explanations of the tenets of their faith. I don't ever really see this though. Especially on the topic of homosexuality. Their minds become completely closed due to the fact that it conflicts with a few biblical references possibly taken out of translational context improperly. "It's a sin." is all I hear - but they never, ever sincerely take a look at the actual thing they are condemning and draw a conclusion on their own. I'm sure the reasons vary from person to person, but I believe the over-arching reason is fear of some kind. Of what I have no idea. Retribution from God maybe? Though they aren't the ones "sinning".

I've argued the point on behalf of homosexuals many times - though I myself am an extremely avid heterosexual, and from my male perspective honestly can't understand what men see in other men... ever. But the arguments I've had always end up with me handily refuting every point they attempt to make from a logical/reasoning standpoint using my own logic/reasoning, and then them turning to the passages of The Bible that hint at, or mention homosexual behavior being wrong in some way. I'll never get over the look on a Christian's face as they feel the need to start a sentence with "If you believe The Bible...". They absolutely hate saying that... in all the conversations with their fellow Christians it's always assumed, so it comes across as the most uncomfortable thing in the world for them.

In the end I feel The Bible does need modernizing - in all sorts of ways. It's been done in the past and claimed to have been handiwork "inspired by God", so why not now?

 

[amorphous_constellation]

First of all, I am English so feel more comfortable talking about European Christianity as all we get over here about America is Hannity and Bill O'Reilly (not good for you...).

America's sort of a big place but isn't Europe culturally more diverse? I don't really know if you can speak for the Orthodox or the Catholic countries that might still see it a little differently. I might bet on America becoming secular before some places in Europe do.

 

[metis]

Studies that I have seen still show that most Europeans do still believe in God or Gods, but many don't feel a need to affiliate with any particular branch, and many others don't just accept without question what the Abrahamic traditions teach about God.