Is Jesus Christ God?

[Isaiah Torres]

I dont believe you can be a father to yourself or son to yourself. I can change my apparance and look like an alian but I wont be my own daughter or my own mother. Likewise, man or spirit, that is still God's son.

I just know the Creator has a son (as you are his son or daughter). He chosen Jesus at his baptism telling folks "this is my son" (a person not just flesh) with whom I am well pleazed.

Saying Jesus is just tthe flesh of god is like saying mary is just a vessel of christ. It belittles that they, Jesus specifcally, are actual people not just flesh. He, in heaven, on earth, and in heaven again will always be the son of his father.

Not two gods. One father. One son. One spirit.

with God all things are possible! the Father made as body & named that body after himself (Jesus Christ)I never said Jesus was just the flesh of God I said Jesus is God.. but when he was down here on the earth he was God and man..but now he is just God,and there is bible to prove all that.. & righhht Amen! there is not two gods its One God One Son and ONE Spirit and Jesus Christ is that one and only one

 

[Unveiled Artist]

with God all things are possible! the Father made as body & named that body after himself (Jesus Christ)I never said Jesus was just the flesh of God I said Jesus is God.. but when he was down here on the earth he was God and man..but now he is just God,and there is bible to prove all that.. & righhht Amen! there is not two gods its One God One Son and ONE Spirit and Jesus Christ is that one and only one

I can hear your passion way over hear next door to me.

I understand what you are saying. It is not logical in what I read and experienced. I have to change computers to better reapond. But you get my gist. It doesnt matter if you believe Jesus is the Father or he has a father. Christians make things soo complicated.

Hold a sec

 

[djhwoodwerks]

Not two gods. One father. One son. One spirit.

And Who does the Bible say is the Father?

Isa 9:6 (ESVST) 6 For to us a child is born, to us a son is given; and the government shall be upon his shoulder, and his name shall be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace.

 

[djhwoodwerks]

I understand what you are saying. "It is not logical in what I read and experienced." I have to change computers to better respond. But you get my gist. It doesnt matter if you believe Jesus is the Father or he has a father. Christians make things soo complicated.

This comment is why people don't/can't believe what the Bible says! "It is not logical in what I read and experienced."

Pro 3:5-6 (ESVST) 5 Trust in the Lord with all your heart, and do not lean on your own understanding. 6 In all your ways acknowledge him, and he will make straight your paths.

It seems people think of God as existing in the same time and space we are bound to. God exists outside of time and space, He "CREATED" time and space, how can He be bound by it? If we would take God out of the box we tend to keep Him in, we would be able to see Him as the God He is!

 

[Isaiah Torres]

This comment is why people don't/can't believe what the Bible says! "It is not logical in what I read and experienced."

Pro 3:5-6 (ESVST) 5 Trust in the Lord with all your heart, and do not lean on your own understanding. 6 In all your ways acknowledge him, and he will make straight your paths.

It seems people think of God as existing in the same time and space we are bound to. God exists outside of time and space, He "CREATED" time and space, how can He be bound by it? If we would take God out of the box we tend to keep Him in, we would be able to see Him as the God He is!

Amen!

 

[djhwoodwerks]

Jesus lasted 3 years on earth after claiming to be the "SON" of God. How long do you think He would have lasted if He claimed to be God Himself?

Think about it, how many of you if put in a position to save million's of people with a one time sacrifice would send your only son? Would you not go and do it yourself, or would you be a coward and send your child?

What kind of God would we have if He said, "I need to send a once for all sacrifice to save "MY" people. But I'm not going to go, I'll send My Son and I'll sit here where it's safe and just watch."

Something to think about!

 

[Unveiled Artist]

This comment is why people don't/can't believe what the Bible says! "It is not logical in what I read and experienced."

Pro 3:5-6 (ESVST) 5 Trust in the Lord with all your heart, and do not lean on your own understanding. 6 In all your ways acknowledge him, and he will make straight your paths.

It seems people think of God as existing in the same time and space we are bound to. God exists outside of time and space, He "CREATED" time and space, how can He be bound by it? If we would take God out of the box we tend to keep Him in, we would be able to see Him as the God He is!

I can feel your compassion for this subject; and I am not a Christian. I did not leave Christianity for not understanding and bad experiences (to brush up on what you bolded). I had wonderful experiences at the Church.

On that note of experiences and understanding, how do you know and believe what you do if you one, do not lean on your understanding on what God told you and when you have a god-related experience, you shove it aside and say maybe "this can't be god.. no, can't lean on my experiences."

1.. How did youu come Christ if you do not lean on your understanding and your experiences?

There are zillions of gods. There are many religions. There are many worldviews. If you cannot rationalize what is the truth and what is not and you don't use your experiences with God to judge this, how do you know what you believe is true?

How do you know that what you are reading is from God? I read a lot of scriptures that are from God but how do you rationalize that as a Christian that these things come from the God you believe in without actually understanding what your ead and trusting your understanding is from God?

2. Have you had experiences from God that you have not trusted because you don't want to lean on your experiences but from God's? Isn't that the whole thing about being a Christian is not to follow God as a slave

but have a relationship with Him?

How can you have a relationship with anyone if you are a slave-both in mind and in experience--to the person you say you are with? What type of relationship is that without your understanding of it, your tranaslation of it, based on god--which cannot happen withouy your experience of Him?



I actually thought about these questions yesterday about some denominations who actually tell people not to lean on their understanding and experience. That verse, to them, translate as "you should be a slave to god" not a friend. Not a believer. Not a Christian.

It puts iron in the other person's tongue. It makes people evangalze as if they are winning people by telling their evangalizee they are wrong.



Read this in full. This really got me. Many seekers who want to know Christ who are told not to trust themselves (to find and hear god) and not to trust their experiences (so, they ignore them) wont find Christ. Instead, with your Christ's love,....

anyway, I was going to type and essay, lol. If you read it, you got my point.

 

[Unveiled Artist]

And Who does the Bible say is the Father?

Isa 9:6 (ESVST) 6 For to us a child is born, to us a son is given; and the government shall be upon his shoulder, and his name shall be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace.

The Father has no name. To give him a name is, in my point of view, direspectfful. You can say I AM.
wait.

I already said from my study and experience, what you are saying does not add up. I see nothing wrong with one person thinking Jesus has a Father and another saying Jesus Is the Father.

How does that mess up their eternal destiny?

 

[Unveiled Artist]

@djhwoodwerks and @Isaiah Torres

Here is a full thread I did about this topic. Other than that, there is not much else I can say.

http://www.religiousforums.com/thre...ing-views-same-scripture.174861/#post-4205044

 

[djhwoodwerks]

@Carlita Jesus said, "IF" you abide in my "WORD" you are truly My disciples and you will know the truth and the truth shall set you free."

What do you think Moses was thinking when he was stuck between the Red Sea and Pharaoh?
What do you think Abraham was thinking when God told him to kill his only son?
What do you think Joshua was thinking when God told him to march around the walls of Jericho blowing trumpets and shouting?

Do you think they leaned on their own understanding or experience's, or did they trust in the Lord with all their hearts?

 

[Unveiled Artist]

What is the purpose of having a relationship with god (seeking to understand/gaining it, and experience with who you are with) if rather be a slave to him instead?

I would do a thread on this but no believer would reply.

 

[Unveiled Artist]

@Carlita Jesus said, "IF" you abide in my "WORD" you are truly My disciples and you will know the truth and the truth shall set you free."

What do you think Moses was thinking when he was stuck between the Red Sea and Pharaoh?
What do you think Abraham was thinking when God told him to kill his only son?
What do you think Joshua was thinking when God told him to march around the walls of Jericho blowing trumpets and shouting?

Do you think they leaned on their own understanding or experience's, or did they trust in the Lord with all their hearts?

It's not an "or" question, though. Your understanding is not isolated as a christian. So whatever you interpret and understand in your faith, you have that from god. Same as experiences.

When you say "lean not on your understanding" to me thats saying, dont lean on god. You basically said dont trust yourself. Which that makes up you your understanding and experience. Its a marriage. If comes crom god, so be.

So that phrase never made sense to me.

EDIT

Abraham loved god. He wasnt a slave to him. For example, when he (I think?) Was actually negoticating with god of not killing good peoplenin Sadaam. If he didnt lean on his understanding (use logic of saving the good people), and didnt go off his feelings of empathy for these people, they would be dead just as the bad people. God listened to him like a son and father.

Not a slave to master.

-

Moses was not a slave to god. He actually told god he didnt have the mental strength to do as god wanted him. I think his brother spoke for Moses instead. Moses didnt just follow blindly. He knew his limit. "Asked/begged" for permission for his brother to do his job etc."

I stoped reading at Joshua.

Understanding and experiences arent bad. In christianity, where do you think they come from?

 

[djhwoodwerks]

What is the purpose of having a relationship with god (seeking to understand/gaining it, and experience with who you are with) if rather be a slave to him instead?

Jesus is both Father and King. He is our Father, but we are members of His Kingdom. We are to serve Him as obedient servants of His Kingdom. I don't know if you are married or not, but, isn't a husband and wife also servants to each other? If the husband asks the wife to do something for him, isn't she being a servant in doing what he asks? Same way if a wife asks her husband to do something, is he not serving her? We do it out of love, not because we have to, but because we want to. No one is forced to be a servant of God, we do it by choice because we love Him because He loved us first.

Think about the Queen of England, she is the Queen of a kingdom and she has sons. She is their mother, but also their Queen. Does she rule over them as a mother or as a Queen?

 

[Unveiled Artist]

Jesus is both Father and King. He is our Father, but we are members of His Kingdom. We are to serve Him as obedient servants of His Kingdom. I don't know if you are married or not, but, isn't a husband and wife also servants to each other? If the husband asks the wife to do something for him, isn't she being a servant in doing what he asks? Same way if a wife asks her husband to do something, is he not serving her? We do it out of love, not because we have to, but because we want to. No one is forced to be a servant of God, we do it by choice because we love Him because He loved us first.

Think about the Queen of England, she is the Queen of a kingdom and she has sons. She is their mother, but also their Queen. Does she rule over them as a mother or as a Queen?

Your view of servant is how I see slavery. Different background and worldview.

If I am married, I am a friend to my spouse. There is no heirachy. This is with any marriage. Both partners should help each other there is no heirachy or one leveled authority in a marriage.

Likewise with parenthood. In my upbringing, we had authority and we also had freedom to serve without punishment (depending on if the action might set the houe on fire!) We were never grounded for anything. That is how I see a family, helping each other and being dependent on each other. Age, status, whatever, shouldn't have anything to do with it.

I have a coworker who treats her child ever sense he was young as an adult. She let him weighed consequences of his actions for himself and he became a better and insightful twelve year old boy because of it. She took out the common, stereotypical (and true in some parts of our culture) master/servant relationship that many African Americans have in their family with actually Mother and Child. They took out servant and replace it with, I dont know, help.

I would never be a servant to god. That is like my being a prisioner. No. I would want to be with him. I rather have a relation-ship. So, our definitions are different.




I never understood "lean not on your own understandings/experiences". Id have to read the Bible in context again. Listening to some Christians who say it makes me cringe. Where do you think those undernstandings and experiences come from? If from God, then why not lean on them? If not, then some parts of you are not from God? Is this a metaphor?

 

[Unveiled Artist]

Acually, this is a question for all:

How you interpret or where do you get "lean not on your understanding and experiences"? I know its in the Bible. If that is true, where do you think those undernstandings and experiences come from? If from God, then why not lean on them? If not, then some parts of you are not from God? Is this a metaphor?

 

[Isaiah Torres]

Your view of servant is how I see slavery. Different background and worldview.

If I am married, I am a friend to my spouse. There is no heirachy. This is with any marriage. Both partners should help each other there is no heirachy or one leveled authority in a marriage.

Likewise with parenthood. In my upbringing, we had authority and we also had freedom to serve without punishment (depending on if the action might set the houe on fire!) We were never grounded for anything. That is how I see a family, helping each other and being dependent on each other. Age, status, whatever, shouldn't have anything to do with it.

I have a coworker who treats her child ever sense he was young as an adult. She let him weighed consequences of his actions for himself and he became a better and insightful twelve year old boy because of it. She took out the common, stereotypical (and true in some parts of our culture) master/servant relationship that many African Americans have in their family with actually Mother and Child. They took out servant and replace it with, I dont know, help.

I would never be a servant to god. That is like my being a prisioner. No. I would want to be with him. I rather have a relation-ship. So, our definitions are different.




I never understood "lean not on your own understandings/experiences". Id have to read the Bible in context again. Listening to some Christians who say it makes me cringe. Where do you think those undernstandings and experiences come from? If from God, then why not lean on them? If not, then some parts of you are not from God? Is this a metaphor?

Well see we werent made for ourselfes the bible says we were mad for His(Gods) glory..so whatever we do wether we like it or not wether it seems like slavery or serving or not..glory to God ima do it God being my helper and if it sounds like slavery the saints have to be the happiest and most peacful and beautiful slaves that ever walked the fave of the earth

 

[Unveiled Artist]

Well see we werent made for ourselfes the bible says we were mad for His(Gods) glory..so whatever we do wether we like it or not wether it seems like slavery or serving or not..glory to God ima do it God being my helper and if it sounds like slavery the saints have to be the happiest and most peacful and beautiful slaves that ever walked the fave of the earth

I do not see relationships that way. I would never be a servant to god with that worldview. If God does not consider me a friend; I have no reason to be a friend to him. That is my morals. I cannot say you are wrong if your Bible actually says that. I go by life or nature or however it is named. There is no hierarchy in life. We make that. We take care of our young, animals included, and have that authority; but unlike humans, animals don't "section off" who gets what treatment (say blacks compared to whites) and who does not. There is no status discrimination. No "gay rights compared to God's rights" or anything like that. It is pure.

That's where we should learn from. I don't see God as an entity as someone I would learn from. If I used the word God, it would be for life; because that is what or who (whatever) I am devoted to. Nothing more and nothing less.

 

[NathanShepard8888]

Jesus is God and he was the Son

Jesus was not talking to himself in the garden. He asked the Father who is "greater" than him to find another way.

 

[Isaiah Torres]

Jesus was not talking to himself in the garden. He asked the Father who is "greater" than him to find another way.

His flesh, Jesus the human was talking to his Spirit, Jesus the Spirit and that flesh was the Son and the Spirit is God but either way its still Jesus

 

[NathanShepard8888]

True Christians are suppose to have the spirit of God. This does not mean we can become God. Jesus made sure that before he ascended he made known "I go to your God and my God."