Is Islam actually closest to the faith of Abraham proper of the three Abrahamic religions?

[Ingledsva]

The Bible says that Abraham was called out of his father's house in Ur in the land of Sumer, to go to the land of Canaan/Israel where he was to worship only one God, the one who called him. It never suggests Abraham viewed God as a father figure, a feature of both Judaism and Christianity.

Some believe that he came from Ur (India) of the (Cauldevans)(Cauldees), rather then Ur of the Chaldees.

According to ancient historians the Hebrew were from India!
"Megasthenes, who was sent to India by Seleucus Nicator, about three hundred years before Christ says that the Jews 'were an Indian tribe or sect called Kalani...'" (Anacalypsis, by Godfrey Higgins, Vol. I; p. 400.)

"...These Jews are derived from the Indian philosophers; they are named by the Indians Calani."Josephus (37 - 100 A.D.), (Book I:22.)

"The tribe of Ioud or the Brahmin Abraham, left the Maturea of the kingdom of Oude in India and, settling in Goshen, or the house of the Sun or Heliopolis in Egypt, gave it the name of the place which they had left in India, Maturea." (Anacalypsis; Vol. I, p. 405.)
****

The bible states that Abraham came from "Ur of the Chaldeans."
"Chaldean,"could be from Kaul-Deva (Holy Kauls), (Cauldevans) not meaning ethnicity, but the title of an ancient Hindu Brahmanical priestly caste who lived in what are now Afghanistan, Pakistan, and the Indian state of Kashmir.

The bible also states that Ishmael, son of Hagar, and his descendants lived in India. "...Ishmael breathed his last and died, and was gathered to his kin... They dwelt from Havilah (India), by Shur, which is close to Egypt, all the way to Asshur." (Genesis 25:17-18.)


*

 

[Sabour]

Have you even looked into Trinitarianism or is this just your bias talking because all you've given to me as an arugment is some silly math problem that doesn't even apply.

Let me quote you two verses from the bible,

Numbers 23:19 God is not human, that he should lie, not a human being, that he should change his mind. Does he speak and then not act? Does he promise and not fulfill?

Acts 2:22 "Men of Israel listen to this: Jesus of Nazareth was a man accredited by God to you by miracles, wonders and signs, which God did among you through him, as you know."

"Monotheism" is defined by the Encyclopædia Britannica as belief in the existence of one god or in the oneness of God.

Now tell me on that basis, doesn't saying that Jesus peace be upon him was god destroy the concept of monotheism?

 

[Ingledsva]

The Messiah is not God. He is sent by God.

Completely different.

Tom

No kidding. The Hebrew Messiah is supposed to be a special HUMAN of the line of David. That is why I said this -

"Well, to be fair, they believe Jesus is the awaited Hebrew Messiah.

But indeed, - that doesn't make him part of any trinity.

No trinity mentioned anywhere, not even in the NT."


*

 

[Ingledsva]

You could say that 'trinity', an extra biblical term, is a created description that actually describes a monotheistic belief that has manifestations of one deity.

It isn't in the Bible because they didn't believe that. They believed in ONE God.

*

 

[Desert Snake]

I don't see how it could be monotheism when the claim is (according to the Council of Chalcedon) that the Son became both God and man in perfect union, but clearly this isn't true of the Holy Spirit or the Father.

I don't know what council you are talking about, doesn't really matter, monotheism in the context of different manifestations is still monotheism.

 

[Desert Snake]

It isn't in the Bible because they didn't believe that. They believed in ONE God.

*

Again, the 'believed', like there is no real Xian belief. Can't argue with that, Xianity is whatever you say it is, despite people telling you otherwise, we can end the discussion here.

 

[Thana]

Let me quote you two verses from the bible,

Numbers 23:19 God is not human, that he should lie, not a human being, that he should change his mind. Does he speak and then not act? Does he promise and not fulfill?

Acts 2:22 "Men of Israel listen to this: Jesus of Nazareth was a man accredited by God to you by miracles, wonders and signs, which God did among you through him, as you know."

"Monotheism" is defined by the Encyclopædia Britannica as belief in the existence of one god or in the oneness of God.

Now tell me on that basis, doesn't saying that Jesus peace be upon him was god destroy the concept of monotheism?

Nope.

 

[Sabour]

Nope.

I am afraid you need to redefine monotheism or reject the verses I quoted.

 

[Ingledsva]

There is no one plus one, There is only One. Just because you don't understand it doesn't give you the right to go spouting your ignorance. Have you even looked into Trinitarianism or is this just your bias talking because all you've given to me as an arugment is some silly math problem that doesn't even apply.



If you think of Jesus as the Jewish Messiah, Then yes it does talk about Jesus concerning the Salvation of Israel.

Saying people whom don't agree are ignorant, isn't fair. It does not - no matter how many times Christians say it does, - fall under monotheism.

This is not a concept of different aspects, of one god, where he morphs into one aspect, for a specific occasional appearance, or purpose.

This is two different beings at the SAME TIME. Jesus prays to his father.

This is not monotheism.

Also - The Jewish Messiah is supposed to be a special HUMAN from the line of David. Ask them.

*

 

[Ingledsva]

Again, the 'believed', like there is no real Xian belief. Can't argue with that, Xianity is whatever you say it is, despite people telling you otherwise, we can end the discussion here.

The Bible says NOTHING about a Trinity.

This Trinity idea is brought in by the word of MAN, - later.

*

 

[Thana]

Saying people whom don't agree are ignorant, isn't fair. It does not - no matter how many times Christians say it does, - fall under monotheism.

This is not a concept of different aspects, of one god, where he morphs into one aspect, for a specific occasional appearance, or purpose.

This is two different beings at the SAME TIME. Jesus prays to his father.

This is not monotheism.

Also - The Jewish Messiah is supposed to be a special HUMAN from the line of David. Ask them.

*

Then why do the people who actually study and decide these things, Call Christianity Monotheistic?

 

[columbus]

Because they are heavily invested in an ancient heresy. So they don't want to do the math or read the Bible.

Tom

 

[Ingledsva]

Then why do the people who actually study and decide these things, Call Christianity Monotheistic?

Because there is a huge block of Christians saying it, and others whom don't want to offend them.

*

 

[Desert Snake]

Because there is a huge block of Christians saying it, and others whom don't want to offend them.

*

I'm not Xian, I'm just telling you what the concept actually is, you don't have to even use the word 'trinity', many *xians don't/

*Or Jesus believers

 

[Thana]

Because there is a huge block of Christians saying it, and others whom don't want to offend them.

*

Ah, I see. The scholars just don't want to offend. You know, because they have no integrity or intellectual honesty or even respect for their own work.

Maybe scientists only say things because they don't want to offend.
Maybe they bury evidence and just go with the flow.

I'm kind of embarrassed for you.

 

[Ingledsva]

I'm not Xian, I'm just telling you what the concept actually is, you don't have to even use the word 'trinity', many *xians don't/

*Or Jesus believers

I am well aware of what the concept is.

None the less, as shown, it does not fall under Monotheism.

If ONE GOD morphed himself/herself into ONE other shape, for a purpose - that would still be Monotheism.

But TWO beings at the same time - is not.

*

 

[Desert Snake]

I am well aware of what the concept is.

None the less, as shown, it does not fall under Monotheism.

If ONE GOD morphed himself/herself into ONE other shape, for a purpose - that would still be Monotheism.

But TWO beings at the same time - is not.

*

What you are referring to is a specific type of trinity belief, that is only applicable to some Xians, and even they calls themselves monotheistic officially.

 

[Ingledsva]

Ah, I see. The scholars just don't want to offend. You know, because they have no integrity or intellectual honesty or even respect for their own work.

Maybe scientists only say things because they don't want to offend.
Maybe they bury evidence and just go with the flow.

I'm kind of embarrassed for you.

You can be as nasty as you wish, - and it still won't turn two separate beings at the same time (jesus praying to God,) into Monotheism.

The Abrahamic idea became Monotheism. Christianity is not.

Now, if they go back to what it actually says - Jesus as the awaited HUMAN Messiah, - sent from God, - then we are back to Monotheism.

*

 

[Desert Snake]

You can be as nasty as you wish, - and it still won't turn two separate beings at the same time (jesus praying to God,) into Monotheism.

The Abrahamic idea became Monotheism. Christianity is not.

Now, if they go back to what it actually says - Jesus as the awaited HUMAN Messiah, - sent from God, - then we are back to Monotheism.

*

Jesus said that He was in the father, and the father in him. Because it is the same Deity.
The father manifested as Jesus via the Spirit, there aren't 'two deities'.

 

[Thana]

You can be as nasty as you wish, - and it still won't turn two separate beings at the same time (jesus praying to God,) into Monotheism.

The Abrahamic idea became Monotheism. Christianity is not.

Now, if they go back to what it actually says - Jesus as the awaited HUMAN Messiah, - sent from God, - then we are back to Monotheism.

*

I'm not being nasty, I'm just exasperated at your audacity.
It's ironic that Theists are called the delusional ones who spin the truth.

Look, The fact is, Christianity is Monotheism whether you like it or not.
You can have your opinion, Of course, But your opinion is not fact.