Is the word "Ahimsa" or nonviolence mentioned in Yajurveda?

[paarsurrey]

@Aupmanyav said: ↑
You are right. This verse has no connection to 'ahimsa' (non-violence). You have to sift Google search results for relevant material. Google does not guarantee it.

Thanks for agreeing with me, if one really agreed by saying "right", no compulsion however, whatsoever. One did it voluntarily. Right? Please
Google does not help in this connection, as it was a modern time invention, nothing to do with the Veda or " Vedic period".
If anybody or somebody does not agree with me on it, then one should quote from Yajurveda the "word Ahimsa" as per the title of the thread. Right? Please
Regards

Yajurveda uses frequently words :

1. "War/battles/foes/killing/army/commander" etc.
   
2. To guess from a lone word here or there expressing non-violence for an important creed is against the spirit of Yajurveda. Neither the word Ahimsa is used in the text nor many passage in favor of non-violence, so it would making a mountain of a molehill to hold that Ahimsa is from Yajurveda.
3. Ahimsa is a Post-Vedic invention.

The relevant question is, Why Post-Vedic people had to invent a creed against the teaching of Yajurveda?
Anybody, please
Regards

 

[Jainarayan]

The relevant question is, Why Post-Vedic people had to invent a creed against the teaching of Yajurveda?
Anybody, please
Regards

They didn't. Read the Bhagavad Gita.

 

[paarsurrey]

Is the word "Ahimsa" or nonviolence mentioned in Yajurveda?

Yajurveda CHAPTER XXXIV

20. Invincible in fight, saviour of armies, giver of happiness, giver
of life, protector of might, winner of battles, sovereign lord of the Earth,
exceeding famous, victor, in thee may we rejoice, O King.
https://archive.org/stream/yajurveda029670mbp/yajurveda029670mbp_djvu.txt
https://archive.org/stream/yajurveda029670mbp/yajurveda029670mbp_djvu.txt
Regards

 

[paarsurrey]

paarsurrey said: ↑
My point is that whatever the translation one takes, it is evident that it is not related , even remotely, to what is considered as the spirit of Ahimsa in general terms. Or is it?

You are right. This verse has no connection to 'ahimsa' (non-violence). You have to sift Google search results for relevant material. Google does not guarantee it.

Yajurveda CHAPTER XXXIII

61. We invoke the head of the State and the commander-in-chief,
strong, and dispellers of foes. May they be kind to us in the battle-field.
62. O teacher instruct in religious lore this student, anxious for
maintaining good character, and willing to honour the learned.
63. O venerable wealthy commander of the army, just as in the con-
flict between sun and cloud, rays make the sun victorious, so learned
persons encourage thee. O heroic person possessing horses shining like
the praiseworthy rays, the learned advance thee like lightning in the fight
between the sun and the cloud. Verily do these persons rejoice following
in thy wake and affording thee protection. O valorous person, just as the
sun with its host of winds imbibes water, so do thou drink with thy man
the juice of medicinal herbs.
64. O King, thy most wealthy mother has been nourishing thee a
hero; just as air strengthens the Sun, so learned persons strengthen thee.
Create pleasure, being mighty for victorious valour, exulting, strongest,
full of pride and courage.
65. O King, the slayer of foes, work hard for our advancement.
Mighty one, protect us with thy mighty aids.
66. Thou in thy battles, King, art subduer of all hostile bands.
Thou art the destroyer of the depraved, genitor of happinees, slayer of
foes, conqueror, vanquish the foes who wish to kill us.
https://archive.org/stream/yajurveda029670mbp/yajurveda029670mbp_djvu.txt

As one could observe Yajurveda uses frequently words :

1. "War/battles/foes/killing/army/commander of the army/slayer of foes/" etc.
   
2. To guess from a lone word here or there expressing non-violence for an important creed is against the spirit of Yajurveda. Neither the word Ahimsa is used in the text nor many passage in favor of non-violence, so it would making a mountain of a molehill to hold that Ahimsa is a teaching of Veda/Yajurveda.
3. Ahimsa is a Post-Vedic invention.

One should ,therefore, agree that Ahimsa has no basis in Veda/Yajurveda and it is an invention of Post-Vedic people . Right? Please
Anybody, please
Regards

 

[Aupmanyav]

My point is that whatever the translation one takes, it is evident that it is not related, even remotely, to what is considered as the spirit of Ahimsa in general terms. Or is it?

Again a quote from Devi Chand.

You are right. Ahimsa (non-violence) is considered good in Hinduism. But that does not mean that Hindus should not go to war if attacked or that they should not react if they are subjected to atrocities. In such cases, it is 'dharma' to fight fearlessly - as in Mahabharata - even if one's kin are involved. I do not see any problem in this. Do you in any way find this strange?

Griffith's translation:
61 The strong, dispellers of the foe, Indra and Agni, we invoke:
May they be kind to one like me.
62 Sing forth to Indu, O ye men, to him as he is purified,
Fain to pay worship to the Gods.
63 Drink Soma, Indra, handed with the Maruts who, Boon
Lord! strengthened thee at Ahi's slaughter,
Against Sambara, Lord of Bays! in winning cattle, and now
rejoice in thee, the holy singers.
64 Thou vast born mighty for victorious valour, exulting,
strongest, full of pride and courage.
There, even there the Maruts strengthened Indra when his
most rapid Mother stirred the Hero.
65 O thou who slewest Vritra, come, O Indra, hither to our side,
Mighty One with thy mighty aids.
66 Thou in thy battles, Indra, art subduer of all hostile bands.
Father art thou, all-conquering, cancelling the curse: vanquish
the men who fight with us.

It is a praise of their Gods and a prayer for protection. The king mentioned here is Indra. The reference to Sambara and Vritra is about the two-month long dark, cold Arctic night that Aryans had to face in their original home. These two were considered among the demons of darkness. Agni, Ashwinis, Maruts and other Gods, and the Aryan priests (Atharvans and Angirasas) were supposed to help Indra fight these demons. But I do not think you have the background to understand all this.

 

[paarsurrey]

It is a praise of their Gods and a prayer for protection. The king mentioned here is Indra. The reference to Sambara and Vritra is about the two-month long dark, cold Arctic night that Aryans had to face in their original home. These two were considered among the demons of darkness. Agni, Ashwinis, Maruts and other Gods, and the Aryan priests (Atharvans and Angirasas) were supposed to help Indra fight these demons. But I do not think you have the background to understand all this.

Is that mentioned in the Veda what I have colored in magenta?
I once read there are many theories in connection with people who came to India some say they came from Australia others say they came from China, still others say they came from Africa.

The First Human Race Came From Australia, NOT Africa!
Over the last decade, all manner of unexpected archaeological discoveries have led to many experts questioning much of what was assumed to be fact.Recent findings and field-work relating to little ‘hobbits’ in Flores Island, Siberian hominids with mtDNA connections to people of Papua New Guinea, the exclusivity of our distinct genetic Homo sapiens code being compromised by a 4% Neanderthal input, and a variety of unexpected findings have called into question many elemental assumptions held about the past.
http://humansarefree.com/2014/08/the-first-human-race-came-from.html

The Origin and History of the Aryans of Ancient India - Hinduwebsite.com
The article explores the facs and myths concerning the Aryans and their ... to one school of thought the Aryans came in hordes and first settled in northwestern India, ... central Asia, Russia, China and probably Arctic region by land and by sea.
http://www.hinduwebsite.com/hinduism/concepts/aryan.asp
Etc.
Are there any clues in Veda itself? That will be of my interest . It is also doubtful that "Arya" is/was a proper name of a race/tribe mentioned in Veda. Is it? Please

Regards

 

[Aupmanyav]

Yes, a long night extending for two months and a dawn extending to 30 days are mentioned in RigVeda, which would happen only in the polar regions. It is also mentioned in the Zoroastrian scriptures. Unfortunately, you will not be able to understand it clearly as you do not have the background. I am quoting from the many references in a book "Arctic Home in Vedas" by BG Tilak:

"The three Soma libations, here spoken of, are all made during the night and the Brâhmana (a Hindu scripture) further observes that there is no other deity save Indra and the Metres to whom they are offered (Cf. Apas. Sh. Su. XIV, 3, 12). The next section of the Brâhmana (IV, 6) distinctly raises the question, “How are the Pavamâna Stotras to be chanted for the purification of the Soma juice provided for the night, whereas such Sutras refer only to the day but not to the night?” and answers it by stating that the Stotras are the same for the day and the night. It is clear from this that Soma juice was extracted and purified at night during Ati-râtra sacrifice and Indra was the only deity to whom the libations were offered in order to help him in his fight with the Asuras, who had taken shelter with the darkness of the night. That the Ati-râtra is an ancient sacrifice is further proved by the occurrence of a similar ceremony in the Parsi scriptures.

The word Ati-râtra does not occur in the Avesta, but in the Vendidad, XVIII, 18, (43)-22 (48), we are told that there are three parts of the night and that in the first of these parts (trishvai), Fire, the son of Ahura Mazda, calls upon the master of the house to arise and put on his girdle and to fetch clean wood in order that he may burn bright; for, says the Fire, “Here comes Azi (Sans. Ahi) made by the Daêvas (Vedic Asuras), who is about to strive against me and wants to put out my life.” And the same request is made during the second and the third part of the night. The close resemblance between this and the three paryâyas of the Ati-râtra sacrifice does not seem to have been yet noticed; but whether noticed or not it shows that the Ati-râtra is an ancient rite performed during the night for the purpose of helping Indra, or the deity that fought with the powers of darkness, and that such sacrificial acts as putting on the girdle (kosti) or squeezing the Soma, were performed during this period of darkness."

 

[paarsurrey]

Yes, a long night extending for two months and a dawn extending to 30 days are mentioned in RigVeda, which would happen only in the polar regions. It is also mentioned in the Zoroastrian scriptures. Unfortunately, you will not be able to understand it clearly as you do not have the background. I am quoting from the many references in a book "Arctic Home in Vedas" by BG Tilak:

"The three Soma libations, here spoken of, are all made during the night and the Brâhmana (a Hindu scripture) further observes that there is no other deity save Indra and the Metres to whom they are offered (Cf. Apas. Sh. Su. XIV, 3, 12). The next section of the Brâhmana (IV, 6) distinctly raises the question, “How are the Pavamâna Stotras to be chanted for the purification of the Soma juice provided for the night, whereas such Sutras refer only to the day but not to the night?” and answers it by stating that the Stotras are the same for the day and the night. It is clear from this that Soma juice was extracted and purified at night during Ati-râtra sacrifice and Indra was the only deity to whom the libations were offered in order to help him in his fight with the Asuras, who had taken shelter with the darkness of the night. That the Ati-râtra is an ancient sacrifice is further proved by the occurrence of a similar ceremony in the Parsi scriptures.

The word Ati-râtra does not occur in the Avesta, but in the Vendidad, XVIII, 18, (43)-22 (48), we are told that there are three parts of the night and that in the first of these parts (trishvai), Fire, the son of Ahura Mazda, calls upon the master of the house to arise and put on his girdle and to fetch clean wood in order that he may burn bright; for, says the Fire, “Here comes Azi (Sans. Ahi) made by the Daêvas (Vedic Asuras), who is about to strive against me and wants to put out my life.” And the same request is made during the second and the third part of the night. The close resemblance between this and the three paryâyas of the Ati-râtra sacrifice does not seem to have been yet noticed; but whether noticed or not it shows that the Ati-râtra is an ancient rite performed during the night for the purpose of helping Indra, or the deity that fought with the powers of darkness, and that such sacrificial acts as putting on the girdle (kosti) or squeezing the Soma, were performed during this period of darkness."

Please enrich one's viewpoint by quoting from Veda/Yajurveda. It is such a voluminous narration that it should have not missed such points, rather it should be abundant with such narrations. Right? Please
Regards

 

[paarsurrey]

Is the word "Ahimsa" or nonviolence mentioned in Yajurveda?

Yajurveda CHAPTER I

28. O Almighty Lord Tbpu, hast suspended in space near Moon,
this Earth, full of foodstuffs, and producer of all the life-giving substances
for the living creatures. May the learned of refined intellect, full of
happiness, residing upon it, the well-wisher of all. abiding by Thy eternal
laws, conquer all foes waging severe fight with the aid of warriors and arms,
thus attain to power. O learned person, just as from times immemorial the
dutiful have been acquiring wealth, so do thou full of wealth worship God.
Let evil be eradicated.

https://archive.org/stream/yajurveda029670mbp/yajurveda029670mbp_djvu.txt

No mention of Ahimsa in Veda/Yajurveda, war, warriors and arms are mentioned in its and so often.
Regards

 

[paarsurrey]

Is the word "Ahimsa" or nonviolence mentioned in Yajurveda?

Yajurveda CHAPTER I

28. O Almighty Lord Tbpu, hast suspended in space near Moon,
this Earth, full of foodstuffs, and producer of all the life-giving substances
for the living creatures. May the learned of refined intellect, full of
happiness, residing upon it, the well-wisher of all. abiding by Thy eternal
laws, conquer all foes waging severe fight with the aid of warriors and arms,
thus attain to power. O learned person, just as from times immemorial the
dutiful have been acquiring wealth, so do thou full of wealth worship God.
Let evil be eradicated.
29. The wicked should be removed, the enemies of truth should be
punished ; those fit to be shackled should be cast aside and those opposed
to knowledge should come to grief. Oh destroyer of foes, Thou art not
wrathful, I prepare thee full of virility for battle.
Those who can't tolerate the good of others must be chastised,
and openly condemned. Those who cause harm to others should be
humiliated. I duly instruct the army to be strong for weakening the foe,
and waging war.

https://archive.org/stream/yajurveda029670mbp/yajurveda029670mbp_djvu.txt

No mention of Ahimsa in Veda/Yajurveda. War, warriors and arms are mentioned in it and so often.

Regards

 

[Jainarayan]

No mention of Ahimsa in Veda/Yajurveda. War, warriors and arms are mentioned in it and so often.

By the Gods, what is your point?

 

[shivsomashekhar]

No mention of Ahimsa in Veda/Yajurveda. War, warriors and arms are mentioned in it and so often.

Regards

You are confusing Pacifism with Ahimsa.

Ahimsa simply means non-injury. The idea is to not hurt anyone physically. But obviously, this does not apply in matters of war and self-defence.

Ahimsa is clearly mentioned in the Chandogya - attached to the Sama Veda.

 

[Aupmanyav]

"The three Soma libations, here spoken of, are all made during the night and the Brâhmana (a Hindu scripture) further observes that there is no other deity save Indra and the Metres to whom they are offered (Cf. Apas. Sh. Su. XIV, 3, 12).

The book referred here is Aitareya Brahmana which is part of RigVeda. Apas. Sh. Su. stands for Āpasthambha Shulb Sutra, another old ritual guide. Kindly note that I am quoting information only from the Vedas.

"Āpastamba Dharmasūtra is a Sanskrit text and one of the oldest Dharma-related texts of Hinduism that have survived into the modern age from the 1st-millennium BCE. It is one of three extant Dharmasutras texts from the Taittiriya school of Krishna Yajurveda, the other two being Baudhayana Dharmasutra and Hiranyakesin Dharmasutra. .. Kane estimated that Apastamba Dharmasutra dates from approximately 600-300 BCE, and later more narrowly to between 450-350 BCE." https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apastamba_Dharmasutra

 

[paarsurrey]

You are confusing Pacifism with Ahimsa.
Ahimsa simply means non-injury. The idea is to not hurt anyone physically. But obviously, this does not apply in matters of war and self-defence.
Ahimsa is clearly mentioned in the Chandogya - attached to the Sama Veda.

So Veda is silent on as to what is one's behavior in times of peace or normal times, when one has to make a self-defense and when one has to wag a war. Veda has left these normal issues on one's whims to decide, altogether. Right? Please
Anybody, please
Regards

 

[paarsurrey]

Is the word "Ahimsa" or nonviolence mentioned in Yajurveda?

No, the word "Ahimsa" has not been mentioned in Yajurveda. It is one of the main subjects of Veda/Yajurveda/Rigveda to talk of war/battles/kill/slay/destroy/attack than to talk of peace.

Regards

 

[Jainarayan]

Is the word "Ahimsa" or nonviolence mentioned in Yajurveda?

No, the word "Ahimsa" has not been mentioned in Yajurveda. It is one of the main subjects of Veda/Yajurveda/Rigveda to talk of war/battles/kill/slay/destroy/attack than to talk of peace.

Regards

You never have made your point. I asked you point blank in post #51 what is your point? If you can't or won't answer that, I can only assume that these posts are simply trolling.

 

[paarsurrey]

The point is the topic of the thread "Is the word "Ahimsa" or nonviolence mentioned in Yajurveda?" Please.
Regards

 

[Vinayaka]

The point is the topic of the thread "Is the word "Ahimsa" or nonviolence mentioned in Yajurveda?" Please.
Regards

And we've all said, 'yes it is' in one way or another. You haven't believed a single one of us. Now the point of this thread is 'Why haven't you believed us?" My guess is it is because you've been influenced by Muslim writers who have distorted the meaning if the Vedas for an agenda to prove that Hindus aren't as non-violent as we think we are. Is that it?

I quote directly from the Wikipedia article on ahimsa .... The term Ahimsa appears in the text Taittiriya Shakha of the Yajurveda (TS 5.2.8.7), where it refers to non-injury to the sacrificer himself.[23] It occurs several times in the Shatapatha Brahmana in the sense of "non-injury".[24] The Ahimsa doctrine is a late Vedic era development in Brahmanical culture.[25]

 

[paarsurrey]

And we've all said, 'yes it is' in one way or another. You haven't believed a single one of us. Now the point of this thread is 'Why haven't you believed us?" My guess is it is because you've been influenced by Muslim writers who have distorted the meaning if the Vedas for an agenda to prove that Hindus aren't as non-violent as we think we are. Is that it?
I quote directly from the Wikipedia article on ahimsa .... The term Ahimsa appears in the text Taittiriya Shakha of the Yajurveda (TS 5.2.8.7), where it refers to non-injury to the sacrificer himself.[23] It occurs several times in the Shatapatha Brahmana in the sense of "non-injury".[24] The Ahimsa doctrine is a late Vedic era development in Brahmanical culture.[25]

"Ahimsa doctrine is a late Vedic era development"
Is it not the same thing as a "Post-Vedic" development? Please
Regards

 

[Vinayaka]

Do you even know what 'post' means?