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Is Higher Education over-priced?
- Thread starter Sunstone
- Start date
Alceste
Vagabond
Yes. Higher education should be tax funded, like public school. Scandinavia seems to do fine with that. I don't think it's ethical to load up teenagers with tens of thousands of dollars worth of debt based on a dodgy promise they'll be able to get good jobs because of it. I hardly know anybody who actually works in a field they actually studied, or earns enough to fork over a pile of cash to the bank every month.
I think student debt and medical debt/insurance are two of the largest sources of the increasing financial equality in the United States.
Today, it takes tens of thousands of dollars of student debt and a degree to achieve a comparable purchasing power to a skilled but non-college-educated worker from several decades ago. It seems clear that we're hitting a time period, probably for the first time, where children should not expect to have a somewhat easier go at things than their parents did.
Skwim
Veteran Member
Well, it's a trade off. Tax funded schools = higher taxes, and guess who gets to pay those.
Who promises is that?
Alceste
Vagabond
Everybody pays taxes, including young people. Well educated young people theoretically make more money, and pay more taxes. We don't mind employing them to learn how to kill people and loading them up with tax funded guns. I don't see why educating them should be a controversial idea.
Skwim
Veteran Member
And, of course, it isn't a matter of educating anyone, but who shoulders the burden of paying for it. You? You want to pay more to educate someone else's kids so they can make french fries?
Alceste
Vagabond
Sure. I'd pay more taxes for a free university education. I didn't go because I didn't want any debt, or to use up my parents' savings, and because school was excruciatingly boring and I thought uni would be more of the same. If it had been free I would probably have given it a try. In retrospect, I probably would have enjoyed it. Certainly not having a degree (in anything) limits the types of jobs I can go for. Sometimes as a temp I haven't even been able to apply for the job I'm doing already because that box isn't ticked.
Over-priced? No, not really. Mostly utterly useless? Yes. There is no reason for most people to study for 4 years to obtain a degree they will use next to nothing of (and forget most of what they were taught) just to get a job. Most jobs should not require a college degree. The university system began as a way to train priests. Then it became a place for philosophers/scientists to delve into the inner-workings of nature. Now it is a way to be in debt for years just to get a piece of paper that says you took a lot of classes which have nothing to do with what your job is. Higher-learning was supposed to be for those who wanted to pursue topics that normal people couldn't care less about because they are sane (e.g., spending centuries arguing over whether or not the future tense entails fatalism). It is not designed for the modern workplace or even for the modern world. I fully support vocational programs and high school education systems that aren't designed around preparation for college but rather the basic tools (logic, critical thinking, analysis, and how to obtain information to study some topic) needed or useful for everybody.
I thought school was boring, but really enjoyed Uni. And I have 2 degress, neither of which are of any use for the industry I'm in, so if you want an Aussie degree, and are happy to change your name to 'Dave', let me know.
I'd say higher ed in Australia is over-priced, but not to the degree it seems to be in some other countries (eg. USA)
I think this is important. :yes:
It isn't so much about if college is over-priced. It's the ROI. What is the value of a college education in today's economy? What is the value of a degree in the arts, earth sciences, and humanities if we expect the economy to show job growth most often in industries like petroleum energy (which is becoming more scarce), finance, and military weaponry and aircraft?
It sucks to ask that because I've taught at three different universities as an adjunct to bright young hopeful adults for a while now in the arts.
If by "over-priced" we mean increasingly unaffordable to the shrinking middle class in my country? Yes. This is common knowledge.
If by "over-priced" we mean education is not worth valuing? No.
If by "over-priced" we mean education is not worth valuing? No.
Alceste
Vagabond
Good point. It's not that it costs too much, it's that our payment model allows banks to exploit the optimism of the young for private profit, discourages debt-averse youth from pursuing higher education and entrenches wealth inequality.
Makes sense to me.
The reason degree oriented educations are so over-priced at many schools is that there are students & parents willing to pay that much. And this is only part of the cost for state schools, for which we pay hefty hefty taxes on top of tuition & fees....the voters have spoken. So prestigious schools can spend money on Taj Mahal buildings, rain making professors, non-teaching research, & spendy sports teams staffed with semi-student pro athletes. We might not like the results of market forces, but they rule here.
A friend did something very cost effective. He skipped the degree route, & just took courses related to his business. He made money while he studied, & acquired no debt. Education should be about learning thing of value...not piling up letters after one's name.
The cost of tuition, along with most other essential things, has risen dramatically in the last 30 years. The question is why? Especially in light of the fact that it doesn't appear that we are producing any smarter or better prepared adults.
Essentially, the cost has increased because colleges have discovered that the demand was greater than the supply and that people were willing to eat the cost, regardless of the price tag, due to the hope, and later, the certainty, that it was a necessary expenditure if they wanted to go anywhere.
I'd be in favor of more public funding, via scholarships and grants, as well as some intervention in lowering the prices back to reasonable levels. I think college should be very selective--- not everyone should expect or need to go to college. The workforce needs to re-normalize, and not expect or require a college education for a sales position, factory position, mechanic position, lab rat position, etc.