Jesus Will Never Return

[Redemptionsong]

Please notice, as a postscript my previous post, that Jeremiah provides the answer to the questions posed. [These questions are also relevant to Gentiles, as much as to Jews] Jeremiah prophesies, 'Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah: Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake, although I was an husband unto them, saith the LORD: But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and I will be their God, and they shall be my people. And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying Know the LORD: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the LORD: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.'

It is the Lord who puts his law in our inward parts, if we seek him. This is what enables a person to know the Lord. So how is this achieved?

 

[Ben Avraham]

But it did speak of resurrection. Daniel 12:2 Easy-to-Read Version (ERV) There are many who are dead and buried. Some of them will wake up and live forever, but others will wake up to shame and disgrace forever. I did not even use the New Testament Bible (because you are Jewish) to show that there is the resurrection.

No, it did not, and I have already explained to you about Daniel 12:1-3. Those dead and buried are all those who have got so accustomed to live in exile that they have chosen to remain in their new world called Diaspora. Those who wake up to live forever are they who have decided to make Aliyah back to the Land of Israel. And those who wake up to shame and disgrace are the majority who have decided to join their Diaspora. Now, indeed, you did not have to mention the NT because I am well aware that bodily resurrection is a Christian doctrine.

 

[Ben Avraham]

Please notice, as a postscript my previous post, that Jeremiah provides the answer to the questions posed. [These questions are also relevant to Gentiles, as much as to Jews] Jeremiah prophesies, 'Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah: Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake, although I was an husband unto them, saith the LORD: But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and I will be their God, and they shall be my people. And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying Know the LORD: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the LORD: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.' It is the Lord who puts his law in our inward parts, if we seek him. This is what enables a person to know the Lord. So how is this achieved?

See what I mean? All you have to do is to focus on what you read. "The days come, says the Lord that I will make a New Covenant with the House of Israel and the House of Judah. IOW, only with the Jewish People; no Gentiles included. To integrate the Gentiles into the New Covenant, they have to join God's Covenant with His People and become one with them by conversion according to Halacha. (Isaiah 56:1-8) That's how this can be achieved.

 

[Ben Avraham]

Judah was, and can be understood to represent, an individual as well as a people. When I read the Tanach I find evidence that the Lord is angry at both Israel and Judah (the people). In 1 Kings 14:16 it says, 'And he (the Lord) shall give Israel up because of the sins of Jeroboam, who did sin, and who made Israel to sin.'Hosea shows that Judah is not without sin. Judah is told by the Lord, 'I will go and return to my place, till they acknowledge their offence'. So this is a people who are sinful, and the sinless Lord is telling them that he will return to his place. Interesting this. The Lord has come from his place (heaven) and is now returning to his place (heaven). How long will he be gone? 'After two days will he revive us:' [the Talmud, using a Psalm, ascribes a thousand years to each day] 'in the third day he will raise us up, and we will live in his sight.' Hosea 6:10,11. 'I have seen an horrible thing in the house of Israel: there is the whoredom of Ephraim, Israel is defiled. Also, O Judah, he hath set an harvest for thee, when I returned the captivity of my people.' We know that the return from Babylon did not bring about a great renaissance for Judah. Nor was there a harvest. What is more, the great disaster of Jerusalem's destruction and subsequent diaspora after 70CE left Judah without knowledge of the Davidic line, without a Temple (making fulfilment of the Mosaic Law impossible), and cut off from its promised land. The Lord said,'I will tear and go away'. The good news is that he will 'heal us' and 'bind us up'. But who amongst Judah will be healed? Hosea 6:3 says those 'who follow on to know the LORD'. So the big questions for Jews must be, 'Do you know the Lord?' 'What does it mean to know the Lord?'

Only through Christian preconceived notions, Judah can be understood to be an individual. It is called Replacement Theology. No one is or ever was without sin, even Jesus himself whom you take as a paragon of righteousness. He broke the Golden Rule 15 times only in the text of Mat. 23:13-33. The Golden Rule covers the whole second part of the Decalogue. Serious transgressions right there! Christian opinion is not what matters but God's decision to confirm Judah as the only Kingdom in the Land of Israel forever. (Psalms 78:67-70) Who knows the Lord as we do? The Christian opinion is of a God divided into two. Hence Deuteronomy 6:4 that at least Israel should never forget that HaShem is of an absolute Oneness. I mean the new Israel aka Judah, the Jewish People.

 

[MJFlores]

No, it did not, and I have already explained to you about Daniel 12:1-3. Those dead and buried are all those who have got so accustomed to live in exile that they have chosen to remain in their new world called Diaspora. Those who wake up to live forever are they who have decided to make Aliyah back to the Land of Israel. And those who wake up to shame and disgrace are the majority who have decided to join their Diaspora. Now, indeed, you did not have to mention the NT because I am well aware that bodily resurrection is a Christian doctrine.

I'm sorry, I think that is a personal interpretation. Anyway Ben Avraham you will be resurrected too. No exemptions - whether you like it or not.

Daniel 12:2 Easy-to-Read Version (ERV)

There are many who are dead and buried. Some of them will wake up and live forever, but others will wake up to shame and disgrace forever.

 

[Redemptionsong]

See what I mean? All you have to do is to focus on what you read. "The days come, says the Lord that I will make a New Covenant with the House of Israel and the House of Judah. IOW, only with the Jewish People; no Gentiles included. To integrate the Gentiles into the New Covenant, they have to join God's Covenant with His People and become one with them by conversion according to Halacha. (Isaiah 56:1-8) That's how this can be achieved.

The Lord has already taken the New Covenant to the House of Israel and Judah, but it seems it was not readily received! This Covenant is described as a 'new' covenant. So what is new? Or do you see the 'new' as a restatement of the 'old'?
Isaiah 56:1 says, 'my salvation is near to come, and my righteousness to be revealed.' It's the coming of salvation that makes a New Covenant possible. And in that New Covenant there is unity between Jew and Gentile, not according to earthly requirements, but according to the Lord's requirement, namely that sons of the stranger should 'join themselves to the LORD, to serve him, and to love the name of the LORD, to be his servants, every one that keepeth the sabbath from polluting it, and taketh hold of my covenant;' [New]

So what do you understand the New Covenant to be?

 

[Redemptionsong]

Only through Christian preconceived notions, Judah can be understood to be an individual. It is called Replacement Theology. No one is or ever was without sin, even Jesus himself whom you take as a paragon of righteousness. He broke the Golden Rule 15 times only in the text of Mat. 23:13-33. The Golden Rule covers the whole second part of the Decalogue. Serious transgressions right there! Christian opinion is not what matters but God's decision to confirm Judah as the only Kingdom in the Land of Israel forever. (Psalms 78:67-70) Who knows the Lord as we do? The Christian opinion is of a God divided into two. Hence Deuteronomy 6:4 that at least Israel should never forget that HaShem is of an absolute Oneness. I mean the new Israel aka Judah, the Jewish People.

To say that no one is or ever was without sin is fine, so long as you are not talking about the Son of God. Nor is it a disregard of the Golden Rule for God to criticise those who are genuinely in error. We see God saying such things about backsliding Israelites throughout the Tanach.

I have no problem with the fact that God has chosen the Promised Land for his people Judah. I accept ALL the Tanach as God's Word! But look again at Psalm 78. It distinguishes between 'the tribe of Judah' and David, whom he took 'from the sheepfolds'. This David was an individual, who was to become King of Israel and Judah. Likewise the Messiah. A King who is able to make his people holy. And as you have said, the people are not without sin. That means the whole body is sinful unless the head is able to purge the sin and make it holy. Isn't this just like the matzah that must be purged of all leaven?

Nor does God stop being a Oneness because he choses to place his Spirit in an earthen vessel. The Messiah must be both man and God. He must be able to mediate a new covenant.

 

[Ben Avraham]

To say that no one is or ever was without sin is fine, so long as you are not talking about the Son of God. Nor is it a disregard of the Golden Rule for God to criticise those who are genuinely in error. We see God saying such things about backsliding Israelites throughout the Tanach.
I have no problem with the fact that God has chosen the Promised Land for his people Judah. I accept ALL the Tanach as God's Word! But look again at Psalm 78. It distinguishes between 'the tribe of Judah' and David, whom he took 'from the sheepfolds'. This David was an individual, who was to become King of Israel and Judah. Likewise the Messiah. A King who is able to make his people holy. And as you have said, the people are not without sin. That means the whole body is sinful unless the head is able to purge the sin and make it holy. Isn't this just like the matzah that must be purged of all leaven? Nor does God stop being a Oneness because he choses to place his Spirit in an earthen vessel. The Messiah must be both man and God. He must be able to mediate a new covenant.

Yes, sir! I am talking about the son of God but the Son of God according to Exodus 4:22,23. "Israel is My Son." Jesus was part of the Son of God while he lived. Once dead, no one remains son of God because God is not God of the dead but of the living only. The dead can no longer praise the Lord. The laws were not given to God but to men. A man cannot address another with adjectives he himself would not like to be address as. Psalm 78 does not at all distinguish between Judah and David as Judah is the line of David. The distinction is between Judah and Israel, the Ten Tribes which God rejected so that Judah remained as the only Kingdom in the Land of Israel; no longer two kingdoms. (Ezekiel 37:22) David was a king Messiah anointed by Prophet Samuel, not the Collective Messiah anointed by God Himself if you read Habakkuk 3:13. The Jewish Messiah cannot be an individual nor God Himself. If you read Habakkuk 3:13, "The Lord goes forth to save His PEOPLE, to save His Anointed One." That's what Messiah is, the Anointed One of the Lord aka Israel the Son of God if you read Exodus 4:22,23.

 

[Ben Avraham]

The Lord has already taken the New Covenant to the House of Israel and Judah, but it seems it was not readily received! This Covenant is described as a 'new' covenant. So what is new? Or do you see the 'new' as a restatement of the 'old'?
Isaiah 56:1 says, 'my salvation is near to come, and my righteousness to be revealed.' It's the coming of salvation that makes a New Covenant possible. And in that New Covenant there is unity between Jew and Gentile, not according to earthly requirements, but according to the Lord's requirement, namely that sons of the stranger should 'join themselves to the LORD, to serve him, and to love the name of the LORD, to be his servants, every one that keepeth the sabbath from polluting it, and taketh hold of my covenant;' [New] So what do you understand the New Covenant to be?

The only thing new about God's Covenant with His People is in the way to be observed. There is no other change at all in the laws of God's Covenant given in the Sinai. In the old Covenant, the priests, prophets and scribes had to teach the people to know the Word of God. The New Covenant was canonized by Ezra when he organized the Scriptures and set it available to all and was guaranteed that it would not be too baffling for us nor beyond our reach; that it would not be in heavens that we should say, who among us could go up to heavens and get it for us and impart it to us that we may observe it? Neither it would be beyond the sea that we should say, "Who among us could cross to the other side of the sea and get it for us and impart it to us that we may observe it? No, the Word of God would be very close to us in our own mouth and in our heart to just observe it. (Deuteronomy 30:11-14)

 

[Ben Avraham]

I'm sorry, I think that is a personal interpretation. Anyway Ben Avraham you will be resurrected too. No exemptions - whether you like it or not. Daniel 12:2 Easy-to-Read Version.
There are many who are dead and buried. Some of them will wake up and live forever, but others will wake up to shame and disgrace forever.

The point is not that if I would like it or not. The fact is that the Word of God aka the Tanach was given to the Jewish Nation and I cannot reject it just because I would like to resurrect and, for that matter I would have to adopt a Christian doctrine which would be against the gospel of Jesus aka the the Tanach. Regarding Daniel 12:2, I have already explained here more than several times. Daniel was not at all speaking literally.

 

[MJFlores]

The point is not that if I would like it or not. The fact is that the Word of God aka the Tanach was given to the Jewish Nation and I cannot reject it just because I would like to resurrect and, for that matter I would have to adopt a Christian doctrine which would be against the gospel of Jesus aka the the Tanach. Regarding Daniel 12:2, I have already explained here more than several times. Daniel was not at all speaking literally.

Resurrection is written all over the Old Testament Bible, Ben.
No one has been resurrected yet and taken to heaven except my Lord Jesus Christ.

Job 19:25-26 New International Version (NIV)

I know that my redeemer lives,
and that in the end he will stand on the earth.
And after my skin has been destroyed,
yet in my flesh I will see God;

When will this happen? in the end.

 

[Redemptionsong]

The only thing new about God's Covenant with His People is in the way to be observed. There is no other change at all in the laws of God's Covenant given in the Sinai. In the old Covenant, the priests, prophets and scribes had to teach the people to know the Word of God. The New Covenant was canonized by Ezra when he organized the Scriptures and set it available to all and was guaranteed that it would not be too baffling for us nor beyond our reach; that it would not be in heavens that we should say, who among us could go up to heavens and get it for us and impart it to us that we may observe it? Neither it would be beyond the sea that we should say, "Who among us could cross to the other side of the sea and get it for us and impart it to us that we may observe it? No, the Word of God would be very close to us in our own mouth and in our heart to just observe it. (Deuteronomy 30:11-14)

God's Law does not change, I agree. The Law is also good. So the problem of disobedience is a problem that lies squarely at the door of the sinner.
You seem to be saying that Ezra's organisation of the Scriptures is the answer to sin. Yet even the history of Israel shows that it was not. Why would the Lord have allowed the Jews to be banished from their land for two thousand years if they had been his faithful sons and daughters? If salvation can be equated with being in the land, as you have suggested, then for two thousand years the Lord has turned his back on Judah.
So how do people have their sin forgiven? Are you hoping to make sin offerings in a rebuilt Temple in Jerusalem?

 

[Ben Avraham]

Resurrection is written all over the Old Testament Bible, Ben. No one has been resurrected yet and taken to heaven except my Lord Jesus Christ. Job 19:25-26 New International Version (NIV) I know that my redeemer lives, and that in the end he will stand on the earth. And after my skin has been destroyed, yet in my flesh I will see God; When will this happen? in the end.

Bodily resurrection is nowhere in the Tanach. Except your lord Jesus but by faith. You assume that Jesus resurrected because you have read in the NT and, being a Christian, you cannot even think otherwise. But, tell me something, can you use your NT to provide an eyewitness for the resurrection of Jesus? No, you cannot; so, back to faith based on Christian preconceived notions.

Now, the quote you have mentioned above of Job 19:25,26 is a reference to his recovery from his malady, when in his flesh he would still alive return to his relation with God. Evidence of the fact is that, at the end of the novel, he recovered every thing from his health and all the way to his whole family and all his assets. Besides, the whole book was an allegory; written with the intent at promoting the Jewish doctrine about the role of Israel qua Emmanuel between God and Mankind.

 

[Ben Avraham]

God's Law does not change, I agree. The Law is also good. So the problem of disobedience is a problem that lies squarely at the door of the sinner. You seem to be saying that Ezra's organisation of the Scriptures is the answer to sin. Yet even the history of Israel shows that it was not. Why would the Lord have allowed the Jews to be banished from their land for two thousand years if they had been his faithful sons and daughters? If salvation can be equated with being in the land, as you have suggested, then for two thousand years the Lord has turned his back on Judah. So how do people have their sin forgiven? Are you hoping to make sin offerings in a rebuilt Temple in Jerusalem?

You seem to be wrong to assume that I have ever meant that the work of Ezra was the answer to sin. Israel aka the Ten Tribes did no longer exist at the time of Ezra. The Lord had nothing to do with the Jews being banished from their land for two thousand years. They themselves caused their banishment. I never said that they were faithful sons and daughters. The Lord did not turn His back on Judah. They turned their back on the Lord. However, the Lord in His mercy allowed Himself available to be found and we are back. But conditionally though. If we abandon God's Law again, we could end up in another exile of the same sort.

 

[MJFlores]

Bodily resurrection is nowhere in the Tanach. Except your lord Jesus but by faith. You assume that Jesus resurrected because you have read in the NT and, being a Christian, you cannot even think otherwise. But, tell me something, can you use your NT to provide an eyewitness for the resurrection of Jesus? No, you cannot; so, back to faith based on Christian preconceived notions.

Now, the quote you have mentioned above of Job 19:25,26 is a reference to his recovery from his malady, when in his flesh he would still alive return to his relation with God. Evidence of the fact is that, at the end of the novel, he recovered every thing from his health and all the way to his whole family and all his assets. Besides, the whole book was an allegory; written with the intent at promoting the Jewish doctrine about the role of Israel qua Emmanuel between God and Mankind.

Sorry Ben, you will be resurrected at the end of time - whether you like it or not (maybe the second resurrection)

Isaiah 26:19 Easy-to-Read Version (ERV)

But the Lord says,
“Your people have died,
but they will live again.
The bodies of my people
will rise from death.
Dead people in the ground,
stand and be happy!
The dew covering you is like
the dew sparkling in the light of a new day.
It shows that a new time is coming,
when the earth will give birth to the dead who are in it.”

 

[1robin]

Jesus will never return.

A poster once told me that, in his opinion, the Second Coming of Jesus would happen only when--through entirely natural causes--our planet be on the verge of destruction, and not before.

Well, I said, I am glad to hear that because, in that case, Jesus will never return because, soon after the Flood the Lord promised Noah that He would never again allow another universal destruction to destroy Mankind as long as the natural laws function properly. (Gen. 8:21,22)

That is not what those verses say:

20Then Noah built an altar to the LORD, and took of every clean animal and of every clean bird and offered burnt offerings on the altar. 21The LORD smelled the soothing aroma; and the LORD said to Himself, "I will never again curse the ground on account of man, for the intent of man's heart is evil from his youth; and I will never again destroy every living thing, as I have done. 22"While the earth remains, Seedtime and harvest, And cold and heat, And summer and winter, And day and night Shall not cease."…

We can be on the verge of destruction while those verses remain true.

Jeremiah read that text and said that as long as the natural laws function properly Israel will never cease as a People before the Lord forever. (Jeremiah 31:36)

That is an accurate enough description of Jeremiah, but where do you get that he came with those words based on his reading Genesis 8?

The proper interpretation of Jeremiah above should be that the Hebrews are God's people as surely as natural law's continued function.

Jesus must have read those two texts; the one of Genesis and that of Jeremiah and completed the info that salvation comes from the Jews as he meant universal catastrophe. (John 4:22)

Again, your inventing an event here. However concerning John 22, it means that God promised Abraham that God would use his descendants (the Hebrews) as his revelatory conduit through which he would save al mankind. John 4 isn't about any catastrophe.

Abraham went further and said that as long as there is a minyan of ten righteous, universal destruction would never happen. (Gen. 18:32) After all this, do you still think Jesus will need to come back? Hardly! Besides, Jesus' own gospel which was the Tanach, once dead, no one will ever return if you read II Samuel 12:23; Psalms 49:12,20; Isaiah 26:14; Job 7:9; etc.

You getting all this stuff mixed up.

I am not an eschatological expert but even a casual reading would show that it is mankind that will be attempting to destroy it's self, probably in a Nuclear war, and probably centered on Islam against Israel. It will appear than Islam will win that war but that is when Christ comes back the second time to destroy all those arrayed against Israel. If you read the Quran you will find all these same events but in reverse. Perhaps as a second event (or as part of the original event) God will scorch the entire Earth to cleanse it but I do not think that humans will be habituating the planet when that event occurs. The scorched Earth will return to it's intended state of a paradise, the city of God will descend to replace Jerusalem. God's redeemed will return to Earth, and the damned, Hell, Satan, and his Demons will be annihilated and cease to exist.

There is a lot of biblical details to connect all those dots in my extremely rough and brief description, but I don't think the dots you were giving can be connected by the bible.

 

[Ben Avraham]

That is not what those verses say: Then Noah built an altar to the LORD, and took of every clean animal and of every clean bird and offered burnt offerings on the altar. The LORD smelled the soothing aroma; and the LORD said to Himself, "I will never again curse the ground on account of man, for the intent of man's heart is evil from his youth; and I will never again destroy every living thing, as I have done. 22"While the earth remains, Seedtime and harvest, And cold and heat, And summer and winter, And day and night Shall not cease."… We can be on the verge of destruction while those verses remain true. That is an accurate enough description of Jeremiah, but where do you get that he came with those words based on his reading Genesis 8? The proper interpretation of Jeremiah above should be that the Hebrews are God's people as surely as natural law's continued function. Again, your inventing an event here. However concerning John 22, it means that God promised Abraham that God would use his descendants (the Hebrews) as his revelatory conduit through which he would save al mankind. John 4 isn't about any catastrophe. You getting all this stuff mixed up. I am not an eschatological expert but even a casual reading would show that it is mankind that will be attempting to destroy it's self, probably in a Nuclear war, and probably centered on Islam against Israel. It will appear than Islam will win that war but that is when Christ comes back the second time to destroy all those arrayed against Israel. If you read the Quran you will find all these same events but in reverse. Perhaps as a second event (or as part of the original event) God will scorch the entire Earth to cleanse it but I do not think that humans will be habituating the planet when that event occurs. The scorched Earth will return to it's intended state of a paradise, the city of God will descend to replace Jerusalem. God's redeemed will return to Earth, and the damned, Hell, Satan, and his Demons will be annihilated and cease to exist. There is a lot of biblical details to connect all those dots in my extremely rough and brief description, but I don't think the dots you were giving can be connected by the bible.

Now, coming from the future and back into the past, Jesus said that universal salvation comes from the Jews. (John 4:22) Jeremiah said yes, as long as Israel remains as a People before the Lord forever. (Jeremiah 31:35-37) That's what HaShem said to Noah that universal destruction would never hit Mankind again as long as the natural laws won't cease to operate on earth for seed time and harvest, cold and heat, summer and winter and day an night. If you can apply some Logic, you will be able to understand the truth of the matter.(Genesis 8:21,22)

 

[Ben Avraham]

Sorry Ben, you will be resurrected at the end of time - whether you like it or not (maybe the second resurrection) Isaiah 26:19 Easy-to-Read Version (ERV) But the Lord says, “Your people have died, but they will live again. The bodies of my people will rise from death. Dead people in the ground, stand and be happy! The dew covering you is like the dew sparkling in the light of a new day. It shows that a new time is coming, when the earth will give birth to the dead who are in it.”

HaShem would never permit me to prove that his Prophets were lying. Bodily resurrection you will find only in your NT. Isaiah 26:19 means that "Your People have gone into exile but they will soon or later return to the Land of Israel." (Ezekiel 37:12) Those among the Jewish People in exile who return to the Land of Israel are risen from the graves of the exile. (Isaiah 53:8,9) That's what happened with the "Dry Bones" in the vision of Ezekiel 37:12.

 

[1robin]

Now, coming from the future and back into the past, Jesus said that universal salvation comes from the Jews. (John 4:22) Jeremiah said yes, as long as Israel remains as a People before the Lord forever. (Jeremiah 31:35-37) That's what HaShem said to Noah that universal destruction would never hit Mankind again as long as the natural laws won't cease to operate on earth for seed time and harvest, cold and heat, summer and winter and day an night. If you can apply some Logic, you will be able to understand the truth of the matter.(Genesis 8:21,22)

Re-quoting the same handful of verses I countered an hour ago does nothing to add anything to the debate.

Mankind has never been universally destroyed. There has been at least one human alive at all times since the first one appeared. There is no biblical doctrine of universal destruction to be defended or attacked. Not even concerning the after life.

I was just showing that at times you made up contexts and at others your interpretations were incorrect.

Lets do this one scripture at a time.

…21 “Believe Me, woman,” Jesus replied, “a time is coming when you will worship the Father neither on this mountain nor in Jerusalem. 22You worship what you do not know; we worship what we do know, for salvation is from the Jews. 23 But a time is coming and has now come when the true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and in truth, for the Father is seeking such as these to worship Him.…

This means that God promised Abraham that he would use Abraham's descendant (The Jews or Hebrews) as his revelatory conduit. He would reveal himself through them, culminating in Christ's ministry, death, and resurrection. If your implying any other context to John 4:22 (for instance anything to do with God destroying mankind) then your just making stuff up.

 

[Ben Avraham]

Re-quoting the same handful of verses I countered an hour ago does nothing to add anything to the debate. Mankind has never been universally destroyed. There has been at least one human alive at all times since the first one appeared. There is no biblical doctrine of universal destruction to be defended or attacked. Not even concerning the after life. I was just showing that at times you made up contexts and at others your interpretations were incorrect. Lets do this one scripture at a time.…21 “Believe Me, woman,” Jesus replied, “a time is coming when you will worship the Father neither on this mountain nor in Jerusalem. 22You worship what you do not know; we worship what we do know, for salvation is from the Jews. 23 But a time is coming and has now come when the true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and in truth, for the Father is seeking such as these to worship Him.…This means that God promised Abraham that he would use Abraham's descendant (The Jews or Hebrews) as his revelatory conduit. He would reveal himself through them, culminating in Christ's ministry, death, and resurrection. If your implying any other context to John 4:22 (for instance anything to do with God destroying mankind) then your just making stuff up.

I use "destruction of Mankind" as a hyperbolism to the high number of people destroyed by the waters of the Flood. Something akin but opposite to universal salvation to distinguish from personal salvation. Now, about that dialogue between Jesus and the Samaritan woman, I don't believe it ever happened if you consider that Jesus had just assigned his disciples on a mission to spread the gospel of salvation and had warned them not to go the way of the Gentiles, especially Samaritans and, as the disciples went off he waited for that chance to go to chat with a Samaritan woman, demonstrating a high degree of hypocrisy. (Mat. 10:5,6) And last but not least, could you provide us with an eyewitness that Jesus experienced bodily resurrection? Of course, you can't!