Is Lucifer Darkness or Light.

[Seeker of Ka]

Luciferianist to you does Lucifer reapersent Light, Darkness, or Both?

 

[EtuMalku]

Luciferianist to you does Lucifer reapersent Light, Darkness, or Both?

You would be an Asetianist, I doubt you are an Asetian
We are called Luciferians. Lucifer doesn't represent Light, Lucifer means 'light bearer' and is a metaphor for gnosis / illumination
The Luciferian Path embraces both Light & Dark metaphorically

 

[EtuMalku]

That's awesome, but you're talking about Isaiah. Light-bearer/bringer, bright morning star, bringer of dawn/morning, Ishtar, Venus, etc all mean the same exact thing.

The point I'm making (or trying to) is that the deity Lucifer is not mentioned in the Christian bible, the word is being used as an adjective and translation of 'helel'. No where does Jesus refer to himself as Lucifer proper.


The earliest reference to a Morning Star is in the Phoenician/Canaan cosmology and is pictured as the god Attar who unsuccessfully tried to dethrone Baal as god of the Underworld. In another Mesopotamian myth the god Helel tries to overthrow the great god El. Eventually, these myths became the Sumerian story of Ishtar and Inanna's descent into the Underworld. Here Inanna is directly associated with the planet Venus.

Babylonian myth has the very first association to the concept of a 'fallen' deity due to Pride and its association with the " brilliancy of the morning star, which eclipses all other stars, but is not seen during the night". Ethana is driven by his pride to strive for the highest seat among the star‑gods on the northern mountain of the gods ... but was hurled down by the supreme ruler of the Babylonian Olympus.

 

[crossfire]

The part in the Revelation is "ὁ ἀστὴρ ὁ λαμπρὸς ὁ πρωϊνός" (http://www.sacred-texts.com/bib/poly/rev022.htm) which means "the bright morning star".
Of course this Greek text doesn't refer to the Roman-Greek deity Lucifer/Phosphoros/Heosphoros, or to the Old Testament/Babylonian/... concept of Helel, Ishtar etc.. Well, it could theoretically, but it seems rather unlikely to me. It probably is just meant as a metaphor of someone who ends the night (= a bad era) and brings light (= enlightenment or something positive per se) to the world. So, it's only the enlightenment-aspect, not the pride-aspect of the concept of the morning star which is meant there.

Well, back to Satanism. Since here darkness is not necessarily seen as something bad, and due to the rather common metaphors of the black light/flame/sun etc., which can be considered as referring to the LHP way of enlightenment, it's a baseless question whether Lucifer to us stands for light or darkness. It means the same anyway.

Lucifer is not Abrahamic like Satan. Not the same archetype.

 

[crossfire]

I wasn't talking about my own concepts but about society's concepts at the time of the writing of the Book of Revelations and earlier. And I wrote of the pride aspect of the morning star (Helel etc.), not of Lucifer.

Nowerdays, the name of Lucifer is so connected to the story of Helel that it's not really a merely Christian thing to relate them. Ironically your misunderstanding of my words demonstrates exactly that.


It's only names anyway. And names which were connected to a huge range of different concepts, not all of them Abrahamic or Roman. The entity/concept to which I refer when calling myself a Satanist actually even has only very few things to do with the Biblical entity named Satan, and not that much with the Christian interpretation either, and I assume it's that way for many people calling themselves Satanists.

Also, how has the culture something originates from to do with which archetype it is?

Well, one person might individually see Lucifer as Satan, another might individually see Lucifer as Prometheus, and another might individually equate Lucifer with Bodhisattvas. Each has its own connection with the specific individual. However, it is quite obvious that Satan is not the same as Prometheus, and neither are the same as Bodhisattvas. What might work on an individual level might not work on a collective level.

 

[EtuMalku]

Lucifer that we all know is an archetypal structure from Roman cults, he is the Mercury of the Gauls, He is the Serpent of the Ophites, the Kundalini and Budha of the Vedic, the Uræus of the Pharaoh! Lucifer is the Principle of Compassion for Life and Creation, the Light born in the Womb of Darkness . . . defiance of corrupt authority and the Current of Spiritual Evolution. As Prometheus, unlike the Abrahamic savior, He dies every day in order to bring us the Flame.

Lucifer is mentioned in Publius Ovidius Naso's "Metamorphoses", which was written in 8 C.E. and Roman poet Virgil mentions him as far back as 29 B.C.E. In Greek mythology, Hesperus, the Evening Star is the son of the dawn goddess Eos (Roman equivalent: Aurora) and the brother of Eosphorus the Morning Star (Eosphoros "dawn‑bearer").

 

[ExOrienteNox]

For me, Methaporicly Lucifer is ther Pre-Fall Satan So Lucifer Know both the Heaven(Light) and the Abyss(Darkness) and his Both Master of these two Currents!

 

[EtuMalku]

For me, Methaporicly Lucifer is ther Pre-Fall Satan So Lucifer Know both the Heaven(Light) and the Abyss(Darkness) and his Both Master of these two Currents!

"Methaporicly" ? Dude, buy a spellchecker . . . LMAO! Where do you find that "Lucifer if the pre-fallen Satan?

 

[ExOrienteNox]

"Methaporicly" ? Dude, buy a spellchecker . . . LMAO! Where do you find that "Lucifer if the pre-fallen Satan?

Sorry English is not my first Language, French is.

I know that in fact there is no ''evidence'' that Lucifer is the Pre-Fall Satan, in fact Lucifer was a Roman God, his Greek equivalent was the God Eosphoros. But for me, Belief is a tool, a mean, not an end, So in my personal practice i consider that Lucifer has two Aspects, One Higher Aspect(Light) and one Primal, atavistic Aspect(Darkness) and for me He Represent the Perfect Balance of these Two Aspect. This Belief is more usefull to me.

It is just my personal view.

 

[jameshwelch]

To me, Lucifer is both darkness and light. He represents enlightenment and truth and after all, truth can be as painful as it is wonderful.

 

[Luciferi Baphomet]

"From the East I call to Lucifer, the Morning Star and Bearer of the Dark Light, thou Spirit of the Air who rideth the whirlwinds of the Abyss. Come forth and enshrine within me your divine essence."

What do you mean by "Bearer of the Dark Light'? I am curious.

 

[Luciferi Baphomet]

To me, Lucifer is both darkness and light. He represents enlightenment and truth and after all, truth can be as painful as it is wonderful.

Indeed he does represent Enlightenment.

 

[Luciferi Baphomet]

It is a symbolic title. As a Setian I am the creator of my own light within a darkling universe in which all knowledge is seen through the light of night. The sky at night, an infinite black field (mystery/unknown) sprinkled with tiny specks of starlight (knowledge/understanding). It's a symbolic term and title of That which I know as Set, the Prince of Darkness.

Sounds quite interesting.

 

[Brickjectivity]

***Mod Post -- Only Luciferians may comment in the Luciferian Dir. See forum rule #10***

 

[Milton Platt]

Luciferianist to you does Lucifer reapersent Light, Darkness, or Both?

Well, I am an atheist, as the description beneath my avatar says.....but can you define what you mean be the terms "light" and "dark" for the benefit of us who know next to nothing about your beliefs? I'm not posting to rock the boat...it is a serious question and I am just seeking to be able to follow the conversation..
Thanks!!!

 

[crossfire]

Well, I am an atheist, as the description beneath my avatar says.....but can you define what you mean be the terms "light" and "dark" for the benefit of us who know next to nothing about your beliefs? I'm not posting to rock the boat...it is a serious question and I am just seeking to be able to follow the conversation..
Thanks!!!

To put it in the most simple terms, light is conscious mind, and darkness is unconscious mind.

 

[Luciferi Baphomet]

Luciferianist to you does Lucifer reapersent Light, Darkness, or Both?

I like to represent him as the light. "The Bringer of Light".