What it says is what it says, you are welcome to interpret it in whatever way most comforts you
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Is Evolution the cause of all evils that we are witnessing in the world?
- Thread starter MrIntelligentDesign
- Start date
What it says is what it says, you are welcome to interpret it in whatever way most comforts you
PruePhillip
Well-Known Member
Yes, the Covid virus has evolved so fast our vaccines are having trouble keeping up.
Causing evil all right - about five million dead.
I prefer just applying it correctly.
Even if it doesn't comfort me.
I prefer just applying it correctly.
So you apply not what is written but what to want to be written. Fair enough, please inform me what you think is correct. I would be very interested
I can repeat it again. (I know these things have a cycle)
As Christians we believe that Jesus is the perfect expression of God in as much as He only said and did what he saw His father saying and doing.
There is a principle that we all understand:
Mark 3:24 And if a kingdom be divided against itself, that kingdom cannot stand.
To create good and create evil is a divided Kingdom...
There is another principle we all understand:
"but sin is not imputed when there is no law." - I believe the Autobahn has no speed limit. There is no law.
But if you were to establish a speed limit of 100mph... you have, in essence, created evil. You didn't "create the evil yourself" but you create the parameters of what evil is.
The person who does the wrong actually created the expression of evil. The law created the parameters of evil
And I don't, i have seen the hypocrisy of Christian perfect expression. Been on the receiving end of it, and i know plenty more, including on this site who have experienced similar "perfect expression"
I am not interested in irrelevance and apologetics, just in the passage you contradicted, Isaiah 45:7
So the bible is wrong, god didn't create evil. Whatever makes you comfortable.
Notice your error. You equated imperfect Christians with the perfect Christ. The only end you receive from Jesus (signature) - is love.
Forgiveness will help in this case (I understand what Christians are capable of doing)
7 I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the Lord do all these things.
So... applying the simple principle - when you delineate peace, you know what evil is. He doesn't create "the evil" - He created the guidelines so that we now know what evil is. Same with light.
So... whether I am comfortable or not, I just apply it correctly. (It could even make you uncomfortable in some cases)
Who said christ was perfect? Oh you did, not me, in my book he was a terrorist who was given a terrorists execution.
You think? How about christisns forgiving disability?
Whst do you not want to understand about the part i bolded?
The bible says otherwise.
Nope, you apply it as suits you, not as it is written
Christianity will never make me uncomfortable again.
Sgt. Pepper
All you need is love.
Apparently, Jesus understood the true meaning of Isaiah 45:7 because it's written in the Bible that he said, "Do not be afraid of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul. Rather, be afraid of the One who can destroy both soul and body in hell" (Matthew 10:28). If the Bible is accurate, then that doesn't sound like a message of love to me, unless Jesus was mistaken or lying.
BrightShadow
Active Member
What makes you think - I think it was created? Boomerang right back at ya!
I was asking the OP because he said IDer commanded us to love one another and then he implied - in the absence of IDer - love would be absent as well. The world will remain with hate and anger! So I asked the OP - if IDer is absent then where did the hate and anger come from? In other words - why love cannot exist the same way?
What is IDer in your opinion?
Tinker Grey
Wanderer
It's when a thought occurs to you.
Sgt. Pepper
All you need is love.
That's typically true for many Christians, though. The parts of the Bible they like and agree with are "inspired by God," and the parts they dislike and disagree with are not inspired by God but rather mistranslated or merely written by men. As a matter of fact, there's an active thread in the Religious Debates forum going on right now about how the whole Bible is not from God. The fact is, Christians can't even agree with each other about what the Bible says. They continuously bicker, insult, belittle, and argue with each other over what they believe the Bible actually teaches. Disunity and dissension are the norm among Christians, and that's perfectly evidenced by the fact that there are Catholics, Orthodox, and Protestants who all believe differently about the Bible. And within Protestantism, there are varying denominations and literally hundreds of churches that push their interpretation of the Bible. The irony in this is that Christians have the nerve to tell unbelievers that the Bible is "God's Word" and that Christianity is the only true religion in the world.
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Audie
Veteran Member
Why do you ask who created something if you
don't think it was created?
There are over 45,000 (close to 50k) different sects of Christianity. There hundreds of different translations of the bible. Each sect interprets the bible they favour in the way that makes their sect unique. Many of then say they are the only true religion and the members of all otherr Christian sects are wrong and going to hell.
It is the most fragmented religion there is.
BrightShadow
Active Member
Why do you think that I can't ask if something is created while believing or not believing if it was created?
What do think he meant by IDer? Where do you think the OP ran away to?
Sgt. Pepper
All you need is love.
Exactly. I've seen this happen on RF many times when a Christian is arguing with other Christians about a topic relating to Christianity.
Subduction Zone
Veteran Member
And Christians hate it when a person quote mines the Bible at them. Even though they do that all of the time. For them "but it is different when I do it because I believe it" seems to be a rational argument to them.
Well guess what? I believe the Bible too. It says at least 12 times "there is no God".
His intention was to create conflict, and he chose to do so by calling his religion a religion of love and evolution evil. He is a fine example of the love his religion has to offer. Do you see any love there? He dropped a bomb and disappeared. As far as a hornets nest, what he got was valid rebuttal, for which I for one thank him. These kinds of threads are an excellent opportunity to put false claims to the lie.
Maybe you saw my reply at #7 describing what love is in Christianity in response to the OP claims about his god being the source of love. I wouldn't start a thread like this one in reverse (claiming how harmful Christianity is and how much more loving humanists are), but I'll make that argument in rebuttal in threads like this one. If that's the hornet's nest to which you refer, then you are correct. Think of it as like an immune system, the OP the infection, and the hornets nest the neutralizing immune response, or the clotting cascade and the skeptics are the platelets and coagulation cascade responding to the bleeding laceration.
And the explanation rejected ad infinitum. Simply asserting it again does no more to make your case than it did last time. Skeptics don't take their opinion of what scripture says or means from believers. Believers have an agenda to promote their religion, not to give a neutral, disinterested interpretations of scripture. The skeptic decides for himself that when a deity is tri-omni, everything that follows is both to its credit and blame as appropriate. That deity is also omni-responsible. We don't require a scripture saying that God creates evil any more than we need to tell us that God creates good or anything else. That's a necessary conclusion derived from the tri-omni premise.
It is neither necessary nor desirable for the skeptic to twist scripture, but it is necessary for the apologist. Humanism values truth. Religions value growth. Humanism isn't a business.
The one who made "evil" possible and humanity as it is would be responsible for it. Those are also humanist values. They're the values of the law as well, as when somebody leaves their car running with a case of beer in the front seat and a teenager goes joy riding drunken and kills somebody. Both the thief and the one enabling him will be held responsible if legally adult.
Trump will probably try this defense if things get that far. Like the apologists for the biblical god, he will claim that the chaos and violence that followed his speech on the Ellipse was not his doing or responsibility. The insurrectionists "created the expression of evil." All he did was make it inevitable, like the fall in the Garden.
EDIT: almost immediately after posting, I saw this and thought of this discussion:
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Sgt. Pepper
All you need is love.
Christians will often use the Bible to defend themselves or to defend the Bible itself, and that is a circular argument. Most Christians will say something like, "I know I am right about the Bible because I have the Holy Spirit who guides me and helps me understand it" or "You're an unbeliever, so you can't understand the Bible because you don't have the Holy Spirit giving you spiritual discernment." There is a scripture (1 Corinthians 2:14) that some Christians will quote as a means to justify their pious attitude towards unbelievers who quote the Bible at them. The problem is that Christians typically claim to be guided by the Holy Spirit when it comes to the Bible, but they disagree on biblical interpretation. They can't even agree with each other on whether salvation in Christ is conditional or not.
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Audie
Veteran Member
Who knows. You answer a simple q with questions.Why do you think that I can't ask if something is created while believing or not believing if it was created?
What do think he meant by IDer? Where do you think the OP ran away to?