Is the Kingdom of God earthly or heavenly?

[Thief]

I don't recall saying it didn't have a spiritual component. Just like your spirit exists without your physical body, so too does the Kingdom of God exist without a physical body. What you seem to be missing is that the Kingdom of God shall for a period of about 1,000 years obtain its physical manifestation here on planet earth. If you wish to keep spiritualizing everything to the exclusion of its physical manifestation they you are going to miss out.

Of course, soldiers would be dorks to think they could time travel. Jesus was saying He wouldn't come to do the job He was created to do until the very beginning of the 'world to come', which is when there shall be a new heavens and a new earth organized. This whole process is the work that shall be performed by the Kingdom of God. He has to give every creature of the new creation their new name. Put another way, He has to judge and organize all of the spirits of men into their new 'mansions in His Father's house'. That work has to be performed here in order for it to affect things here. It will get along just fine without you if that's the way you want it.

Already know where I'm going...I've seen it.

Flesh cannot inherit the kingdom.

 

[kylixguru]

Already know where I'm going...I've seen it.

Again, I don't deny any spiritual component. Please tell me what you saw.

Flesh cannot inherit the kingdom.

I agree, flesh alone cannot.

However, you are in denial that a literal political kingdom shall be brought about upon planet earth that shall be ruled personally by the advent of the Father. If you had the correct spirit you wouldn't deny this essential aspect.

 

[Thief]

Again, I don't deny any spiritual component. Please tell me what you saw.

I agree, flesh alone cannot.

However, you are in denial that a literal political kingdom shall be brought about upon planet earth that shall be ruled personally by the advent of the Father. If you had the correct spirit you wouldn't deny this essential aspect.

And you anticipate a universal religion?

The Jews use their faith and law as one.

And if you expect Jesus with a crown on His head.....
Are you prepared for a Jewish king on a Jewish throne?

 

[kylixguru]

And you anticipate a universal religion?

There won't be a forced religion. But, the Abrahamic religions will have some serious house cleaning done with them in terms of setting all things in order.

The Jews use their faith and law as one.

The Kingdom of God is His kingdom. It will be separate from the religious organization. The religious side will not be forced upon people.

And if you expect Jesus with a crown on His head.....
Are you prepared for a Jewish king on a Jewish throne?

The Branch Messiah will be of the offspring of David but He shall be from the House of Joseph. So, it won't be a Jew this time around. It will be a Josephite. What remains to be seen is whether or not the Jews are prepared for that.

Just as Judah did before, their doctrines have sold their brother down the road supposing he is gone for good. Such is not the case, which shall be to their salvation.

 

[Beta]

Great post jbug !

 

[Thief]

There won't be a forced religion. But, the Abrahamic religions will have some serious house cleaning done with them in terms of setting all things in order.

The Kingdom of God is His kingdom. It will be separate from the religious organization. The religious side will not be forced upon people.

The Branch Messiah will be of the offspring of David but He shall be from the House of Joseph. So, it won't be a Jew this time around. It will be a Josephite. What remains to be seen is whether or not the Jews are prepared for that.

Just as Judah did before, their doctrines have sold their brother down the road supposing he is gone for good. Such is not the case, which shall be to their salvation.

Obviously you've sold yourself....and at least one other.

I say again...
the kingdom is not of this world....
flesh cannot inherit the kingdom.

What happens on earth goes to dust.

 

[kylixguru]

Obviously you've sold yourself....and at least one other.

What sold me was finding interpretive keys in the Bible that when applied enable me to understand the Bible in simple, clear and practical terms.

It's like this. I was able to figure out how to focus my eyes in order to have the encoded stereogram pop into clear view. I have been through the Bible over and over again and the message comes through loud and clear.

The people of the northern and southern kingdoms of Israel have been put under a period of exile and judgment where they are being punished for their adulteries against their God. That period ended recently and so after they have been given over into the hand of their enemy the small remnant that survives the coming calamity/tribulations shall be enabled to enter into a new covenant relationship with God. The implications of this is they shall again become a sovereign political state just as they were in earlier times. God shall be their God again and shall keep them free of their enemies, etc. as long as the people have fidelity. There are no powers upon this earth that shall stop this real political kingdom from being established again.

I say again...
the kingdom is not of this world....
flesh cannot inherit the kingdom.

What happens on earth goes to dust.

"From dust thou art and unto dust thou shalt return."

This is the same as saying it shall be composed of dust and then it shall become composed of dust again. It shall happen over and over again.

The two kingdoms were "stoned to death" for committing adultery against their Lord. Thus, they became dead and decomposing societal bodies. The whole point of the Gospel of Jesus Christ is to carry out everything lawful and necessary such that the cast off bride can become cleansed and purified and eligible again to be received into a new covenant. Thus, Israel shall be gathered together from its decomposing state into a new body. This is Israel's resurrection when it shall return to dust. It becomes a living societal body again. You are welcome to open your eyes to it and thus make of yourself more than flesh or you can reject the light and truth I am offering to you that will enably you to have the spirit that shall enable you to enter into the Kingdom when it comes.

 

[Thief]

What sold me was finding interpretive keys in the Bible that when applied enable me to understand the Bible in simple, clear and practical terms.

It's like this. I was able to figure out how to focus my eyes in order to have the encoded stereogram pop into clear view. I have been through the Bible over and over again and the message comes through loud and clear.

The people of the northern and southern kingdoms of Israel have been put under a period of exile and judgment where they are being punished for their adulteries against their God. That period ended recently and so after they have been given over into the hand of their enemy the small remnant that survives the coming calamity/tribulations shall be enabled to enter into a new covenant relationship with God. The implications of this is they shall again become a sovereign political state just as they were in earlier times. God shall be their God again and shall keep them free of their enemies, etc. as long as the people have fidelity. There are no powers upon this earth that shall stop this real political kingdom from being established again.

"From dust thou art and unto dust thou shalt return."

This is the same as saying it shall be composed of dust and then it shall become composed of dust again. It shall happen over and over again.

The two kingdoms were "stoned to death" for committing adultery against their Lord. Thus, they became dead and decomposing societal bodies. The whole point of the Gospel of Jesus Christ is to carry out everything lawful and necessary such that the cast off bride can become cleansed and purified and eligible again to be received into a new covenant. Thus, Israel shall be gathered together from its decomposing state into a new body. This is Israel's resurrection when it shall return to dust. It becomes a living societal body again. You are welcome to open your eyes to it and thus make of yourself more than flesh or you can reject the light and truth I am offering to you that will enably you to have the spirit that shall enable you to enter into the Kingdom when it comes.

You're extending too much metaphor into your literal terms.

Hence your confusion.

Politics may generate what appears to be a 'kingdom'.
But it won't last.

The kingdom of God is spiritual....and therefore eternal.
Not of this world.

 

[kylixguru]

You're extending too much metaphor into your literal terms.

I'm only using metaphor the Bible provides itself.

Hence your confusion.

I am not confused about anything.

Politics may generate what appears to be a 'kingdom'.
But it won't last.

The kingdom of God is spiritual....and therefore eternal.
Not of this world.

You are who is confused.

While I too am a spiritual being, one that is co-eternal with God Himself, I am here in the flesh upon this earth. So too does the Kingdom come and exist upon this earth for a given period of time. You speak as if that is an insignificant detail. As I see it, this is where it all becomes realized. What good is a dream longed for with every fiber of your being if there is never any hope of it coming true?

You would have our existence here be considered meaningless. No thanks!

 

[Beta]

You would have our existence here be considered meaningless. No thanks!

As I see it our presence on earth is of the greatest importance and should never consist just of future dreams. How unsatisfactory that would be ! :help:
We are here to fulfill God's purpose for mankind and are exceptionally fortunate to live in the latter stages of our unfinished creation. There is much to learn and literally to prepare for , so in fact we are not wasting our time dreaming :no:.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

What happens on earth goes to dust.

For now we are all but dust.
All have sinned, and the price sin pays is death [dust] -Rom 6v23,7.

If Adam had obeyed God, Adam would not have returned to dust.

We are not responsible for what Adam did, so our 'dust' is temporary because Jesus paid the ransom price for our 'dust'. -Matthew 20v28 B.

Except for those of Matt 12v32; Hebrews 6vs3-6, all the rest will be resurrected from the dust of the earth. -Daniel 12 vs2,13.
Revelation [20 vs13,14] mentions resurrected as being 'delivered up' from the Bible hell or 'dust'.

Some to be resurrected to heaven to reign with Jesus over earth.
-Rev 20v6; 5vs9,10
The majority resurrected to life on a paradisaic earth during Jesus 1000 year reign over earth.
-John 11vs11,14; Matthew 19v28

That time on earth all starts at the time of Jesus glory of Matthew 25vs31,32 when the separated living sheep-like people on earth can gain everlasting life on earth without ever having to die because as verse 46 says those living sheep can gain 'everlasting life'. Everlasting life as originally offer to Adam.
and as Rev 21vs4,5 promises there will be: No more death 'dust'.
Death 'dust', our last enemy 'death' will be brought to nothing. 1st Cor 15v26.
Death will be swallowed up [gone] forever. -Isaiah 25vs6-8.

No one dies in heaven, so by praying God's heavenly will be done here on earth, as his will is being done in heaven, doesn't that mean we are praying for the end of death on earth?

 

[Thief]

For now we are all but dust.
All have sinned, and the price sin pays is death [dust] -Rom 6v23,7.

If Adam had obeyed God, Adam would not have returned to dust.

We are not responsible for what Adam did, so our 'dust' is temporary because Jesus paid the ransom price for our 'dust'. -Matthew 20v28 B.

Except for those of Matt 12v32; Hebrews 6vs3-6, all the rest will be resurrected from the dust of the earth. -Daniel 12 vs2,13.
Revelation [20 vs13,14] mentions resurrected as being 'delivered up' from the Bible hell or 'dust'.

Some to be resurrected to heaven to reign with Jesus over earth.
-Rev 20v6; 5vs9,10
The majority resurrected to life on a paradisaic earth during Jesus 1000 year reign over earth.
-John 11vs11,14; Matthew 19v28

That time on earth all starts at the time of Jesus glory of Matthew 25vs31,32 when the separated living sheep-like people on earth can gain everlasting life on earth without ever having to die because as verse 46 says those living sheep can gain 'everlasting life'. Everlasting life as originally offer to Adam.
and as Rev 21vs4,5 promises there will be: No more death 'dust'.
Death 'dust', our last enemy 'death' will be brought to nothing. 1st Cor 15v26.
Death will be swallowed up [gone] forever. -Isaiah 25vs6-8.

No one dies in heaven, so by praying God's heavenly will be done here on earth, as his will is being done in heaven, doesn't that mean we are praying for the end of death on earth?

Nay to all this....except the end of death.

A spiritual body shall not see corruption.
All the is flesh...fails.

Review your quotes with this in mind and the clarity will be there.

 

[InvestigateTruth]

this kingdom that Jesus taught us to pray about is either a heavenly kingdom, meaning it is going to be located in heaven, or it is going to be an earthly kingdom located somewhere on earth.

Many christians believe it will be on earth (likely in Jerusalem) and that it will exist as a physical government with Jesus as its ruler (the jews believe it will be in Jerusalem with the Messiah as it ruler)

This is the Baha'i belief on this.


"Lo! He is come in the sheltering shadow of Testimony, invested with conclusive proof and evidence, and those who truly believe in Him regard His presence as the embodiment of the Kingdom of God. " Baha'u'llah - The Most Holy Tablet

Bahá'í Reference Library - Tablets of Bahá’u’lláh Revealed After the Kitáb-i-Aqdas, Pages 9-17

"Ye are but vassals, O Kings of the earth! He Who is the King of kings hath appeared, arrayed in His most wondrous glory, and is summoning you unto Himself, the Help in Peril, the Self-Subsisting. Take heed lest pride deter you from recognizing the Source of Revelation; lest the things of this world shut you out as by a veil from Him Who is the Creator of heaven. Arise, and serve Him Who is the Desire of all nations, Who hath created you through a word from Him, and ordained you to be, for all time, the emblems of His sovereignty. " Baha'u'llah - SUMMONS TO THE KINGS AND RULERS OF THE WORLD

Bahá'í Reference Library - Proclamation of Bahá’u’lláh, Pages 5-7

 

[URAVIP2ME]

Nay to all this....except the end of death.
A spiritual body shall not see corruption.
All the is flesh...fails.
Review your quotes with this in mind and the clarity will be there.

Agree a 'spiritual body' can not see corruption.

A person does Not have a spiritual body until he is resurrected to reign with Christ in heaven for a thousand years. -Rev 20v6; 5vs9,10.

A 'spiritual body' is not a body trapped inside of a physical fleshly body.

1st Corinthians chapter 15 shows at resurrection the ones called to heaven 'put on' immortality [spiritual body].
A spiritual body is not separated or severed from a dead physical fleshly body.

Those that will be part of the humble, mild-tempered meek remain on earth as Jesus subjects [Psalm 72v8; 37vs11,29].
They can gain everlasting life in human perfection.
The same human perfection of having a healthy sound mind, heart and body as Adam had at his creation before his downfall into sin and imperfection.
-Matthew 19v28; 25v32,46.

 

[kylixguru]

Agree a 'spiritual body' can not see corruption.

A person does Not have a spiritual body until he is resurrected to reign with Christ in heaven for a thousand years. -Rev 20v6; 5vs9,10.

A 'spiritual body' is not a body trapped inside of a physical fleshly body.

1st Corinthians chapter 15 shows at resurrection the ones called to heaven 'put on' immortality [spiritual body].
A spiritual body is not separated or severed from a dead physical fleshly body.

Those that will be part of the humble, mild-tempered meek remain on earth as Jesus subjects [Psalm 72v8; 37vs11,29].
They can gain everlasting life in human perfection.
The same human perfection of having a healthy sound mind, heart and body as Adam had at his creation before his downfall into sin and imperfection.
-Matthew 19v28; 25v32,46.

It would help you to sort out things if you understood there is more than one kind of resurrection just like there is more than one kind of life and death. Your individual consciousness can be physically and spiritually dead, physically dead and spiritually alive, physically alive and spiritually dead and physically and spiritually alive.

A person physically alive but spiritually dead becomes (spiritually) resurrected when they receive the Holy Ghost. They pass from death to life.

I am a (spiritually) resurrected being.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

The verses in consideration deal with a person's literal death.

Agree there is spiritual death, emotional death, etc.

But the verses under consideration deal with a person needing a resurrection because they are funeral-home dead.

 

[kylixguru]

Agree there is spiritual death, emotional death, etc.

But the verses under consideration deal with a person needing a resurrection because they are funeral-home dead.

I was not speaking of emotional death.
There are only two deaths referred to in holy writ.
They are both literal and real.

 

[Thief]

I was not speaking of emotional death.
There are only two deaths referred to in holy writ.
They are both literal and real.

yeah...but you're trying to keep them as one.

The body is no more than a learning event.
It passes.

What stands up...when the body lays down....
is the spiritual body.

The separation must happen.
Otherwise, you follow your body into the box, and the box into the ground.
Eternal Darkness is physically real.

 

[kylixguru]

yeah...but you're trying to keep them as one.

Huh?

The body is no more than a learning event.
It passes.

It is the vehicle for physical experience.

What stands up...when the body lays down....
is the spiritual body.

The separation must happen.
Otherwise, you follow your body into the box, and the box into the ground.
Eternal Darkness is physically real.

You are talking about the immortalization of the astral body when our consciousness adjusts to our new conditions upon physical death.

As I read it, holy writ calls this process of immortalization of the astral body a kind of resurrection too, but that this is not in actuality a true resurrection. There is part of us that never dies so for that part of us to merely continue on past death is not technically a resurrection because it never dies in the first place.

True resurrection is when the vehicle for our consciousness to experience physical life goes from a state of physical disorganization to physical reorganization. Some immortal spirits are required to continue on the wheel of reincarnation while others are not bound to this. Thus, the reorganization for some is rebirth via a kind of reincarnation while for others it is spiritual union with a tabernacle of living stones.

There are those entities of consciousness who have overcome all things and are not bound to be reincarnated. They are possessed of great knowledge, wisdom, power, gifts, talents, skills, resources, etc. and by their choice they can work with and through a tabernacle of living stones to experience things in the physical realm. It is the process of at-one-ment. Jesus accomplished this spiritual union with the Father.

When this took place two things happened. Jesus received spiritual resurrection because he received the endowment of spiritual union with his Father. The Father received physical resurrection because now He was present in the tabernacle of living stones that Jesus provided for Him.

And, depending upon how things go, this union may actually become a complete merger. It depends upon if the tabernacle of living stones holds out true and faithful and maintains itself worthy of the spiritual endowment. If it does not hold out true and faithful then the immortal soul may have to depart and leave the tabernacle of living stones to itself, bereft of all that it gained by way of the union.

Perhaps some shall find this to be a creepy thing. Our salvation as a reincarnated soul depends upon us obtaining spiritual union and being merged into an immortal soul that is not bound to the wheel of reincarnation. And, that our means to continue experiencing physical existence depends upon the willingness and desire of those in the flesh seeking their eternal salvation who invite us in and maintain themselves worthy of such. A term I like to use to describe this process is soul braiding.

Perhaps I should mention also that there are other immortal souls who have a much different approach. They are not concerned about the willingness and free-will choice that others souls are. They want a tabernacle of living stones for selfish reasons and resort to every means they can muster to forcibly take possession of the tabernacles of others. They wish to continue to satiate certain addictions or cravings and do all they can to find susceptible vehicles to their agenda. This is why they deceive, tempt, etc.

 

[Thief]

Huh?

It is the vehicle for physical experience.

You are talking about the immortalization of the astral body when our consciousness adjusts to our new conditions upon physical death.

As I read it, holy writ calls this process of immortalization of the astral body a kind of resurrection too, but that this is not in actuality a true resurrection. There is part of us that never dies so for that part of us to merely continue on past death is not technically a resurrection because it never dies in the first place.

True resurrection is when the vehicle for our consciousness to experience physical life goes from a state of physical disorganization to physical reorganization. Some immortal spirits are required to continue on the wheel of reincarnation while others are not bound to this. Thus, the reorganization for some is rebirth via a kind of reincarnation while for others it is spiritual union with a tabernacle of living stones.

There are those entities of consciousness who have overcome all things and are not bound to be reincarnated. They are possessed of great knowledge, wisdom, power, gifts, talents, skills, resources, etc. and by their choice they can work with and through a tabernacle of living stones to experience things in the physical realm. It is the process of at-one-ment. Jesus accomplished this spiritual union with the Father.

When this took place two things happened. Jesus received spiritual resurrection because he received the endowment of spiritual union with his Father. The Father received physical resurrection because now He was present in the tabernacle of living stones that Jesus provided for Him.

And, depending upon how things go, this union may actually become a complete merger. It depends upon if the tabernacle of living stones holds out true and faithful and maintains itself worthy of the spiritual endowment. If it does not hold out true and faithful then the immortal soul may have to depart and leave the tabernacle of living stones to itself, bereft of all that it gained by way of the union.

Perhaps some shall find this to be a creepy thing. Our salvation as a reincarnated soul depends upon us obtaining spiritual union and being merged into an immortal soul that is not bound to the wheel of reincarnation. And, that our means to continue experiencing physical existence depends upon the willingness and desire of those in the flesh seeking their eternal salvation who invite us in and maintain themselves worthy of such. A term I like to use to describe this process is soul braiding.

Perhaps I should mention also that there are other immortal souls who have a much different approach. They are not concerned about the willingness and free-will choice that others souls are. They want a tabernacle of living stones for selfish reasons and resort to every means they can muster to forcibly take possession of the tabernacles of others. They wish to continue to satiate certain addictions or cravings and do all they can to find susceptible vehicles to their agenda. This is why they deceive, tempt, etc.

And your banner reads....'just give me the facts'.

Well I did.

But this last posting of yours indicates a wasted effort.