Is Woke a religion?

[Shadow Wolf]

And here is a nice bit of "identity politics" performance art, I think you help me make my point

That you have an excuse for everything?

 

[Magic Man]

That's how immigration has been for decades.

Correct. That's immigration. It's not "traditional"; it's just immigration.

These days it's common for "the woke" to push for open borders and that's simply a bad approach to immigration.

Or, you know, this is just more propaganda from the right, much like most of your points. No one is pushing for open borders.

With that said, I'm all for substantially increasing aid in place policies.

Another example of you making my points for me. It ought to be clear to anyone reading this thread that when you stoop to strawman arguments like the one you just made, you don't have a good argument. Thank you!

In other words, you can't actually address the points made, so you hope to deceive people. The irony of you claiming someone else is using strawmen, though, is delicious. I mean, just above you claimed "the woke" are calling for something they're not.

But if your points are that your arguments are fallacious and wrong, then I'm glad I could help. What's clear to anyone rational reading this thread is that you're presenting a bunch of conservative nonsense, and I'm debunking it. This little ridiculous attempt by you only makes that point even clearer.

Now, if you want to actually address the points made, like the fact that MLK 100% supports the things you're arguing against here, be my guest. If you're just going to evade the points and instead try to win by deception, please move on.

 

[McBell]

The rise of Woke, cultural marxism, is it a religion?

For some people it is a realization.
For some others it is the main villain in their fantasy world.

I suspect there are a few who fall in between the two.

 

[icehorse]

That you have an excuse for everything?

A quick recap for anyone skimming thru this thread:

- I entered the thread listing some IDEAS I'm critical of.
- You have responded to my criticism of IDEAS by making it personal :O

In general, I don't think that making a debate personal is usually the sign of a strong argument.

 

[icehorse]

No one is pushing for open borders.

This response is similar to others I see, so I did a little research I and belief this might be called "an argument from self knowing":
Arguments from self-knowing take the form:

1. If P were true then I would know it; in fact I do not know it; therefore P cannot be true.
2. If Q were false then I would know it; in fact I do not know it; therefore Q cannot be false.

I sometimes call this the "it's not happening" argument. Of course when a poster says "it's not happening" they are - by definition - making an almost impossible to prove claim.

This gets back to other discussions about asking for citations. This is tricky to be sure, but from my perspective, this boils down to being well informed. As I read the news and articles, it's not my responsibility to take exhaustive notes so that I can provide citations for those people who aren't up to speed on a topic.

I have to say that relentless calls for citations or claims of "it's not happening" are holding less and less credibility to me.

In other words, you can't actually address the points made, so you hope to deceive people. The irony of you claiming someone else is using strawmen, though, is delicious. I mean, just above you claimed "the woke" are calling for something they're not.

And this is another example of the "it's not happening" argument. And of course if I take the time to find examples, then I can imagine hearing "oh, it's rare" or some such. Again, this relentless calling for citations is not compelling.

Now, if you want to actually address the points made, like the fact that MLK 100% supports the things you're arguing against here, be my guest. If you're just going to evade the points and instead try to win by deception, please move on.

I must have missed the notice that you were elected judge and arbiter of these debates, can you provide a link to that notice

 

[ChristineM]

The rise of Woke, cultural marxism, is it a religion?

As far as i know it's not tax exempt so no, it's not a religion

 

[Shadow Wolf]

A quick recap for anyone skimming thru this thread:

- I entered the thread listing some IDEAS I'm critical of.
- You have responded to my criticism of IDEAS by making it personal :O

In general, I don't think that making a debate personal is usually the sign of a strong argument.

I'm pointing out to you what you are doing. You are a man telling women they are misogynist for supporting trans people, even though in all reality men are more likely to be anti-trans. And instead of accepting this reality (most of my friends are cis-women, by the way)you just call women misogynist for doing what they're more likely to do.
We've seen you do this time and time again. This time instead of claiming someone is prejudiced you say it's "identity politics." Is it identity politics to point out men are way more likely to be Libertarian than women?

 

[LeftyLen]

What is religi

I'm pointing out to you what you are doing. You are a man telling women they are misogynist for supporting trans people, even though in all reality men are more likely to be anti-trans. And instead of accepting this reality (most of my friends are cis-women, by the way)you just call women misogynist for doing what they're more likely to do.
We've seen you do this time and time again. This time instead of claiming someone is prejudiced you say it's "identity politics." Is it identity politics to point out men are way more likely to be Libertarian than women?

defining terms is not 'personal'

 

[LeftyLen]

How exactly is being alert to discrimination denying science?

you mean like the objective truth that NeoMarxism is nothing like you are claiming?

on this op, i have gone into great detail how woke is indeed cultural marxism .

 

[LeftyLen]

you complain about wokism redefining words but you are her redefying the word woke

As one writer, i believe it was C.S.Lewis, " When men choose not to believe in God, they do not thereafter believe in nothing, they then become capable of believing in anything.”

We have seen this clearly, in recent history, in Soviet Marxism , and the Maoist Cultural Revolution, all promising a heaven on earth for "true believers " and, in each case, delivering a hell on earth for tens of millions of human beings who, failing to comply with the propaganda of these religion-substitutes, were the victims of their inhuman savagery... "canceled" by bullits. Today we have formed from the old Fabian socialism and the Frankfort school of Marxism a new emerging morbid dark religion called WOKE. This WOKISM is loathed and feared by all liberal right and center and is spreading fast - fed by the vacuum of secularism in America. The WOKE do not debate or engage in any dialogue with any one they disagree with. It is totalitarian by nature and conservatives fail to apprehend the danger of this new religion, whose members cancel by social media today yet tomorrow will cancel at the end of a barral of a gun. ( There are many who lived through Mao' s cultural revolution who are warning us of the similarity) they are secular fundamentalists.

In heaven we are all equal and we live in wonderful circumstances. Yet utopean Marxism promised people a wonderful life here on earth Now with the rise of cultural marxism here , "Wokism" with its intersectionality we have the same victimhood dogma.

 

[LeftyLen]

Basically, woke is a right-wing political tool, a way of dismissing criticism of one's own stupidity or vulgarity.

as one writer, i believe it was C.S.Lewis, " When men choose not to believe in God, they do not thereafter believe in nothing, they then become capable of believing in anything.”

We have seen this clearly, in recent history, in Soviet Marxism , and the Maoist Cultural Revolution, all promising a heaven on earth for "true believers " and, in each case, delivering a hell on earth for tens of millions of human beings who, failing to comply with the propaganda of these religion-substitutes, were the victims of their inhuman savagery... "canceled" by bullits. Today we have formed from the old Fabian socialism and the Frankfort school of Marxism a new emerging morbid dark religion called WOKE. This WOKISM is loathed and feared by all liberal right and center and is spreading fast - fed by the vacuum of secularism in America. The WOKE do not debate or engage in any dialogue with any one they disagree with. It is totalitarian by nature and conservatives fail to apprehend the danger of this new religion, whose members cancel by social media today yet tomorrow will cancel at the end of a barral of a gun. ( There are many who lived through Mao' s cultural revolution who are warning us of the similarity) they are secular fundamentalists.

In heaven we are all equal and we live in wonderful circumstances. Yet utopean Marxism promised people a wonderful life here on earth Now with the rise of cultural marxism here , "Wokism" with its intersectionality we have the same victimhood dogma.

 

[icehorse]

I'm pointing out to you what you are doing. You are a man telling women they are misogynist for supporting trans people, even though in all reality men are more likely to be anti-trans. And instead of accepting this reality (most of my friends are cis-women, by the way)you just call women misogynist for doing what they're more likely to do.
We've seen you do this time and time again. This time instead of claiming someone is prejudiced you say it's "identity politics." Is it identity politics to point out men are way more likely to be Libertarian than women?

No you're taking statistical claims and trying to make them personal

 

[Argentbear]

on this op, i have gone into great detail how woke is indeed cultural marxism .

""Cultural Marxism" refers to a far-right antisemitic conspiracy theory that misrepresents the Frankfurt School as being responsible for modern progressive movements, identity politics, and political correctness. The conspiracy theory posits that there is an ongoing and intentional academic and intellectual effort to subvert Western society via a planned culture war that undermines the supposed Christian values of traditionalist conservatism and seeks to replace them with culturally liberal values"

 

[LeftyLen]

I'm not telling you anything that you don't already know here, but I want to summarize:

Yes, it's the latest form of derogation of the humanistic movement to make everybody an equal in American society. Others include political correctness, and social warrior justice.

Whenever you see any of these, or derogatory references to CRT or DEI, you know where the get their information from and you know a little about their character for being offended that humanists want to enable people. In the past, blacks seeking equality were called uppity, women lesbians or too independent, and atheists militant.

It's all the same and for the same purpose - maintain white, male, Christian superiority and privilege. If you feel insecure or like you can't successfully compete against everybody without an advantage, then you'll be drawn to this kind of thinking, and without fail, will embrace multiple bigotries.

Your writing betrays your sources: conservative indoctrination media, which among other things, objects to social and economic opportunity for all. Apparently, they've found a kindred spirit in you. Can we assume that you're also MAGA?

Wokeism is an attack on elitism, and it is as old as the Enlightenment, liberalism, and then progressivism (humanism). It's been a centuries long struggle to "liberate" the concentrated wealth, power, and privilege from the few, who are fighting against equality to "conserve" those things for themselves. Your job is to help them by uncritically and with disregard for the wellbeing of others bring messages like these to the public.

And Christian, too, albeit dangerously close to a Marxist. What's all this talk about equality, comrade? Your information sources have no use for equality. And apparently neither do you.

I doubt it.

You degrade the meanings of three words in one short sentence: literally (try figuratively), religion (try ideology), and woke (try empathetic or socially conscious).

Weren't you complaining about redefining words?

Woke is not liberalism, it is leftism. its commonality with marxism is striking The Woke mob departs somewhat from the Marxists of the last hundred years, dressing themselves up in slightly different rhetoric replacing economics with race and sex. Having grown up around fundamentalists and now seeing the growth of Woke there is little to differentiate the secular Woke from the fundamentalists, the similarities are in fact striking.



--The Woke have replaced Marx's ‘proletariat’ with ‘marginalized. ’



--Marx's ‘economic struggle’ is now replaced by ‘intersectionality.‘



--Marx’s utopian fantasy, from socialism to communism has been replaced with the woke fantasy of, ’ inclusive equitable society.’ Both fundamentalism and the woke entertain grand fantasies, utopian visions.



-Marx openly hated democracy which he saw as empowering oppressor/ victim, giving more power to the bourgeoisie with greater abilities to exploit the proletariat. The Woke, unlike liberals are not concerned with equality of opportunity but the equality of outcome. The woke, unlike the traditional Marxists see oppressor/victim as primarily racial and sexual with only an omnipotent state structure the means to enforce ‘equity.’ Democratic institutions to the woke are inherently phobe-hater-bigot-fascist, and racist, and, in lockstep with Marxism, as a consequence must be overturned.



---For the Marxist totalitarian the collectivist ideal is the goal, not the individual who must be subservient to the collective ideals, that has stayed the same with the emergence of Woke.



--Both protestant fundamentalism and Woke hold subjectivity above objective facts rendering both religions, their narratives, dogmatically foisted are religious claims.



--A common saying among the Woke faithful is ‘Your truth/my truth’ meaning no objective standard for truth exists. The fundamentalists say they know something is true ‘in their heart,’ further examples of both being religious.

 

[LeftyLen]

How do you tell when "the woke" are tossing the terms around loosely from when "the work" are tossing them around accurately?

If one is entrenched forever in the victim oppressor narrative ..

 

[LeftyLen]

So you can do that on in effect value judgements for good/bad and what matters?

Someone once wrote "one of the best ways to fight evil i to accept objective reality no matter what the consequences , a maxim i value.

 

[Argentbear]

Woke is not liberalism, it is leftism. its commonality with marxism is striking The Woke mob departs somewhat from the Marxists of the last hundred years, dressing themselves up in slightly different rhetoric replacing economics with race and sex. Having grown up around fundamentalists and now seeing the growth of Woke there is little to differentiate the secular Woke from the fundamentalists, the similarities are in fact striking.





-Marx openly hated democracy which he saw as empowering oppressor/ victim, giving more power to the bourgeoisie with greater abilities to exploit the proletariat. The Woke, unlike liberals are not concerned with equality of opportunity but the equality of outcome. The woke, unlike the traditional Marxists see oppressor/victim as primarily racial and sexual with only an omnipotent state structure the means to enforce ‘equity.’ Democratic institutions to the woke are inherently phobe-hater-bigot-fascist, and racist, and, in lockstep with Marxism, as a consequence must be overturned.

"Science and democracy are the right and left hands of what I'll refer to as the move from the realm of necessity to the realm of freedom." Karl Marx

 

[LeftyLen]

All I saw was blah blah blah I can't be bothered to accurately portray this so instead heres some stuff I'll parot from highly biased RW sources.

My own writings from my own musings, conclusions,, again its cultural marxism, now the Woke mob departs somewhat from the Marxists of the last hundred years, dressing themselves up in slightly different rhetoric replacing economics with race and sex. Having grown up around fundamentalists and now seeing the growth of Woke there is little to differentiate the secular Woke from the fundamentalists, the similarities are in fact striking.



--The Woke have replaced Marx's ‘proletariat’ with ‘marginalized. ’



--Marx's ‘economic struggle’ is now replaced by ‘intersectionality.‘



--Marx’s utopian fantasy, from socialism to communism has been replaced with the woke fantasy of, ’ inclusive equitable society.’ Both fundamentalism and the woke entertain grand fantasies, utopian visions.



-Marx openly hated democracy which he saw as empowering oppressor/ victim, giving more power to the bourgeoisie with greater abilities to exploit the proletariat. The Woke, unlike liberals are not concerned with equality of opportunity but the equality of outcome. The woke, unlike the traditional Marxists see oppressor/victim as primarily racial and sexual with only an omnipotent state structure the means to enforce ‘equity.’ Democratic institutions to the woke are inherently phobe-hater-bigot-fascist, and racist, and, in lockstep with Marxism, as a consequence must be overturned.



---For the Marxist totalitarian the collectivist ideal is the goal, not the individual who must be subservient to the collective ideals, that has stayed the same with the emergence of Woke.



--Both protestant fundamentalism and Woke hold subjectivity above objective facts rendering both religions, their narratives, dogmatically foisted are religious claims.



--A common saying among the Woke faithful is ‘Your truth/my truth’ meaning no objective standard for truth exists. The fundamentalists say they know something is true ‘in their heart,’ further examples of both being religious.

 

[LeftyLen]

""Cultural Marxism" refers to a far-right antisemitic conspiracy theory that misrepresents the Frankfurt School as being responsible for modern progressive movements, identity politics, and political correctness. The conspiracy theory posits that there is an ongoing and intentional academic and intellectual effort to subvert Western society via a planned culture war that undermines the supposed Christian values of traditionalist conservatism and seeks to replace them with culturally liberal values"

Its religious, as well as neo marxist, ones ethnic religion are ireelevant, other than woke is religious. now the Woke mob departs somewhat from the Marxists of the last hundred years, dressing themselves up in slightly different rhetoric replacing economics with race and sex. Having grown up around fundamentalists and now seeing the growth of Woke there is little to differentiate the secular Woke from the fundamentalists, the similarities are in fact striking.



--The Woke have replaced Marx's ‘proletariat’ with ‘marginalized. ’



--Marx's ‘economic struggle’ is now replaced by ‘intersectionality.‘



--Marx’s utopian fantasy, from socialism to communism has been replaced with the woke fantasy of, ’ inclusive equitable society.’ Both fundamentalism and the woke entertain grand fantasies, utopian visions.



-Marx openly hated democracy which he saw as empowering oppressor/ victim, giving more power to the bourgeoisie with greater abilities to exploit the proletariat. The Woke, unlike liberals are not concerned with equality of opportunity but the equality of outcome. The woke, unlike the traditional Marxists see oppressor/victim as primarily racial and sexual with only an omnipotent state structure the means to enforce ‘equity.’ Democratic institutions to the woke are inherently phobe-hater-bigot-fascist, and racist, and, in lockstep with Marxism, as a consequence must be overturned.



---For the Marxist totalitarian the collectivist ideal is the goal, not the individual who must be subservient to the collective ideals, that has stayed the same with the emergence of Woke.



--Both protestant fundamentalism and Woke hold subjectivity above objective facts rendering both religions, their narratives, dogmatically foisted are religious claims.



--A common saying among the Woke faithful is ‘Your truth/my truth’ meaning no objective standard for truth exists. The fundamentalists say they know something is true ‘in their heart,’ further examples of both being religious.

 

[blü 2]

in depth analysis?

I don't think it's a deep concept, just another tool of one aspect of human nature.