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Islam will dominate!

Badran

Veteran Member
Premium Member
there lies the point, why being an evil person naturally, a buddhist cannot carry out something cruel in the name of his religion? while at the same time muslims (not everyone) does evil in the name of islam? why islam did became a factor for a numerous crimes while buddhism did not when there are evil peoples in both the faiths?

First, let's separate between the idea of someone doing a crime in the name of his/her religion, and between someone who follows a certain religion and does a crime in general. So, for the second part, i'm saying that some buddhists, surely have committed crimes (not in the name of their religion, but in general), just like any other religionists. Do you agree?

As for why some Muslims have committed crimes in the name of their religion, while a buddhists haven't, i didn't study the buddhists history, so i'm not sure how i'm going to address this, but let's clear up the idea above first.

However, i will of course admit that some Muslims in history have committed crimes in the name of their religion, just like any other religion, excluding buddhism for now, until we figure out a way to talk about that. So, Islam is no different than any other religion, it just contains evil doers who justified their actions by their religion. Some of them in my opinion were lying in those claims, just like some are today, and some of them actually thought that this is truly the teachings of Islam. Again, just like any other religion.

If you agree on the first part of my post, then what is left is the part about no buddhist ever doing a cruel thing in the name of their religion.
 
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Badran

Veteran Member
Premium Member
why islam did became a factor for a numerous crimes while buddhism did not when there are evil peoples in both the faiths?

Okay, as i understand (please correct me if i'm wrong) that pacifism is kind of a buddhist accepted concept, or a taught concept, or part of the faith in someway or another, right?
 

Haris19

Member
when did i justified hindu extremism? kindly show such posts of mine....i repeately said in every my posts that i dont justify hindu extremsism.
I had just claimed that it was christian missionaries who started the violance first. In the whole history of india this is the only case where christians got attacked, that when christian missionaries attacked hindus first.

You are simply lieing.Can u tell me which nun attacked an innocent hindu??I cant remember having heard any such news but i do remember hearing news of extremists hindus vandalizing churches ,attacking vehicles carrying nuns who were simply going to preach their faith(this happened in Kerala).I havent seen anything in your previous posts condemning such attacks.Your responses were some thing like"THEY STARTED IT FIRST" always.It is quite obvious from your statements that you seek to justify the crimes committed by Hindu fanatics but have major issues with the alleged crimes committed by Muslim/Christian fanatics.

And FYI ,i do not see wikepedia as a 100% reliable source of Information and the below article from Wikepedia will show why.This is something completely different what u have presented.Finally,i would like you to show the courage to condemn such attacks and not try to find justifications no matter who commits it.I would also like to make my stand very clear to you.I absolutely and completely condemn acts of violence committed against innocents by Muslim/hindu/christian fanatics in the name of religion in the past or the present.

Peace!

Hindu extremism in India

Main article: Anti-Christian violence in India
See also: Religious violence in Orissa
Further information: Freedom of religion in India
In India, there is an increasing amount of violence being perpetrated by Hindu Nationalists against Christians.[149] The increase in anti-Christian violence in India bears a direct relationship to the ascendancy of the Bharatiya Janata Party (BJP).[150] Incidents of violence against Christians have occurred in many parts of India. It is especially prevalent in the States of Gujarat, Maharashtra, Uttar Pradesh, Madhya Pradesh and New Delhi.[150] The Vishva Hindu Parishad (VHP), the Bajrang Dal, the Rashtriya Swayamsevak Sangh (RSS) are the most responsible organizations for violence against Christians.[151] These organizations, which are off-shoot organizations of their umbrella organization, the Rashtriya Swayamsevak Sangh (RSS) also known as the Sangh Parivar, and local media were involved in promoting anti-Christian propaganda in Gujarat.[151] The Sangh Parivar and related organisations have stated that the violence is an expression of "spontaneous anger" of "vanvasis" against "forcible conversion" activities undertaken by missionaries. These claims have been disputed by Christians[152] a belief described as mythical[153] and propaganda by Sangh Parivar;[154] the Parivar objects in any case to all conversions as a "threat to national unity".[155]
In recent years, there has been a sharp increase in violent attacks on Christians in India. From 1964 to 1996, thirty-eight incidents of violence against Christians were reported.[150] In 1997, twenty-four such incidents were reported.[156] In 1998, it went up to ninety.[158] The acts of violence include arson of churches, forcible conversion of Christians to Hinduism, distribution of threatening literature, burning of Bibles, murder of Christian priests and destruction of Christian schools, colleges, and cemeteries.[150][151] The attacks often accompanied by large amounts of anti-Christian hate literature.[158]
In some cases, anti-Christian violence has been co-ordinated, involving multiple attacks. In 2007 Orissa violence Christians were attacked in Kandhamal, Orissa, resulting in 9 deaths and destruction of houses and churches.[159][160] Nearly twelve churches were targeted in the attack by Hindu activists.[161][162][163] Human rights groups consider the violence as the failure of the state government that did not address the problem before it became violent. The authorities failed to react quickly enough to save human lives and property.[164]
Foreign Christian missionaries have also been targets of attacks. In a well-publicised case Graham Staines, an Australian missionary, was burnt to death while he was sleeping with his two sons Timothy (aged 9) and Philip (aged 7) in his station wagon at Manoharpur village in Keonjhar district in Orissa in January 1999.
A representative of the local government in Orissa estimated that more than 500 people died as a consequence of the anti-Christian pogrom launched by Hindu fundamentalists. He said he personally authorised the cremation of at least 200 bodies.[173] In July 2, 2008 a priest was murdered by an obscure local group called Nepal Defence Army, which wanted Hinduism restored as the state religion, and has claimed responsibility for the murder of Johnson Moyalan.[174] .In September 14, 2008, the Hindu fundamentalist organizations Bajrang Dal directed a wave of attacks against Christian churches, convents and prayer halls in the Indian city of Mangalore. The attacks started in response to the allegation by the Bajrang Dal that the New Life Fellowship Trust, a non-denominational Christian Church, was indulging in forceful religious conversion of Hindus. Another reason was that the book Satyadarshini in which New Life Trust had denigrated and defamed Hindu gods. Over 20 churches were attacked during the course of the attacks, nearly all of them belonging to the Roman Catholic community. Some Hindu groups argue that Christian missionaries use inducements such as schooling to lure poor people to the faith. As a result, they have launched movements to reconvert many tribal Christians back to Hinduism. A consolidation of various Anti-Conversion or "Freedom of Religion" Laws has been done by the All Indian Christian Council.[180] In the past, several Indian states passed anti-conversion bills primarily to prevent people from converting to Christianity.
 

LuisDantas

Aura of atheification
Premium Member
Okay, as i understand (please correct me if i'm wrong) that pacifism is kind of a buddhist accepted concept, or a taught concept, or part of the faith in someway or another, right?

I wish. It is unfortunately quite true that a few misguided people who call themselves buddhists commit atrocious acts in the name of their beliefs. Google for "sarin gas tokyo" sometime.

Of course, I don't for a moment think they were correct in their understanding of Buddhism, either. Nor am I that surprised - Buddha Dharma is not magical. Meeting it (or something that claims to be it, anyway) does not automatically make one sane and peaceful.
 

Yaqub

Member
I wish. It is unfortunately quite true that a few misguided people who call themselves buddhists commit atrocious acts in the name of their beliefs. Google for "sarin gas tokyo" sometime.

Of course, I don't for a moment think they were correct in their understanding of Buddhism, either. Nor am I that surprised - Buddha Dharma is not magical. Meeting it (or something that claims to be it, anyway) does not automatically make one sane and peaceful.

That cult in Japan aren't the only Buddhists who give a bad name to Buddhism. In Sri Lanka, the Sinhalese, who are predominantly Buddhist, are having a major conflict with the Tamils, who are mostly Hindu. Many Buddhist monks have become involved in this conflict. Also, many Buddhist monks in Tibet are involved in armed struggle and resistance against the Chinese government. There were recent reports of the Chinese government discovering large cache of weapons and amunition in Buddhist monasteries. The pont is that like Buddhism, Muslims are involved in violence and armed resistance, but this is mostly political, with people using the name of religion for political purpose. Thus, these politically motivated "religious zealots" end up giving a bad name to their religion.
 

DeitySlayer

President of Chindia
However, i will of course admit that some Muslims in history have committed crimes in the name of their religion

This is the part Fatihah and 301 ouncer are unable to grasp. As soon as there is proof of a crime against Muslims, that automatically means that everything that documents an atrocity by Muslims is false. The attempt to force Arjan Dev to convert, by Jahangir, was in the name of Islam. I could go by and not contest the motive; but they deny that it even happened, and this I cannot let pass.

BTW, for Buddhist violence, I believe there was something in Tokyo a while back where some extreme splinter group tried to release sarin gas into a metro station.
 
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Badran

Veteran Member
Premium Member
I wish. It is unfortunately quite true that a few misguided people who call themselves buddhists commit atrocious acts in the name of their beliefs. Google for "sarin gas tokyo" sometime.

Of course, I don't for a moment think they were correct in their understanding of Buddhism, either. Nor am I that surprised - Buddha Dharma is not magical. Meeting it (or something that claims to be it, anyway) does not automatically make one sane and peaceful.

Well, that was .lava's point basically i think. No matter what your religions teachings are, or your beliefs are, it can never be free of bad examples.

So, is it possible for someone to manage to justify any violent acts under buddhist teachings?
 
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Fatihah

Well-Known Member
Friend fatihah,


Those who muslims imply that there exists those who are not and that is the english that every one learns and understands and since your mind is incapable to accepting your own words as TRUTTH there are no one to change that which your MIND disallows to accept.

Your mind is free to twist your own words and make you feel it the turth but all readers here know and understand that humans are from the same source and every religion is only a way to journey inwards to understand the *self* and that no way or path or religion can dominate as there are thousands of ways/path /religions to reach to the same understanding of the *self*.

Love & rgds

Response: Yes. It implies that there are those who are not muslims, not "humans", as you tried to portray earlier. Thus the only twist is on your part.
 

Badran

Veteran Member
Premium Member
This is the part Fatihah and 301 ouncer are unable to grasp. As soon as there is proof of a crime against Muslims, that automatically means that everything that documents an atrocity by Muslims is false. The attempt to force Arjan Dev to convert, by Jahangir, was in the name of Islam. I could go by and not contest that; but they deny that it even happened, and this I cannot let pass.

I understand completely your position here.

BTW, for Buddhist violence, I believe there was something in Tokyo a while back where some extreme splinter group tried to release sarin gas into a metro station.

Yes, i looked it up.
 

Fatihah

Well-Known Member
This is the part Fatihah and 301 ouncer are unable to grasp. As soon as there is proof of a crime against Muslims, that automatically means that everything that documents an atrocity by Muslims is false. The attempt to force Arjan Dev to convert, by Jahangir, was in the name of Islam. I could go by and not contest the motive; but they deny that it even happened, and this I cannot let pass.

BTW, for Buddhist violence, I believe there was something in Tokyo a while back where some extreme splinter group tried to release sarin gas into a metro station.


Response: The proof that you have that this actually took place is zero. Amazing how non-muslims try to say that muslims advocate violence, yet throughout this thread, it's been you pushing falsified acts of violence. Does your hypocrisy have an end, or is this some new atheist thinking?
 

LuisDantas

Aura of atheification
Premium Member
Well, that was .lava's point basically i think.

I agree.

No matter what your religions teachings are, or your beliefs are, it can never be free of bad examples.

Certainly. Even assuming each and every religion to be pure and perfect (not exactly a consensus, but bear with me), there is no doubt in my mind that religious people don't always assimilate the teachings of their own faiths correctly and constructively.

Thought luck, and more than a little bit unpleasant to realize. But it is reality and we ought to notice that and react in a mature, adequate way.

So, is it possible for someone to manage to justify any violent acts under buddhist teachings?

One could argue on whether they are correctly understood - as I am sure you're realized already :) - but certainly, it can happen and it does happen.

I am simply not aware of any faith that has such a magical power of being abuse-proof, myself.
 

Badran

Veteran Member
Premium Member
Certainly. Even assuming each and every religion to be pure and perfect (not exactly a consensus, but bear with me), there is no doubt in my mind that religious people don't always assimilate the teachings of their own faiths correctly and constructively.

Thought luck, and more than a little bit unpleasant to realize. But it is reality and we ought to notice that and react in a mature, adequate way.

I completely agree.

One could argue on whether they are correctly understood - as I am sure you're realized already :) - but certainly, it can happen and it does happen.

I am simply not aware of any faith that has such a magical power of being abuse-proof, myself.

I would certainly not assume that they are correct in their understanding, specially because i myself believe that Muslims who justify violence under the teachings of Islam have no understanding about what Islam's teachings really are.
 

.lava

Veteran Member
I would certainly not assume that they are correct in their understanding, specially because i myself believe that Muslims who justify violence under the teachings of Islam have no understanding about what Islam's teachings really are.

my thoughts exactly

.
 

301ouncer

Well-Known Member
Actually, 301ouncer, I don't think you're deserving that much attention. It is your privilege to accuse secularism out of thin air and without evidence, support or even a logical reason to. And it is my privilege to recognize that attitude of yours as the immature and unjust rant that it is and treat it accordingly.

At least I do not live in a 4x4 box and blind to all these secularisim system and its fruits:

Baby Stabbed: Newborn in Fullerton Stabbed to Death, Teen Mom Charged - latimes.com

Humanity is going back to when fathers/mothers bury their daughters alive in pagan arabia because of wanting sons rather then daughters.

I have no duty to indulge your unfair accusations, and I may very well have some degree of duty to discourage them.

In this case :no:. You will be the forerunner and supporter of the upcoming anti-christ system after the certain death of its secular sister. :yes:
 

301ouncer

Well-Known Member
Crimes happens everywhere in the world all the time. Secularism nor Theocracy prevent people from committing crimes.

ok. you saying they have a religion, which is it? :confused:

or is it more accurate to say that the depression levels in secular states are hitting levels mankind has ever seen. :yes:

you will always end up coming back to secularisim which is the main cause of depression. :sarcastic
 

301ouncer

Well-Known Member
BBC News | MIDDLE EAST | Saudi police 'stopped' fire rescue

Muslim girls stopped from leaving a burning building in Saudi Arabia because they were not in proper Islamic dress. Note this is the same outstandingly accurate source from which 301 ouncer quoted his disproof of the Muslim firebombing of the train in India.

nothing in comparsion to secular states. secularisim in the east and the west dwarfs the religious and the god denying populas. all of them no exeption. :cool:
 

xkatz

Well-Known Member
ok. you saying they have a religion, which is it? :confused:

or is it more accurate to say that the depression levels in secular states are hitting levels mankind has ever seen. :yes:

you will always end up coming back to secularisim which is the main cause of depression. :sarcastic

Secularism has nothing to do religion. Most people in secular countries have a religion and/or religious belief of some sort (except in Communist countries, damn you Commies :D), but that is not the point of secularism.

Depression is not caused by people living in secular society. Rather it is caused by their own internal strife and other factors (such as if they are physically healthy).
 

301ouncer

Well-Known Member
Response: And to this Badran, I am forced to agree.

barakAllah u feek akhi al habib. subhanallah someone can feel the presence of a true follower of the alhul sunnah wa jamah from miles away.

you went miles to give me your beloved brother 70 excuses as to the slander of the slanderers. you my beloved brother i am without a shadow of doubt a follower in the footsteps of the sahaba ra.

if only so called secular muslims follow in your example and give their brothers and sisters 70 excuses. but alas they go the extra mile and give no excuses before imprisoning them and torturing them.
 
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