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Is This A Lie?

C

columbus

yawn <ignore> yawn
Britedream said:
Fallacy of argument, instead of posting what is you asked to do, you started attacking the Messenger, trying to find an excuse to run away.
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I am not attacking you. I am attacking your obnoxious arrogance.
I know English better than you do. Telling me that I am wrong about a common word is why I think that.
Tom
 
B

Britedream

Active Member
columbus said:
I am not attacking you. I am attacking your obnoxious arrogance.
I know English better than you do. Telling me that I am wrong about a common word is why I think that.
Tom
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I directed you to Washington and Lee University to show me whether it supports what you are saying. The obnoxious arrogance is in your part, where you think you are not prone to mistakes. so I don't see your post is an acceptable answer for what I asked you for.
 
Rick O'Shez

Rick O'Shez

Irishman bouncing off walls
Britedream said:
No problem with that at all, but what is a lie; it is an info told that doesn't coincide with the reality of what being told, whether intended or not. not all lies are bad.
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A lie involves the intention to deceive, it is an intentional untruth. That is how it is defined. Saying something you genuinely believe to be true is not a lie, even when it is factually not correct.

http://www.dictionary.com/browse/lie
 
C

columbus

yawn <ignore> yawn
Rick O'Shez said:
Saying something you genuinely believe to be true is not a lie, even when it is factually not correct.
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There is a big grey area though.
That's when people refuse to see evidence right in front of their noses because they prefer the beliefs that they already have.
That is a big problem, especially among religious people who already have a world view that isn't based on much evidence or reason.
Tom
 
Rick O'Shez

Rick O'Shez

Irishman bouncing off walls
columbus said:
There is a big grey area though.
That's when people refuse to see evidence right in front of their noses because they prefer the beliefs that they already have.
That is a big problem, especially among religious people who already have a world view that isn't based on much evidence or reason.
Tom
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The problem there is to do with wishful thinking, denial and confirmation bias. You could say it is a form of self-deception, but I wouldn't say it is a deliberate lie.
 
B

Britedream

Active Member
Rick O'Shez said:
A lie involves the intention to deceive, it is an intentional untruth. That is how it is defined. Saying something you genuinely believe to be true is not a lie, even when it is factually not correct.

http://www.dictionary.com/browse/lie
Click to expand...

Sorry, we already talked about it. it can be accompanied by an intend, but it doesn't have to. in your link, this is one of the definition of a lie "3.an inaccurate or false statement; a falsehood."
 
C

columbus

yawn <ignore> yawn
Rick O'Shez said:
The problem there is to do with wishful thinking, denial and confirmation bias. You could say it is a form of self-deception, but I wouldn't say it is a deliberate lie.
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Like I said, it's a big grey area.
How clear does the evidence have to be before a mistake becomes a lie?
Tom
 
Rick O'Shez

Rick O'Shez

Irishman bouncing off walls
columbus said:
Like I said, it's a big grey area.
How clear does the evidence have to be before a mistake becomes a lie?
Tom
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For as long as the person genuinely believes what they are saying to be true. If somebody is delusional, would you say they are lying?
 
C

columbus

yawn <ignore> yawn
Rick O'Shez said:
For as long as the person genuinely believes what they are saying to be true. If somebody is delusional, would you say they are lying?
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Yet another big grey area.
Does the mental acuity of a person matter?

I personally see people like Hovind more of a liar than the people he convinces of Creationism because I think he is smarter and better educated.
Tom
 
Skwim

Skwim

Veteran Member
savagewind said:
No. If the one telling the lie trusts that it is the truth he is the one lying.
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Err. . . . This is like saying anyone who eats pears is a pear-eater, which could probably be called an identity. It certainly isn't informative.

The person who hears isn't lying even if she trusts it is true.. But if that person passes it along as something she trusts is true, she lies. ........I am rethinking this.........I see my answer is wrong so I am going to try it again.
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:thumbsup:

A lie is a lie to the person lying even if nobody ever believes the untruth the liar told.
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:thumbsup:

.
 
C

columbus

yawn <ignore> yawn
Suppose Bob detests his nosy and gossipy coworker Jane, because she likes to eavesdrop and spread rumors.
So one day, when she is close by, he picks up his phone and dials his own phone number. He speaks in hushed voice to his answering machine about his and Janes boss. He whispers about an affair the boss is having with the department managers wife. It is pure fiction, but he is only saying it to a machine.
By the time Jane gets done with her gossiping, the boss knows who told his department manager this bogus story. But Jane can't explain how she learned this because Bob just shrugs and says "I dunno what she's talking about ".
Jane gets fired, in an unusually ugly way.

Did Bob lie?
Tom
 
U

ukok102nak

Active Member
~;> as they say
some people believe that showing someone who is a liar by showing how good your words are is just simply an alibi
coz for some people
a lie becomes a lie when someone
finds out your true intention

and
from what we've heard and
what we've seen is
some people are only saying the things that they've experienced
so arguing unto something that you dont even experience doesn't make you a liar
but
only showing how ignorant noobies you are unto the things that is known as the truth


:ty:





godbless
unto all always
 
Last edited:
savagewind

savagewind

Veteran Member
Premium Member
columbus said:
In English we make a difference between saying something wrong on purpose and saying something wrong accidentally. The first is a lie, the second is a mistake.
People make mistakes all the time. There is little blame for an "honest mistake". Lying is very different, knowing the truth and saying something else is where the blame comes from.

Yes. "lie" is a word in the English language and the way I use it is the meaning in English.
I suspect that the problem here is that you are translating an Arabic word into English, when the Arabic word doesn't really mean the exact same thing.
Perhaps @Smart_Guy could help explain the difference. His English is better than most USA.
Tom
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I think that people who call mistakes lies mean that the mistake is done over, and over, and over, again and is even taught to others to do it over and over and over again.

If I say I am going somewhere and after I change my mind, it would be called a mistake that I said I was going somewhere, but I didn't go there.
If I knew I was going someplace but I told someone I was going somewhere else, that would be lying imo even if it was for no reason what-so-ever.
 
U

ukok102nak

Active Member
~;> if someone who is a false witness
then it is true that a
false witness is telling a lie


:ty:




godbless
unto all always
 
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