Israel Declares War After Hamas Attacks

[lokinforpeace]

"Jerusalem/Gaza, Oct. 7 (EFE) – Heavy Israeli bombardment of Gaza, more than 3,000 rockets fired from the Strip into Israel,

Gaza is part of Israel
I checked, I was wrong
The Gaza Strip (/ˈɡɑːzə/ ⓘ; Arabic: قِطَاعُ غَزَّةَ Qiṭāʿ Ġazzah [qɪˈtˤɑːʕ ˈɣaz.za]), or simply Gaza, is a narrow piece of land on the eastern coast of the Mediterranean Sea, bordered by Israel to the east and north, and Egypt to the southwest. With a population of 2 million, on some 365 square kilometers, Gaza, if considered a top-level political unit, ranks as the third most densely populated in the world. It is one of the two Palestinian territories, together with the West Bank. Since 2007, the Gaza Strip has been under the rule of the political and militant Islamist group Hamas, governing it as an oppressive, de facto one-party state.
Gaza Strip - Wikipedia
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[Unfettered]

“Israel Declares War”

Wow, Israel declares war on a small community, not a country.

In return Jordan, Egypt, Syria, and the other neighboring countries will declare war on Israel & the sooner the better.

Israel declared war on Hamas, not on a community, or on Jordan, Egypt, Syria, Iran, or other neighboring Arab nations.

Just wanted to clarify.

Israel declares war, bombards Gaza and battles to dislodge Hamas fighters after surprise attack

Israeli soldiers are battling Hamas fighters in the streets of southern Israel and launching strikes across Gaza. A brief exchange of strikes with Lebanon’s Hezbollah in the north raised fears of a broader conflict.

apnews.com

 

[Bthoth]

Israel declared war on Hamas, not on Jordan, Egypt, Syria, Iran, or other neighboring Arab nations. Just wanted to clarify.

I noted the same exact joke of what that big bibi nutlessyahoo said on TV. "WE are at war!'

On what?

Concentration camp GAZA is still israel.

 

[Bthoth]

“Israel Declares War”

Wow, Israel declares war on a small community, not a country.

concentration camp GAZA is still israel.

In return Jordan, Egypt, Syria, and the other neighboring countries will declare war on Israel & the sooner the better.

Stop even talking like that. Each of them countries have reason for many other atrocities but what HAMAS did was wrong and there is no excuse.

I am guessing that leveling GAZA will just open up rooms to move the west bank palestinians down there just like they did when they illegally occupied Jerusalem.

 

[Left Coast]

“Israel Declares War”

Wow, Israel declares war on a small community, not a country.

In return Jordan, Egypt, Syria, and the other neighboring countries will declare war on Israel & the sooner the better.

Looking for peace...but wishing for war.

The irony.

 

[Unfettered]

I noted the same exact joke of what that big bibi nutlessyahoo said on TV. "WE are at war!'

On what?

Concentration camp GAZA is still israel.

Israel isn't forcing anyone in Gaza to stay there. Egypt and Hamas are.

 

[Left Coast]

Good job Joe.

 

[Bthoth]

Israel isn't forcing anyone in Gaza to stay there. Egypt and Hamas are.

Just the fencing and blockade of land air and sea. Would you leave your country because a different religious group claims that they have a right to your land/community by god?
Please do not suggest that palestinians have no right to the levant. That rude mindset is why so much hatred for the west.

 

[Unfettered]

Just the fencing and blockade of land air and sea. Would you leave your country because a different religious group claims that they have a right to your land/community by god?
Please do not suggest that palestinians have no right to the levant. That rude mindset is why so much hatred for the west.

There are three issues wrapped in to your reply.

1. Blockade

Does Israel impose blockades outside of war-time?

2. Defense of one's claimed land

I can't answer for another person the question of when to stay or leave. Too many factors to account for. Sometimes it makes sense to leave and make a home elsewhere. Other times, to stay and fight. Each must decide for himself where the line is drawn.

3. Palestinians right to the Levant.

Nature affords no one a right to land any that can't be defended against encroachment. Within this overarching and unavoidable reality, human societies settle the question through agreement or war.

If, therefore, the Palestinians in Gaza claim a right to the land, those who don't agree with their claim must either be persuaded to agree through diplomacy, or be compelled to agree through defeat on the battlefield. Otherwise their claim is null. That's reality.

The problem faced by the Gazans is that independently they are in a position neither to negotiate or expel. And for all the hand-wringing and finger-wagging that is done about their plight, no nation on this planet actually cares about the Palestinians' claim to the land because no nation will actually help them secure the land. That applies to the individual, as well as to nations.

Don't misunderstand what I'm saying there. People and nations claim to care about the Gazans and actually show that they do care by contributing to their aid. But, at this point in history, until one goes there in person to compel the people in Israel, Syria, Jordan and Lebanon to surrender their land to establish "the Levant," it's all just lip service to the broader Palestinian peoples' claim to the land.

I have compassion for all those who suffer in the conflict, but I have nothing to do with the question of whose land it is. That is for the people to sort out who have the conflicting claims, and for those outsiders who are willing to die for one side or the other. Since before my liftime, there have been precious few of the latter—but no shortage of armchair Palestinian patriots.

 

[Lyndon]

Spoken as a true Christian?????

 

[Unfettered]

Spoken as a true Christian?????

No, just spoken as a realist.

 

[Lyndon]

Well then call yourself a realist not a Christian, because they're not the same thing

 

[Unfettered]

Well then call yourself a realist not a Christian, because they're not the same thing

I believe I understand what you're saying.

 

[Bthoth]

There are three issues wrapped in to your reply.

1. Blockade

Does Israel impose blockades outside of war-time?

Absolutely and why the fencing is there. Not to mention control of water, fuel and supplies. Those last three should never have been allowed by the global community.

2. Defense of one's claimed land

I can't answer for another person the question of when to stay or leave. Too many factors to account for. Sometimes it makes sense to leave and make a home elsewhere. Other times, to stay and fight. Each must decide for himself where the line is drawn.

I agree, they should have just left but the population is so uneducated, that they can barely support themselves in a civilized community. The majority of the population are just children and old women.

3. Palestinians right to the Levant.

Nature affords no one a right to land any that can't be defended against encroachment. Within this overarching and unavoidable reality, human societies settle the question through agreement or war.

Does not mean that is right. The US came into the affair based on strategic benefits, not empathy for a Jewish state, as often sold to the public.
That arm pit is practically worthless, except for religious needs.

If, therefore, the Palestinians in Gaza claim a right to the land, those who don't agree with their claim must either be persuaded to agree through diplomacy, or be compelled to agree through defeat on the battlefield. Otherwise their claim is null. That's reality.

Sad rational, especially realizing US tax dollars have been the main reason the over powering side has even been equipped to condemn the indigenous locals with violence and oppression.

The problem faced by the Gazans is that independently they are in a position neither to negotiate or expel. And for all the hand-wringing and finger-wagging that is done about their plight, no nation on this planet actually cares about the Palestinians' claim to the land because no nation will actually help them secure the land. That applies to the individual, as well as to nations.

Yep.... the palestinians are surrounded by countries that don't play was as easily as 'we the people' do. War is about business, not empathy or doing what is right. Using people for the business of war, is about natural to our leadership and has been ongoing for a long time.

Oppressing human beings does and has created some crazy monsters not to mention using religion as a tool to defend the bigotry of conditioned priority.

Don't misunderstand what I'm saying there. People and nations claim to care about the Gazans and actually show that they do care by contributing to their aid. But, at this point in history, until one goes there in person to compel the people in Israel, Syria, Jordan and Lebanon to surrender their land to establish "the Levant," it's all just lip service to the broader Palestinian peoples' claim to the land.

I have compassion for all those who suffer in the conflict, but I have nothing to do with the question of whose land it is. That is for the people to sort out who have the conflicting claims, and for those outsiders who are willing to die for one side or the other. Since before my liftime, there have been precious few of the latter—but no shortage of armchair Palestinian patriots.

 

[Unfettered]

Absolutely and why the fencing is there.

If you're referring to the barrier between Gaza and Israel, are you saying that during peace time Gazans cannot ever pass through the barrier into Israel? And what about Egypt? Can Gazans ever pass into Egypt freely?

And what about the blockades of sea and air during peace time?

Not to mention control of water, fuel and supplies. Those last three should never have been allowed by the global community.

Is Israel stopping Gazans from providing these services to themselves?

As said earlier, the global community doesn't care the way you suggest it should. At least, not that I can tell.

I agree, they should have just left but the population is so uneducated, that they can barely support themselves in a civilized community. The majority of the population are just children and old women.

Historically, women and children have fled danger. If the Palestinian women and children are in danger and can't support themselves, why don't they flee like others in the past have? Who is stopping them from fleeing?

Does not mean that is right.

"Right" has no meaning in nature. I was merely pointing out the reality we all have to deal with here.

The US came into the affair based on strategic benefits, not empathy for a Jewish state, as often sold to the public.
That arm pit is practically worthless, except for religious needs.

Our various personal assessments are distractions from the question of how to deal with reality.

Sad rational, especially realizing US tax dollars have been the main reason the over powering side has even been equipped to condemn the indigenous locals with violence and oppression.

I'm certain that if the global community agreed with your assessment and cared about the Palestinians claims to the land, it could solve the problem for the Palestinians through war. Why hasn't the global community done this?

Yep.... the palestinians are surrounded by countries that don't play was as easily as 'we the people' do. War is about business, not empathy or doing what is right. Using people for the business of war, is about natural to our leadership and has been ongoing for a long time.

The US is one of many in the global community. No one cares about the land claims. Why point only to the US? Shouldn't we be fair and throw every other nation under the bus?

Oppressing human beings does and has created some crazy monsters not to mention using religion as a tool to defend the bigotry of conditioned priority.

I don't know what this is saying.

 

[Bthoth]

If you're referring to the barrier between Gaza and Israel, are you saying that during peace time Gazans cannot ever pass through the barrier into Israel?

if they are approved with the proper papers.

And what about Egypt? Can Gazans ever pass into Egypt freely?

No israel is afraid that weapons will be brought into gaza thru egypt.

And what about the blockades of sea and air during peace time?

The cannot even fish beyond a certain distance let alone go anywhere.

Is Israel stopping Gazans from providing these services to themselves?

No, israel controls everything surrounding gaza including water, fuel and electricity. The place is about like a prison but best described as a concentration camp

As said earlier, the global community doesn't care the way you suggest it should. At least, not that I can tell.

If the global community gave palestine a voice and the justice for what israel has done to them, about half of the IDF would be put into prison

Historically, women and children have fled danger.

cute, the median age of gaza is 18 yrs old and about 38% of the population is 14yrs old or less

If the Palestinian women and children are in danger and can't support themselves, why don't they flee like others in the past have? Who is stopping them from fleeing?

the fences and israel politics policies. If they let them children move into a civilized country, they may come back for revenge and learn how to do it outside of the apartheid control.

"Right" has no meaning in nature.

OK, then what right does israel have imposing oppression to about 5 million souls? It's not natural in a civilized world especially on US tax payers funding.

I was merely pointing out the reality we all have to deal with here.

Do you live in a hole under some church? Here in the USA, the media is biased and folk like you have no idea what the problem is and willing to continue funding the divide without holding both sides to rules of civility.

Our various personal assessments are distractions from the question of how to deal with reality.

I know, I dont get personal about it. But watching terrorist kill innocent civilians requires consideration of what would cause such hatred and evil acts.

I'm certain that if the global community agreed with your assessment and cared about the Palestinians claims to the land, it could solve the problem for the Palestinians through war. Why hasn't the global community done this?

No one wants to destroy or fight with israel and like myself I continue to try to trust that population/government/state but as time has passed I personally have come to learn that many within know how to BS better than most

The US is one of many in the global community.

And 'we the people' have vetoed more resolutions than all of the rest combined.

No one cares about the land claims. Why point only to the US? Shouldn't we be fair and throw every other nation under the bus?

You would think, that no single state could have such influence on US but for some reason, our politicians lack the guts to just say NO More.

I don't know what this is saying.

It means, that oppressing people and giving israel a blank check to spend on oppressing millions has created a hate for US that is getting out of hand.

The part that bugs me, is that israel claims to be a Jewish state. I like Jews too much to ever consider that apartheid as representing Judaism or the quality and character of Jews.

 

[Unfettered]

if they are approved with the proper papers.

No israel is afraid that weapons will be brought into gaza thru egypt.

The cannot even fish beyond a certain distance let alone go anywhere.

No, israel controls everything surrounding gaza including water, fuel and electricity. The place is about like a prison but best described as a concentration camp

If the global community gave palestine a voice and the justice for what israel has done to them, about half of the IDF would be put into prison

cute, the median age of gaza is 18 yrs old and about 38% of the population is 14yrs old or less

the fences and israel politics policies. If they let them children move into a civilized country, they may come back for revenge and learn how to do it outside of the apartheid control.

OK, then what right does israel have imposing oppression to about 5 million souls? It's not natural in a civilized world especially on US tax payers funding.

Do you live in a hole under some church? Here in the USA, the media is biased and folk like you have no idea what the problem is and willing to continue funding the divide without holding both sides to rules of civility.

I know, I dont get personal about it. But watching terrorist kill innocent civilians requires consideration of what would cause such hatred and evil acts.

No one wants to destroy or fight with israel and like myself I continue to try to trust that population/government/state but as time has passed I personally have come to learn that many within know how to BS better than most

And 'we the people' have vetoed more resolutions than all of the rest combined.

You would think, that no single state could have such influence on US but for some reason, our politicians lack the guts to just say NO More.

It means, that oppressing people and giving israel a blank check to spend on oppressing millions has created a hate for US that is getting out of hand.

The part that bugs me, is that israel claims to be a Jewish state. I like Jews too much to ever consider that apartheid as representing Judaism or the quality and character of Jews.

I'll be honest; when I am addressed in ways like "folks like you..." and "do you live in a hole..." I lose interest. I think you've offered a lot to think about and discuss, but I'm withdrawing for a bit. Perhaps I'll come back to this later.

God bless.

 

[Mock Turtle]

Pro-Palestinian protests take place in London, Birmingham, Cardiff, Belfast and Salford

The protests come as aid deliveries reach Gaza for the first time since the Hamas attack on Israel.

www.bbc.co.uk

Of course pointing out the war crimes Israel might be committing but seemingly ignoring the ones we KNOW have been carried out by Hamas, and hence looking the other way when it's convenient to do so.

Maggie Morgan, from the Palestinian Solidarity Campaign Cardiff, said: "We are taking to the streets as a show of solidarity to the people of Gaza, to show our support for them, but also to make the government listen, and say 'not in our name, we're not having this.'"

It's just a shame that those in Gaza didn't say the same as to the attack on Israel - but then some might not recognise the word - HYPOCRITE!

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

Of course pointing out the war crimes Israel might be committing but seemingly ignoring the ones we KNOW have been carried out by Hamas, and hence looking the other way when it's convenient to do so.

It is a pattern that becomes apparent in many if not most significant armed conflict, so, for example, the invasion of Iraq.

It's just a shame that those in Gaza didn't say the same as to the attack on Israel - but then some might not recognise the word - HYPOCRITE!

Shouting "HYPOCRITE! " is more than cheap. I wonder if you or I would have the courage to demonstrate against Hamas on the streets of Gaza.

 

[Mock Turtle]

It is a pattern that becomes apparent in many if not most significant armed conflict, so, for example, the invasion of Iraq.


Shouting "HYPOCRITE! " is more than cheap. I wonder if you or I would have the courage to demonstrate against Hamas on the streets of Gaza.

Quite true, but if one doesn't complain as to some authority being not what one voted for, given the chance for such, then we might get what we never wanted - as per Putin and many others. And my comment was more about her comment - would the people of Gaza have supported what Hamas did? I very much sympathise with what those in Gaza are going through.