Is Kali the Hindu equivalent of Satan?

[Terese]

Not Kali Maa, but Kali the demon, who reigns this Kali Yuga. He resides in places of pestilence and debauchery, and will be Lord Kalki's enemy in the far future. My question should be disproved, as a being like Satan can never exist in reality where God is all. Is he a metaphor of ignorance? Or a real being?

 

[Kapalika]

Hello answer from the woods which I reside right now. I will say that kal mom is like the Hebrew Satan in that she tests evil. In Hebrew the Satan is the Venom of God. Likewise Kali Ma is a Slayer of demons. I cannot see what about calling the demons but calling The Mother kali will have similarities to the Jewish Satan which is the Venom of God As she is likewise a tester and killer of demons I could answer more but I must preserve my phone's life for i am in the woods somewhere

 

[Terese]

Hello answer from the woods which I reside right now. I will say that kal mom is like the Hebrew Satan in that she tests evil. In Hebrew the Satan is the Venom of God. Likewise Kali Ma is a Slayer of demons. I cannot see what about calling the demons but calling The Mother kali will have similarities to the Jewish Satan which is the Venom of God As she is likewise a tester and killer of demons I could answer more but I must preserve my phone's life for i am in the woods somewhere

Not Kali Maa, but Kali the demon, who reigns this Kali Yuga. I am a Hindu. I'm completely aware that she is no asura.

 

[atanu]

Not Kali Maa, but Kali the demon, who reigns this Kali Yuga. He resides in places of pestilence and debauchery, and will be Lord Kalki's enemy in the far future. My question should be disproved, as a being like Satan can never exist in reality where God is all. Is he a metaphor of ignorance? Or a real being?

Goddess kAlI and epoch (yuga) kali are different, the latter being a time period when ego rules. Other yugas are Satya, Dwapar, and Treta.

 

[Terese]

Goddess kAlI and epoch (yuga) kali are different, the latter being a time period when ego rules. Other yugas are Satya, Dwapar, and Treta.

But the Kali Yuga is called such because of the demon Kali.

 

[निताइ dasa]

I think Kali represents all the vices that will inflict the people of Kali Yuga as the time goes on (hence by Kali yuga literally translates to the age of Kali). He is personified often as an entity (we see in Bhagavatam that Pariksit Maharaj fought again kali, which resulted him getting cursed, and that was how Bhagavatam manifested). I don't think he is a satan figure though (because satan implied an entity who rivals God, and even Kali simply completes his role under the will of Sri Krsna). You should see some of the predictions in Bhagavatam about Kaliyuga...they are so dead accurate sometimes(I will try and post select verses)

 

[Terese]

I think Kali represents all the vices that will inflict the people of Kali Yuga as the time goes on (hence by Kali yuga literally translates to the age of Kali). He is personified often as an entity (we see in Bhagavatam that Pariksit Maharaj fought again kali, which resulted him getting cursed, and that was how Bhagavatam manifested). I don't think he is a satan figure though (because satan implied an entity who rivals God, and even Kali simply completes his role under the will of Sri Krsna). You should see some of the predictions in Bhagavatam about Kaliyuga...they are so dead accurate sometimes(I will try and post select verses)

And what is Kali's role? Thank you for considering to post some verses from Srimad Bhagavatam.

 

[Kapalika]

I am aware you spoke of the demon but I am only aware of the mother so I spoke on the similarities between the Hindu mother and the Hebrew Accuser . There are some similarities between the two but up the demons I cannot speak much because I have no experience with that

 

[निताइ dasa]

And what is Kali's role?

I guess Kali is simply a product of the deteriorating values/morals of society. Maybe the Puranas used him as a way to explain this deterioration?

Anyway found the Bhagavatam verses...ready?


dāmpatye ‘bhirucir hetur
māyaiva vyāvahārike
strītve puḿstve ca hi ratir
vipratve sūtram eva hi

Men and women will live together merely because of superficial attraction, and success in business will depend on deceit. Womanliness and manliness will be judged according to one’s expertise in sex, and a man will be known as a brahmana just by his wearing a thread.

[Basically Gender and notions of Gender will be heavily sexualised; which is something I am seeing in this society of ours. Gender is quickly becoming about physical characteristics as opposed to character traits (moral virtues)]

avṛttyā nyāya-daurbalyaḿ
pāṇḍitye cāpalaḿ vacaḥ

And one who is very clever at juggling words will be considered a learned scholar.

[cough cough politics cough cough]


dūre vāry-ayanaḿ tīrthaḿ
lāvaṇyaḿ keśa-dhāraṇam
udaraḿ-bharatā svārthaḥ
satyatve dhārṣṭyam eva hi
dākṣyaḿ kuṭumba-bharaṇaḿ
yaśo ‘rthe dharma-sevanam

A sacred place will be taken to consist of no more than a reservoir of water located at a distance, and beauty will be thought to depend on one’s hairstyle. Filling the belly will become the goal of life, and one who is audacious will be accepted as truthful. He who can maintain a family will be regarded as an expert man, and the principles of religion will be observed only for the sake of reputation.

"na rakshishyanti manujah
sthavirau pitarav api"

Men will no longer protect their elderly parents.

sudrah pratigrahishyanti
tapo-veshopajivinah
dharmam vakshyanty adharma-jna
adhiruhyottamasanam

"Uncultured men will accept charity on behalf of the Lord and will earn their livelihood by making a show of austerity and wearing a mendicant’s dress. Those who know nothing about religion will mount a high seat and presume to speak on religious principles."

patim tyakshyanti nirdravyam
bhritya apy akhilottamam
bhrityam vipannam patayah
kaulam gas capayasvinih

Servants will abandon a master who has lost his wealth, even if that master is a saintly person of exemplary character. Masters will abandon an incapacitated servant, even if that servant has been in the family for generations. Cows will be abandoned or killed when they stop giving milk.

[capitalism?]

Don't worry... there is one redeeming quality, the Bhagavatam promises!

kaler dosha-nidhe rajann
asti hy eko maha gunah
kirtanad eva krishnasya
mukta-sangah param vrajet

“Although Kali-yuga is an ocean of faults, there is still one good quality about this age: simply by chanting the names of Krishna,once can attain mukti, and go to the highest abode!"

 

[Madhuri]

Obviously metaphorical.
"According to the Bhagavata Purana, Adharma is the husband of Mrishá (falsehood), and the father of Dambha (hypocrisy) and Máyá (deceit), who were adopted by Nirritti (Hindu god/dess of misery). The series of their descendants is also somewhat varied from our text; being in each descent, however, twins which intermarry, or Lobha (covetousness) and Nikriti, who produce Krodha (wrath) and Hinsá: their children are, Kali (wickedness) and Durukti (evil speech): their progeny are, Mrityu and Bhí (fear); whose offspring are, Niraya (hell) and Yátaná (torment)."

These qualities are greatly manifest in Kali Yuga. Kali, like all beings, is a manifestation of Brahman. Since Brahman is infinite in all ways, that includes being all things great and all things awful.

 

[Aupmanyav]

Not Kali Maa, but Kali the demon, who reigns this Kali Yuga. He resides in places of pestilence and debauchery, and will be Lord Kalki's enemy in the far future. My question should be disproved, as a being like Satan can never exist in reality where God is all. Is he a metaphor of ignorance? Or a real being?

Yes, it is God's leela. Kali is the Satan of this age. But as they say it is a fortunate period as Nitai said. Just reciting the name of the deity, you get his/her blessings. In other ages, people did penance for a long time to get to the deity.

Madhuri your post is very beautiful and apt. Kudos.

 

[Aupmanyav]

One of the first stories in my Srimad Bhagawat (it is the Gita Press version and not Prabhupada's version) is that of Sage Narda and Bhakti. Bhakti (Devotion) is a young woman who is lamenting for her two sons, Jnana (Knowledge) and Vairagya (Non-attachment) who have grown old before their time. The story then proceeds to mention how Sage Narada was able to bring Gyana and Vairagya back to their youth.

In another story we find Prithvi (Earth) lamenting and Dharma in form of a bull standing on one leg as his three legs have become useless. I was not able to get to this story in the book and do not remember it clearly after more than half-a-century of having read it. Perhaps our friend Nitai is better informed and will let us know. These stories are allegorical.

 

[Vinayaka]

Although I'm only barely familiar with the Abrahamic concept of Satan, I really can't envision anything in Hinduism being like that. Our paradigm doesn't really have that strikingly good versus bad thing.

 

[Aupmanyav]

Kali of Kaliyuga is again a representation of diminishing 'dharma' in this age and is really allegorical.

 

[निताइ dasa]

One of the first stories in my Srimad Bhagawat (it is the Gita Press version and not Prabhupada's version) is that of Sage Narda and Bhakti. Bhakti (Devotion) is a young woman who is lamenting for her two sons, Jnana (Knowledge) and Vairagya (Non-attachment) who have grown old before their time. The story then proceeds to mention how Sage Narada was able to bring Gyana and Vairagya back to their youth.

Jaya Jaya! It is certainly a beautiful story. It is from Padma Purana (the section which discusses the Glories of Bhagavatam). We see that due to the influence of Kaliyuga, Jnana and Vairagya had become weak (while Bhakti had stayed young). Then Narada speaks to Bhakti Maa and rejuvenates Jnana and Vairagya.

In another story we find Prithvi (Earth) lamenting and Dharma in form of a bull standing on one leg as his three legs have become useless. I was not able to get to this story in the book and do not remember it clearly after half-a-century of having read it

Don't worry, by Nitai's will I read it a few days ago. The 4 legs of Dharma (represented by the bull) are Tapa or austerity, Shaucha or cleanliness, Daya or mercy, and Satya or truth. By the start of the Treta Yuga, austerity is gone, and by the start of the Dwapara Yuga cleanliness is gone. Finally, by the time the Kali Yuga comes, only one leg is left standing, namely Truth. However Pariksit Maharaj was very merciful and he ordered Kali to only reside in places where gambling (lack of Truth), drinking (lack of Austerity), prostitution (lack of Cleanliness) and animal slaughter (lack of Mercy) were performed. The personality of Kali asked for something more, and because of his begging, the King gave him permission to live where there is gold because wherever there is gold there is also falsity, intoxication, lust, envy and enmity. Thus the personality of Kali, by the directions of Mahārāja Parīkṣit, the son of Uttarā, was allowed to live in those five places.

That is why Vaishnavs (and many other Hindu Schools) have 4 regulative principles which reflect the 4 legs of Dharma; namely no gambling, no illicit sex, no unnecessary slaughter of animals and no intoxicants.

 

[Aupmanyav]

Thanks very much Nitai for letting me know the four pillars of Dharma.

 

[Chakra]

Not Kali Maa, but Kali the demon, who reigns this Kali Yuga. He resides in places of pestilence and debauchery, and will be Lord Kalki's enemy in the far future. My question should be disproved, as a being like Satan can never exist in reality where God is all. Is he a metaphor of ignorance? Or a real being?

I don't know if he *exists*, but the metaphorical influence of Kali (darkness) exists in various places, such as slaughterhouses and places of gold. In Hinduism, it's a common thing that abstract ideas will get personified into humans, so maybe Kalki will fight the personified form.

Personally I just don't know why there is a Kali Yuga in the first place. :/

 

[EtuMalku]

Not Kali Maa, but Kali the demon, who reigns this Kali Yuga. He resides in places of pestilence and debauchery, and will be Lord Kalki's enemy in the far future. My question should be disproved, as a being like Satan can never exist in reality where God is all. Is he a metaphor of ignorance? Or a real being?

I would need the Hindu definition of Satan in order to comment on this . . .

 

[Terese]

I would need the Hindu definition of Satan in order to comment on this . . .

The biblical Satan. There is no Hindu definition of Satan.

 

[EtuMalku]

The biblical Satan. There is no Hindu definition of Satan.

The original definition of Satan is from the Judaic version of the Christian bible, which describes Satan as employed by God.
He was a prosecutor for God against human individuals, with God as the Judge. Ha‑Satan (Judaic: the Adversary) could not act without God’s permission and did not cause people to sin, though God may have ha‑Satan test a person, as in the case of Job. Ha‑Satan’s primary role was to record and point out the sins people committed and argue against them in the holy court in accordance with God’s will.

Do you find this to resonate with Kali?