Jehovah's Witnesses and the meaning of words

[savagewind]

Interesting question, but I've no idea how "death" would be defeated from our point of view, I'm guessing at it. I think it would amount to changing the chemistry in our bodies. It would (I think) involve ingesting something or getting injected with something. It would be definitely "mankind's own design" though, I cant think of a medical procedure revealed by a deity!

God can shut down the dying gene. For what we are now, we are not worthy. I think it is obvious.

John 6:53-55 Jesus said to them, "Very truly I tell you, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink his blood, you have no life in you. Whoever eats my flesh and drinks my blood has eternal life, and I will raise them up at the last day. For my flesh is real food and my blood is real drink. Whoever eats my flesh and drinks my blood remains in me, and I in them. Just as the living Father sent me and I live because of the Father, so the one who feeds on me will live because of me. This is the bread that came down from heaven. Your ancestors ate manna and died, but whoever feeds on this bread will live forever."

 

[PlicsidaLoreal]

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Hello. What an incredible website and Forum.

I sure do not know the answer to that question. I have read every post here and they are all pretty great.

I have often wondered why that Jehovah Witnesses Teaching has always taught that The 144,000 Virgins - are Men and Women. { Females.

The Bible Says That - The 144,000 Virgins - are Women. { Females.

Rev 14:4 These are they which were not defiled with / Among women; for they are virgins.

Just - Notice The Greek word - “ With - meta “ in the above Phrase - not defiled With women.

The Original Greek Scriptures are not saying that these Virgins have not been Defiled with women.
The Original Greek is Actually saying that These Virgins / Woman were not Defiled Among Women.

The Greek Word - is - Among Women. Or After Women.

There is a huge Difference between saying - You are Defiled With Women and saying You are Defiled Among Women. With \ Among Women.

They are Woman / Female Virgins, who are taken OUT - from Among The other defiled Woman of the Earth at certain times or events in History - when other woman around them were defiled. And these specific women *(SPECIFIC WOMEN are VIRGINS ) and have not been Defiled Among Woman * They are Virgins.

The Scriptures are not Saying that these Virgins had abstained from having seX with other woman - but that these Virgins had not been Defiled Among Woman. Lets Look at the Difference between saying - Defiled With Women and saying Defiled Among Women.

This Greek Word meta - met-ah' -_ is the Greek 3326 μετά

Meta - met-ah' Meaning Accompaniment; “ With - which it is Joined; Occupying - Among - Together - Meta... This Greek word Meta is used in Verses such as - Rev 21:3 God..... He will dwell with Meta them, and they shall be his people.

The fact that God is with them does not mean that They are Sexual partners with God. And is not giving an action describing what is happening.

But that God will be Among or With them. The Verse is not saying that God will have seXual intercourse or have a certain type of Physical relations or perform any such actions of any kind with His people - but that he simply will Dwell with Meta them *( Among them.) accompaniment - with his people.

This is what this Greek word Meta means. It does not describe a certain Action or Description of an action or doing. But that God would be Among or accompanying His people. The Greek word is a Meta is a A primary preposition.

Prepositions are words such as the words - Aboard, Above, Across, After, Against or Among...............

One more eXample - notice in Rev 19:20 And the beast was taken, and with him the false prophet.

Notice the word with Meta in the Phrase . “with him, the false prophet.”

The Verse is not stating that God will be taking the beast with the false prophet a in sexual threesome. But that God will take them together and put them into a pit. The beast was taken with the false prophet. They were in accompaniment together - but the verse does not state that they were having seX.
Or doing anything - or any ACTIONs - WITH One Another,

REMEMBER the Difference between saying - Defiled With Women and saying Defiled Among Women.

The Jehovah Witness Translators want You to believe that these Virgins included Males.

Here is more proof that they were Women.

Lets notice that Rev 14:4 also tells us that These Virgins *( Women / Females ) here - These *( Virgins ) were redeemed from Man . The Word “ Man “ here in the verse is not in Meaning or in Reference to a MALE But it is the Greek Word anthrōpos or Anthropod Greek 444 anthrōpos

anth'-ro-pos - Meaning Manfaced, that is, A Human being: - Mankind.

This Greek word Meaning a Human Being or Mankind is Used in Mat 4:4 Man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceedeth out of the mouth of God.

The Greek word Anthropos / Anthropod does not Mean a Male seX But it simply means a Human Being. It can be used for either or both. There is a Greek word for Male and a seperate Greek word for Male and a seperate Greek word for Humanity, Mankind.
The 144,000 in Rev 14:4 - are in fact Females - Women - Virgins who are not defiled among ( Meta ) other women and were taken out of - Mankind *( Anthropods ) / - From Humanity - in the earth . There is no such a idea or concept of a Male Virgin. In the entire Bible, You will never find the idea of a Male Virgin. NEVER.

The Rev 14:4 verse goes on to say that these Woman / Virgins will be Singers for Jesus, *( The Lamb ) and these women will Follow Him wherever he goes, Singing and Praising Him... They are Female, Virgins. Singers that Christ has Chosen.

Notice the Greek... Here.

Mar 10:6 But G1161 from G575 the beginning G746 of the creation G2937 God G2316 made G4160 them G846 male G730 and G2532 female G2338.

The Greek Word Used in Scriptures for Male is Greek G730 ἄῤῥην, arrhēn / r-hrane
meaning a Male.


The Greek Word Used in Scriptures for Female is Greek G2338 θῆλυς thēlus thay'-loos

Meaning a Female..

The 144,000 Virgins. Not defiled among Women - taken out from Mankind /Humanity - Were Woman, no Males . There is no Such a thing as a Male Virgin. A Male can not be a virgin unless He is a Homosexual.
Never is a male required to be a Virgin before HE Marries a Woman. And The idea of a Physical male Virgin is not in the Bible

​

 

[The Holy Bottom Burp]

God can shut down the dying gene. For what we are now, we are not worthy. I think it is obvious.

John 6:53-55 Jesus said to them, "Very truly I tell you, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink his blood, you have no life in you. Whoever eats my flesh and drinks my blood has eternal life, and I will raise them up at the last day. For my flesh is real food and my blood is real drink. Whoever eats my flesh and drinks my blood remains in me, and I in them. Just as the living Father sent me and I live because of the Father, so the one who feeds on me will live because of me. This is the bread that came down from heaven. Your ancestors ate manna and died, but whoever feeds on this bread will live forever."

Don't go getting all religious on me! Eternal life is one thing, eternal life worshipping a deity is eternal tedium! Ever spent a couple of hours in church on a Sunday?
Seriously, religion appeals to many for this reason solely, it offers something beyond the grave. I would rather deal with cold hard facts, I cannot swindle my mind into believing religious claims these days, intellectual honesty I call it. Religion continues to draw me though, once bitten by the bug it is hard to leave it alone. Religion is essentially human yearning for existence beyond our brief lives, touching and emotional for sure, but rational? I think you know my answer to that!

 

[PlicsidaLoreal]

Mat 13:34 All these things spoke Jesus unto the multitude in parables; and without a parable spoke he not unto them:

Luk 8:10 And he said, Unto you it is given to know the mysteries of the kingdom of God: but to others in parables;

Jesus went around speaking parables to nearly Every crowd - every day nearly. Some 19 times in the Bible, we find Jesus telling a crowd another Parable.,

Also we have another Catholic Favorite which is Baptism of a Household.

There is Simply No way at all, that a child could ever be baptized. In The bible, it would be impossible. With all the Adults that were baptized - The Apostles did not go around finding people and suddenly, just baptizing them right then and there, on the spot.

This is Complete Non Sense. - The Formula for salvation is as St. Peter declared.

Act 2:37 The people said to Peter, What shall we do ? - Act 2:38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ, for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

You see, in the Bible. The Apostles are Witnessing, Preaching and Teaching the people First.

Always it is always, eXactly JUST like this. FIRST STEP. - The sinner is ALWAYS - FIRST - shown the truth, The Sinner is THEN convicted of His /Her sins. The sinner next repents and asks God to Forgive them, THEN - REMITING His or Her own sins .

This Greek Word REMIT - Is Greek 863 REMIT Sins α?φι´ημι - aphie¯mi / af-ee'-ay-mee. Meaning - To send (to go)); to send forth, To forsake, lay aside, leave, let (alone, be, go, have), To omit, put away, To yield up.



And the Greek word REPENT is - Greek 3340 μετανοε´ω - metanoeo¯ / met-an-o-eh'-o. Meaning - ; To think differently or afterwards, that is, reconsider (morally to feel compunction): - To repent.

So Lets look to the Scriptures and see How the Church is performing Baptism.

The Church is FIRST Teaching - Rev 3:19 As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten: be zealous therefore, and repent.

How would an INFANT REPENT ?- God does not rebuke and chasten a little baby !

And Here - Rev 3:3 Remember therefore how thou hast received and heard, and hold fast, and repent.

How would an INFANT received and hear something to cause Him . Her to REPENT

And Here Rev 2:22 Behold, I will cast her into a bed, and them that commit adultery with her into great tribulation, except they repent of their deeds.

What sin is a Baby Committing, - commit adultery ?

You see, Every Single last instance in the Bible of anyone Even Getting Baptized. They are FIRST - Hearing, Listening to apostles, Then they are Convicted in their Hearth. AND Then After all that - REMITTING and REPENTING their Sins- Then and ONLY THEN are they afterwards THEN Baptized. !

See Here - Rev 2:21 And I gave her space to repent of her fornication; and she repented not. And Rev 2:16 Repent; or else I will come unto thee quickly, and will fight against them with the sword of my mouth. Rev 2:5 Remember therefore from whence thou art fallen, and repent.

We See - Mat 3:6 They were baptized of him in Jordan, confessing their sins.

Mar 1:5 And there went out unto him all the land of Judaea, and they of Jerusalem, and were all baptized of him in the river of Jordan, confessing their sins.

Act 19:3 And he said unto them, Unto what then were ye baptized? And they said, Unto John's baptism. Act 19:4 Then said Paul, John verily baptized with the baptism of repentance, saying unto the people, that they should believe on him which should come after him, that is, on Christ Jesus.

Act 19:5 When they heard this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.

Act 18:8 The Corinthians hearing, believed, and were baptized .

Act 10:46 For they heard them speak with tongues, and magnify God. .

Act 10:46 For they heard them speak with tongues, and magnify God. Then answered Peter,

Act 10:47 Can any man forbid water, that these should not be baptized, which have received the Holy Ghost as well as we? 48 And he commanded them to be baptized in the name of the Lord...................................

------------------- We See the message in the Bible is so, so very different from the message of The Roman Catholic Church.

Catholics Simply Have No Scriptures for Their Faith. Never is anyone Baptized. Before Being Witnessed To - Hearing the Word of God. Remitting Their Sins, Repenting and coming to an UNDERSTANDING of what they did wrong. THEN and only Then is the Sinner Baptized. Never before.


The apostles and disciples Never Baptized a Baby or Baptized anyone before FIRST coming to an acknowledgment and realization and compete understanding of what they are doing.

Mat 3:6 And were baptized of him in Jordan, confessing their sins. Baptizing a Baby is a blasphemous joke.

Catholics simply, have absolutely, no scriptures for Their Faith. Their Teaching is not in the Bible.



I am so sorry but I am not seeing the Bible - Showing that an Entire House Hold is involved in REPENTING - in the Bible. Or an ENTIRE Household is being baptized.


The Term or idea that The entire household or Whole Entire , All the House was baptized - Simply is a figment of Your great and wonderful imagination. Roman Catholics have awesome imaginations. But You sadly have no scriptures for Your Faith. There is no All The House and There is no ENTIRE Household.


The Saint Paul adds to the idea of the Meaningless, Useless and Pointless Needless act of Infant Baptism - or Baptism before Someone - hears and understands.


in 1Co 1:17 For Christ sent me not to baptize, but to preach the gospel. Saint Paul. had no need to baptize people until they were preached to FIRST.


Paul had a Good Point there. Also The Saint Peter - Saint Peter was rebuked often and Peter was Led by Paul. Paul Stood Against Peter a couple times ( Possibly Daily, until Peter Found the Truth - Paul was Patient and gentle with Peter.


But Peter also stated that 1Pe 3:21 That baptism does also now save us (BAPTISM ) is not the actual PROCESS of putting away of the filth of the flesh, but (BAPTISM ) is the ( Our ( Acknowledged ) answer of a good conscience, toward God,)


Peter was eventually taught the Same Truth. Sadly Romantic Catholics have no Rock or Foundation in Peter or Jesus. they Ignore Everything they Taught and Invent Imaginative things they abduct and rip - from the Scriptures .


An infant in a House getting baptized would not be actually putting away of the filth of its Infant flesh. By getting baptized. it would be worthless.

But The baby Would ONLY be baptized for ITSELF - answering it's INFANT, childish, baby goodly conscience toward God,) And A baby has no conscience toward God, Has no answer to God and Can not understand Catholic teaching, much less the Truth of Gods Word.

Again, My precious Friend - We See again, and Again, And Again as Here in Luke - Luk 3:12 Then came also publicans to be baptized, and said unto him, Master, what shall we do?
Luk 3:13 And he said unto them, Exact no more than that which is appointed you.


Luk 3:14 And the soldiers likewise demanded of him, saying, And what shall we do? And he said unto them, Do violence to no man, neither accuse any The Greek .

Baptism is always, O N L Y an Act, Show and a simple feeble Figure of our Consciousness answering in demonstration - of a good conscience, toward God,)

The Sinner Sees the Sin. Repents and Remits and then it is time to be baptized. And Only Then. We see above HOW Saint John would not baptize the people until they first Heard His Message, Received the Truth and Repented.

Tit 1:15 Unto the pure all things are pure: but unto them that are defiled and unbelieving is nothing pure; but even their mind and conscience is defiled.

The Sinner conscience is defiled - A Baby has no conscience. It is Pure. baptism is really meaningless, unless You First REMIT and REPENT. As The Bible says.

Joh 6:63 It is the spirit that quickeneth; The flesh profiteth nothing: The words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.

The Eucharist itself is profits for nothing. Worthless, Useless and a joke. The Word Of God is the Life, The Spirit and the Salvation and The Bride and believers are part of that Body of Christ, By Hearing and Believing - Then afterwards getting baptized.

Not by following Catholic falsehoods. Catholics Simply Have No Scriptures For Their Faith

 

[blü 2]

I shall rate that "friendly", but I also think it is sarcasm which isn't so friendly. Is it?

And, thank you, I think.

It wasn't sarcasm. Just cheerfulness.

 

[blü 2]

I can't really see much difference in a pointless finite life and a pointless infinite life, you just invent a new "distance" a new "map" to traverse and go after it.

Trouble is, we're born with that shorter map in our heads. Otherwise eg the 'biological clock' that women speak of wouldn't be so widespread and of such force.

If your grandkids get the option of immortality I really want to take this life back to the vendor!

Maybe they can do something about it in the service department. Rebore, new tyres, tighten the suspension ...

Oh yes, that is the other thing about immortality, I need to be impervious to the everyday causes of death! It will need to be an almighty immortality pill!

In particular it brings up cancer, a pitstop I made in 2004. What's the mean time before cancer in the average human body?

Oh and gun control, not least in places where the slaughter rate is extraordinary, third world countries and the US.

Oh you, you want your cake and to eat it sir.

Yes, that seemed wisest when I thought about it.

When me and @savagewind are popping our immortality pills maybe we'll log on to see how much you are willing to pay in order to join our club!

A bit like missing out for your ticket on the ark.

And speaking of arks, with all those extra humans not getting out of the way, this is when we're going to need interstellar colonies to ship 'em off to.

 

[The Holy Bottom Burp]

Trouble is, we're born with that shorter map in our heads. Otherwise eg the 'biological clock' that women speak of wouldn't be so widespread and of such force.

Meh, but with my version of immortality you are forever young, so the biological clock doesn't count. Stop trying to mess with my fantasy!

Maybe they can do something about it in the service department. Rebore, new tyres, tighten the suspension ...
In particular it brings up cancer, a pitstop I made in 2004. What's the mean time before cancer in the average human body?

A service? You need to be more assertive with your consumer rights! Glad to hear you made it through cancer mate, so much for the argument from design. As soon as you pop out of the womb the world tries its best to kill you!

Oh and gun control, not least in places where the slaughter rate is extraordinary, third world countries and the US.
Yes, that seemed wisest when I thought about it.
A bit like missing out for your ticket on the ark.

And speaking of arks, with all those extra humans not getting out of the way, this is when we're going to need interstellar colonies to ship 'em off to.

There you go again, putting obstacles in the way of my hypothetical world! Yes, we will need an endless supply of habitable planets for this thing to work, it would a bleak life without children running about bringing their childish sunshine into the world. You are hitting on some of the same philosophical questions I have about an "eternal afterlife", it really isn't coherent when you think about it. Don't suppose it will stop people from believing in it though...

 

[blü 2]

Meh, but with my version of immortality you are forever young, so the biological clock doesn't count. Stop trying to mess with my fantasy!
A service? You need to be more assertive with your consumer rights! Glad to hear you made it through cancer mate, so much for the argument from design. As soon as you pop out of the womb the world tries its best to kill you!

There you go again, putting obstacles in the way of my hypothetical world! Yes, we will need an endless supply of habitable planets for this thing to work, it would a bleak life without children running about bringing their childish sunshine into the world. You are hitting on some of the same philosophical questions I have about an "eternal afterlife", it really isn't coherent when you think about it. Don't suppose it will stop people from believing in it though...

The motion is:

That this meeting be adjourned to August 6, 1,002,017

All in favor?

 

[Raj V]

What is the new Bible authorized meaning of "soon"?

Soon means soon. There are caveats though. Jesus did not Himself know the exact time, God's patience is almost unlimited, Man has been dense in not being able to understand Christ.

More importantly, He has possibly come into the hearts of several people. There is kingdom of heaven within. It is a standing promise, that you can enter it now on repentance. A repentance where the aim is to be like Christ who could say , Father forgive them, praying for those who crucified Him.

 

[Mister Silver]

Someone I know always says, "I'll be there soon."

Five hours later, upon seeing him, I say, "That was not soon."

This is reality.

When it comes to the biblical term, I remember that it is fiction.