Shadow Wolf
Certified People sTabber & Business Owner
That all falls apart when we consider the reality that immigrants as a group are overall more law abiding than what American's typically are.
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Just for the brave among us -- analyze a Trump speech.
- Thread starter Evangelicalhumanist
- Start date
Balthazzar
N. Germanic Descent
Not really, no.
SkepticThinker
Veteran Member
Yes. Really.
"However, research indicates that immigrants commit less crimes than U.S.-born people.
Much of the available data focuses on incarceration rates because that's where immigration status is recorded.
Some of the most extensive research comes from Stanford University. Economist Ran Abramitzky found that since the 1960s, immigrants are 60% less likely to be incarcerated than U.S.-born people.
There is also state level research, that shows similar results: researchers at the CATO Institute, a libertarian think tank, looked into Texas in 2019. They found that undocumented immigrants were 37.1% less likely to be convicted of a crime.
Beyond incarceration rates, research also shows that there is no correlation between undocumented people and a rise in crime. Recent investigations by The New York Times and The Marshall Project found that between 2007 and 2016, there was no link between undocumented immigrants and a rise in violent or property crime in those communities.
The reason for this gap in criminal behavior might have to do with stability and achievement. The Stanford study concludes that first-generation male immigrants traditionally do better than U.S-.born men who didn't finish high school, which is the group most likely to be incarcerated in the U.S.
The study also suggests that there's a real fear of getting in trouble and being deported within immigrant communities. Far from engaging in criminal activities, immigrants mostly don't want to rock the boat.
But the idea that immigrants bring crime remains widespread."
"The study reveals that first-generation immigrants have not been more likely to be imprisoned than people born in the United States since 1880.
Today, immigrants are 30 percent less likely to be incarcerated than are U.S.-born individuals who are white, the study finds. And when the analysis is expanded to include Black Americans — whose prison rates are higher than the general population — the likelihood of an immigrant being incarcerated is 60 percent lower than of people born in the United States.
While other research has also debunked claims that immigration leads to more crime, this study of incarceration rates provides the broadest historical look at the relationship between immigration and crime across the country and over time, says author Abramitzky. Abramitzky is the Stanford Federal Credit Union Professor of Economics and senior associate dean of social sciences in the School of Humanities and Sciences, as well as a senior fellow at the Stanford Institute for Economic Policy Research (SIEPR)."
The mythical tie between immigration and crime
Research by Stanford’s Ran Abramitzky and co-authors uncovers the most extensive evidence to date that immigrants are less likely to be imprisoned than U.S.-born individuals.
"Criminality among the undocumented is a paramount social science concern. Yet despite substantial public and political attention, extant research has established surprisingly few empirical findings on the criminological impact of undocumented immigration. Leveraging a unique combination of data from the Texas Department of Public Safety and the Department of Homeland Security, this study sheds light on this understudied area of inquiry. Our analysis reveals two broad conclusions about the criminality of undocumented immigrants. First, undocumented immigrants have substantially lower rates of crime compared to both native US citizens and legal immigrants. Second, over the 7 y period from 2012 to 2018, the proportion of arrests involving undocumented immigrants in Texas was relatively stable or decreasing.
Taken together, these results have important theoretical and policy implications. Regarding public policy, these findings clearly run counter to some of the basic assumptions behind strict immigration enforcement strategies. Debates about undocumented immigration will no doubt continue, but they should do so informed by the available evidence. The results presented here significantly undermine the claims that undocumented immigrants pose a unique criminal risk. In fact, our results suggest that undocumented immigrants pose substantially less criminal risk than native US citizens."
Balthazzar
N. Germanic Descent
Yes. Really.
"However, research indicates that immigrants commit less crimes than U.S.-born people.
Much of the available data focuses on incarceration rates because that's where immigration status is recorded.
Some of the most extensive research comes from Stanford University. Economist Ran Abramitzky found that since the 1960s, immigrants are 60% less likely to be incarcerated than U.S.-born people.
There is also state level research, that shows similar results: researchers at the CATO Institute, a libertarian think tank, looked into Texas in 2019. They found that undocumented immigrants were 37.1% less likely to be convicted of a crime.
Beyond incarceration rates, research also shows that there is no correlation between undocumented people and a rise in crime. Recent investigations by The New York Times and The Marshall Project found that between 2007 and 2016, there was no link between undocumented immigrants and a rise in violent or property crime in those communities.
The reason for this gap in criminal behavior might have to do with stability and achievement. The Stanford study concludes that first-generation male immigrants traditionally do better than U.S-.born men who didn't finish high school, which is the group most likely to be incarcerated in the U.S.
The study also suggests that there's a real fear of getting in trouble and being deported within immigrant communities. Far from engaging in criminal activities, immigrants mostly don't want to rock the boat.
But the idea that immigrants bring crime remains widespread."
"The study reveals that first-generation immigrants have not been more likely to be imprisoned than people born in the United States since 1880.
Today, immigrants are 30 percent less likely to be incarcerated than are U.S.-born individuals who are white, the study finds. And when the analysis is expanded to include Black Americans — whose prison rates are higher than the general population — the likelihood of an immigrant being incarcerated is 60 percent lower than of people born in the United States.
While other research has also debunked claims that immigration leads to more crime, this study of incarceration rates provides the broadest historical look at the relationship between immigration and crime across the country and over time, says author Abramitzky. Abramitzky is the Stanford Federal Credit Union Professor of Economics and senior associate dean of social sciences in the School of Humanities and Sciences, as well as a senior fellow at the Stanford Institute for Economic Policy Research (SIEPR)."
The mythical tie between immigration and crime
Research by Stanford’s Ran Abramitzky and co-authors uncovers the most extensive evidence to date that immigrants are less likely to be imprisoned than U.S.-born individuals.siepr.stanford.edu
"Criminality among the undocumented is a paramount social science concern. Yet despite substantial public and political attention, extant research has established surprisingly few empirical findings on the criminological impact of undocumented immigration. Leveraging a unique combination of data from the Texas Department of Public Safety and the Department of Homeland Security, this study sheds light on this understudied area of inquiry. Our analysis reveals two broad conclusions about the criminality of undocumented immigrants. First, undocumented immigrants have substantially lower rates of crime compared to both native US citizens and legal immigrants. Second, over the 7 y period from 2012 to 2018, the proportion of arrests involving undocumented immigrants in Texas was relatively stable or decreasing.
Taken together, these results have important theoretical and policy implications. Regarding public policy, these findings clearly run counter to some of the basic assumptions behind strict immigration enforcement strategies. Debates about undocumented immigration will no doubt continue, but they should do so informed by the available evidence. The results presented here significantly undermine the claims that undocumented immigrants pose a unique criminal risk. In fact, our results suggest that undocumented immigrants pose substantially less criminal risk than native US citizens."
Do you feel all cozy and secure when you've been alerted of an escaped rapist murderer being loose in your community, on the run, and extremely dangerous?
SkepticThinker
Veteran Member
Which has what do to with immigrants, exactly?
I'd prefer you'd respond to the content you've been presented with.
Balthazzar
N. Germanic Descent
Did you watch the speech?
Are you equating rapist murderers with immigrants? On what basis? Because Trumpy told you so?
SkepticThinker
Veteran Member
Can you respond to the evidence presented to you that counters your claim?
Balthazzar
N. Germanic Descent
Yes. In the speech it was suggested. The alegations may or may not be true. The immigration issue is real and to be honest about it, coming from a long history and understanding of the many threats and violence associated with the territory they are coming from, I have no reason not to, at the very least, presume it is an accurate assessment. They are 1. running from those threats in fear of violence or 2. They are coming in for another reason. What that reason is, likely involves our securities on U.S soil. As a citizen, I am compelled to take note of the potential dangers associated with the inflow of people from other areas, particularly as it might relate to global hostilities and intent by other world leaders, who may or may not be hostile towards the United States.
SkepticThinker
Veteran Member
The allegations are not true.
As per the data that you've ignored.
Pogo
Well-Known Member
And the relation of that statement to immigrant status is?
You have been presented with evidence -- but you prefer to listen to one man, probably the best-known liar on earth. What else can we say? Your mind's made up, the evidence be damned.
Balthazzar
N. Germanic Descent
My relation to immigrant status? What are you asking? I'm a united states citizen, born in the USA. Do you like Cheech and Chong? "Born in the USA" haha.
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Balthazzar
N. Germanic Descent
I was under the impression that ICE provided this information and something about the Fraternal Order of Police, but on that last bit I'm unsure. The statement still stands, two attempts on his life have been made in less than 3 months, and the world is at war, and this nation may or may not be in the balance. What would you have me do? Shrug it off as false political propaganda? I don't think I'll be voting for Trump, but this isn't really the point, anyway. It's a risk assessment and I've stated why I take note of the risk factors associated with it.
Two attempts on his life, eh? And how many of those two were by immigrants, and how many by "born-in-the-USA" types? Maybe you should look more closely into who you should fear.
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Balthazzar
N. Germanic Descent
I'm sure that isn't my point. We live in a dangerous world. This is my point, specifically.
Pogo
Well-Known Member
You rather missed the point that an escaped rapist is an escaped rapist and should be dealt with accordingly by the public. Where he lived before being incarcerated is irrelevant except that he may attempt to return there as a known environment. This would be true whether he was an immigrant or not and even bringing up the scenario in a thread about immigrants is demonstrating an unreasonable bias due to an irrelevant quality.
Balthazzar
N. Germanic Descent
I'm certain I made point that we consider that not all are the same. All white people are not the same, and not all black people are the same, etc. Pointing out the needed caution to live in peace among each other. Ask me who I was speaking to.
Everyone
It's a dangerous world we live in.
Pogo
Well-Known Member
And I was making the point that a rapist is rapist, but like a garden variety xenophobe you think there is more to it than that.
Sad.
Balthazzar
N. Germanic Descent
Some were stated to be rapists, others were stated to be rapists and torturers, others still were stated to be rapists, torturers, and murders, and each crime I'm sure also separated between them as single-crimes committed, individually. To be cautious means to be careful. This is already warranted in today's world.
The statements made in the speech, places more urgency in that suggestion ... to be cautious and careful, whether you are an immigrant, a citizen, or a government employee; it's a generalized concern for everyone and this is what I was implying. This is due to our global threats reaching our soil, so take it for what it's worth. It's entirely up to you.