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Is the Bible still holy?

The Sum of Awe

Brought to you by the moment that spacetime began.
Staff member
Premium Member
Not sure if you as a Christian agree with this, but, a lot of Christians I met say that the Bible is tainted severely by interpretation, translation, etc. and that any errors found in it are due to humans perverting it.

The Bible's a pretty old book, so it seems likely that throughout history it changed.

If you believe the Bible has gotten far off track from the originals, doesn't that mean it lost much of its value, even as the word of God?

Why not reboot the message? Why doesn't God influence another Bible to be written? If the Bible has been smeared by the ignorance of man, wouldn't it be much harder to seek the truth and understand God?

Can you really rely on the Bible for a path to salvation when this path revealed in the Bible could be way off?
 

Thana

Lady
Um, no.
Generally Christians and Jews believe the Bible/Tanakh to be infallible or the nearest thing.
Problems with interpretation and translation aren't reflective of the bible or it's validity.

As to getting a new bible, That's exactly what happened in Islam. They believe the Tanakh and the NT are corrupted and so they have the Quran.
 

mainliner

no one can de-borg my fact's ...NO-ONE!!
Why not reboot the message? Why doesn't God influence another Bible to be written?
good q :)
if there was 100 people ONLY on earth and 5 books got written and 50 didnt believe them .... then this could work .

but there isnt and it would be an impossable task to try and get BILLIONS of people to think different imo.

youd be just classed as a nut job and shot :)


personnaly i think the only thing people can agree with in all the books is LOVE ........ no one even knows who the true god is apart from those in heaven and one other person.
 

URAVIP2ME

Veteran Member
Not sure if you as a Christian agree with this, but, a lot of Christians I met say that the Bible is tainted severely by interpretation, translation, etc. and that any errors found in it are due to humans perverting it.
The Bible's a pretty old book, so it seems likely that throughout history it changed.
If you believe the Bible has gotten far off track from the originals, doesn't that mean it lost much of its value, even as the word of God?
Why not reboot the message? Why doesn't God influence another Bible to be written? If the Bible has been smeared by the ignorance of man, wouldn't it be much harder to seek the truth and understand God?
Can you really rely on the Bible for a path to salvation when this path revealed in the Bible could be way off?

Originally, as most know, the Bible was Not written in English, but the English can be compared with the ancient Hebrew and Greek manuscripts. The apocryphal books simply exclude themselves because they are out of harmony with the harmonious ' 66 ' books comprising the Bible.

Throughout the Bible are corresponding or parallel cross-reference verses and passages.
Jesus' teachings are based on the old Hebrew Scriptures. Jesus often prefaced his teaching by the words, "It is written..." meaning already written down in the Hebrew Scriptures as the basis for his beliefs. So, Jesus knew ' religious truth ' from the old Hebrew Scriptures.

Is it a ' lot of Christians ' or rather a lot of fake ' weed/tares ' Christians thinking tainted ?
Remember Jesus forewarned that MANY would come in his name proving false. - Please see Matthew chapter 7.

Since the Bible has many enemies, from without and within, if there was Not divine guards against such attacks we would Not have the Bible preserved today. After all, the Bible is written on perishable paper. Also, No one has been able to get rid of God's genuine ' wheat' Christians. Not only is Bible distribution world wide, the Bible's message - Matthew 24 v 14; Acts 1 v 8 - about the ' good news of God's kingdom' is proclaimed on an international scale today. Even modern technology has helped by making possible rapid Bible translation into most languages so people can read Scripture in their own mother tongue or own language.

What 'path to salvation' do you have in mind ?
 

RedDragon94

Love everyone, meditate often
Not sure if you as a Christian agree with this, but, a lot of Christians I met say that the Bible is tainted severely by interpretation, translation, etc. and that any errors found in it are due to humans perverting it.

The Bible's a pretty old book, so it seems likely that throughout history it changed.

If you believe the Bible has gotten far off track from the originals, doesn't that mean it lost much of its value, even as the word of God?

Why not reboot the message? Why doesn't God influence another Bible to be written? If the Bible has been smeared by the ignorance of man, wouldn't it be much harder to seek the truth and understand God?

Can you really rely on the Bible for a path to salvation when this path revealed in the Bible could be way off?
As far as the originals are concerned usually there is a bad translation. But basically most of the manuscripts of the Scriptures we have basically affirm the same message.
 

maggie2

Active Member
Not sure if you as a Christian agree with this, but, a lot of Christians I met say that the Bible is tainted severely by interpretation, translation, etc. and that any errors found in it are due to humans perverting it.

The Bible's a pretty old book, so it seems likely that throughout history it changed.

If you believe the Bible has gotten far off track from the originals, doesn't that mean it lost much of its value, even as the word of God?

Why not reboot the message? Why doesn't God influence another Bible to be written? If the Bible has been smeared by the ignorance of man, wouldn't it be much harder to seek the truth and understand God?

Can you really rely on the Bible for a path to salvation when this path revealed in the Bible could be way off?

I guess I'm a bit different from many of those who frequent this particular topic. I was brought up in a "Christian" home and also went to church as an adult. However, I began to do some very extensive research into early Christian history and when I discovered how the Bible became the Bible (i.e., who decided which books to keep and which to ban) I realized that the Bible was put together by humans. If you want to read up on this try Elaine Pagels books, they are excellent and there are many others too. While the Bible may have some accurate history it has been and continues to be interpreted in many different ways, depending on who is doing the interpreting and what brand of "Christianity" they follow, i.e., Catholic, Methodist, etc. etc. And yes, from my research I believe it has gotten off track.

Does that mean it has lost much of its value? Not totally. I think with all the archeological findings and the Nag Hammadi discoveries it has lost some of its clout. However, I do believe that the Bible contains some good concepts about how we might conduct our lives...namely treat others as you would like them to treat you.

Why not reboot the message? There are many books that have been written in current times that shed new light on the topics covered in the Bible. One set of books, Conversations with God is particularly good, in my opinion. There are others. The books I find most interesting on the topic, however, are those that provide scientific proof that there is a 'field' for lack of a better word, that surrounds and connects us all. Quantum physics is now proving that consciousness lives on after the body dies and those books too are available. I think they are providing the message that Jesus taught, that life is eternal. However, they are doing it in modern language, with modern tools. There is a ton of literature on these and other topics that can provide information on spiritual matters. Interestingly, some of this information comes from a couple of astronauts who went to the moon.

If the Bible has been smeared by the ignorance of man, wouldn't it be much harder to seek the truth and understand God? I think God can be known with or without the Bible. I actually find many paths to God that have nothing to do with the Bible. For example, contemplating how bees work and how we need them for our survival and what miracles they are...after all, they are not supposed to be able to fly, aerodynamically. I don't need a Bible to know that, just two eyes, a brain and an openness to see God in his creation. I connect with God through music, my grandkids, a beautiful mountain scene and a thousand other things. Sometimes just looking up at the beautiful blue sky makes me aware of a Source so powerful and loving that I am assured of a loving God.

Can you really rely on the Bible for a path to salvation when this path revealed in the Bible could be way off?

I don't rely on the Bible for a path to salvation. I rely on God, although I wouldn't consider salvation necessary. I happen to believe in a God of love who simply would not condemn people because they didn't believe the stories in a book. I think each person needs to find their own path and walk it without fear of a God who has been painted as a monster, throwing people into a lake of fire. I don't believe in that kind of God, although I once did. I am so thankful that I no longer have to live in that space. I much prefer my God, who loves us all and cares for us all.

And before anyone asks "Well, what about people like Hitler," here's my answer. Hitler was an evil man. He did terrible things. He has had to deal with God and I think he has put himself in a dark, dark place where God's light is very dim. I think he can eventually, with assistance, move slowly out of that place and become a more loving being. I guess that's my version of 'hell', 'a dark place away from God's light. But I don't believe you avoid that place by believing the Bible...or someone's interpretation of it.
 

Shiranui117

Pronounced Shee-ra-noo-ee
Premium Member
Originally, as most know, the Bible was Not written in English, but the English can be compared with the ancient Hebrew and Greek manuscripts. The apocryphal books simply exclude themselves because they are out of harmony with the harmonious ' 66 ' books comprising the Bible.

Throughout the Bible are corresponding or parallel cross-reference verses and passages.
Jesus' teachings are based on the old Hebrew Scriptures. Jesus often prefaced his teaching by the words, "It is written..." meaning already written down in the Hebrew Scriptures as the basis for his beliefs. So, Jesus knew ' religious truth ' from the old Hebrew Scriptures.

Is it a ' lot of Christians ' or rather a lot of fake ' weed/tares ' Christians thinking tainted ?
Remember Jesus forewarned that MANY would come in his name proving false. - Please see Matthew chapter 7.

Since the Bible has many enemies, from without and within, if there was Not divine guards against such attacks we would Not have the Bible preserved today. After all, the Bible is written on perishable paper. Also, No one has been able to get rid of God's genuine ' wheat' Christians. Not only is Bible distribution world wide, the Bible's message - Matthew 24 v 14; Acts 1 v 8 - about the ' good news of God's kingdom' is proclaimed on an international scale today. Even modern technology has helped by making possible rapid Bible translation into most languages so people can read Scripture in their own mother tongue or own language.

What 'path to salvation' do you have in mind ?
Yet whenever the Apostles quoted the Scriptures, they quoted the Greek, not the Hebrew. And the Greek Septuagint used by the first Christians has the books that the Protestants often erroneously dub the "apocrypha", such as the Books of Maccabees, Tobit, Judith, and the Wisdom of Sirach. In total, at least seven books were ejected from the Bible by later Protestant reformers, but these books were retained by every other church--Catholic, Orthodox and Assyrian alike. For more than 1500 years, these books had a place in the liturgical services of every Christian parish in the world.
 

BSM1

What? Me worry?
Yet whenever the Apostles quoted the Scriptures, they quoted the Greek, not the Hebrew. And the Greek Septuagint used by the first Christians has the books that the Protestants often erroneously dub the "apocrypha", such as the Books of Maccabees, Tobit, Judith, and the Wisdom of Sirach. In total, at least seven books were ejected from the Bible by later Protestant reformers, but these books were retained by every other church--Catholic, Orthodox and Assyrian alike. For more than 1500 years, these books had a place in the liturgical services of every Christian parish in the world.
Yet whenever the Apostles quoted the Scriptures, they quoted the Greek, not the Hebrew. And the Greek Septuagint used by the first Christians has the books that the Protestants often erroneously dub the "apocrypha", such as the Books of Maccabees, Tobit, Judith, and the Wisdom of Sirach. In total, at least seven books were ejected from the Bible by later Protestant reformers, but these books were retained by every other church--Catholic, Orthodox and Assyrian alike. For more than 1500 years, these books had a place in the liturgical services of every Christian parish in the world.


And, of course, the Apostles never had the advantage of having a Bible to quote. The "Bible" didn't even show up until three hundred years after the Apostles roamed the Earth.
 

jonathan180iq

Well-Known Member
What makes something holy? Isn't that a better question?
And does the Bible fit the definition of whatever it is that is set as the standard of holy?
 

idea

Question Everything
What makes something holy? Isn't that a better question?
And does the Bible fit the definition of whatever it is that is set as the standard of holy?

Something that is holy is something that testifies of the reality of God the Father, and of His Son Jesus Christ, and of the Holy Ghost. Holy writing can be tested by studying them, then praying to know if they are true. The light of Christ, or our conscience, and the Holy Ghost bear witness of truth and God-inspired messages.
 

jonathan180iq

Well-Known Member
Something that is holy is something that testifies of the reality of God the Father, and of His Son Jesus Christ, and of the Holy Ghost. Holy writing can be tested by studying them, then praying to know if they are true. The light of Christ, or our conscience, and the Holy Ghost bear witness of truth and God-inspired messages.
Doesn't that description limit all things holy to only fitting one particular interpretation of one particular religion?
 

idea

Question Everything
Doesn't that description limit all things holy to only fitting one particular interpretation of one particular religion?

It's not about interpreting anything, it's about going straight to the source through prayer, and receiving an answer.
 

Kolibri

Well-Known Member
What makes something holy?

Holy can be defined as the attribute of being clean, pure and set apart.

*** it-1 p. 1127 Holiness ***
The state or character of being holy. Holiness means “religious cleanness or purity; sacredness.” Also, the original Hebrew qo′dhesh conveys the thought of separateness, exclusiveness, or sanctification to God, who is holy; a state of being set aside to the service of God. In the Christian Greek Scriptures, the words rendered “holy” (ha′gi·os) and “holiness” (ha·gi·a·smos′ [also, “sanctification”]; ha·gi·o′tes; ha·gi·o·sy′ne) likewise denote separation to God; they also are used to refer to holiness as a quality of God and to purity or perfection in one’s personal conduct.
 

jonathan180iq

Well-Known Member
Ok, at least that's something.
But, again, your standards for holiness is defined within the confines of a limited worldview. In order to properly judge something as being holy or not, you have to set universal definitions of what makes something holy.

If I said, for example, that my shoes were holy because holiness is defined as my shoes.... well, that's nonsensical, isn't it?
That automatically excludes all other shoes, doesn't it?

You can't say that the Bible is holy because holiness means anything coming from the Bible. You can't even say that God is holy because holiness means God...
 

Kolibri

Well-Known Member
Ok, at least that's something.
But, again, your standards for holiness is defined within the confines of a limited worldview. In order to properly judge something as being holy or not, you have to set universal definitions of what makes something holy.

If I said, for example, that my shoes were holy because holiness is defined as my shoes.... well, that's nonsensical, isn't it?
That automatically excludes all other shoes, doesn't it?

You can't say that the Bible is holy because holiness means anything coming from the Bible. You can't even say that God is holy because holiness means God...

That is true. Holy is relative to the god it is attached to. What may be holy to one god may not be holy to another. This requires us to define as true holiness as what is such from the opinion of a true God.
 

jonathan180iq

Well-Known Member
That is true. Holy is relative to the god it is attached to. What may be holy to one god may not be holy to another. This requires us to define as true holiness as what is such from the opinion of a true God.
I have no qualms with that explanation.
 

Pegg

Jehovah our God is One
Not sure if you as a Christian agree with this, but, a lot of Christians I met say that the Bible is tainted severely by interpretation, translation, etc. and that any errors found in it are due to humans perverting it.

The Bible's a pretty old book, so it seems likely that throughout history it changed.

If you believe the Bible has gotten far off track from the originals, doesn't that mean it lost much of its value, even as the word of God?

Why not reboot the message? Why doesn't God influence another Bible to be written? If the Bible has been smeared by the ignorance of man, wouldn't it be much harder to seek the truth and understand God?

Can you really rely on the Bible for a path to salvation when this path revealed in the Bible could be way off?

being holy means being set apart for a sacred service.

The bible most certainly fits that category. It is the writings of men who were inspired by God, or who were given the messages of God. They wrote those down so that we could have a way of getting to know God and his plans for mankind. That most certainly puts it in the category of being in a holy service, warts and all.
 
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