justification by faith alone?

[1213]

Jews were loyal to God, but always picked on. They remained loyal as they were tortured to death by Nazis. God wasn't righteous to allow that.

Sorry, I don't believe Jews have been loyal to God, for example because this happened:

"'But if you will not listen to me, and will not do all these commandments; and if you shall reject my statutes, and if your soul abhors my ordinances, so that you will not do all my commandments, but break my covenant; I also will do this to you: I will appoint terror over you, even consumption and fever, that shall consume the eyes, and make the soul to pine away; and you will sow your seed in vain, for your enemies will eat it.
Leviticus 26:14-16

I will scatter you among the nations, and I will draw out the sword after you: and your land will be a desolation, and your cities shall be a waste.
Leviticus 26:33

But not all of them have been unfaithful, because:

Yet for all that, when they are in the land of their enemies, I will not reject them, neither will I abhor them, to destroy them utterly, and to break my covenant with them; for I am Yahweh their God; but I will for their sake remember the covenant of their ancestors, whom I brought forth out of the land of Egypt in the sight of the nations, that I might be their God. I am Yahweh.'"
Leviticus 26:44-45

I believe, if righteous person suffers and dies, all of that will be compensated to him by God in eternal life, which is why I don't think it is a problem, if God allows even a righteous person to suffer in this first death.

These will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.
Mat. 25:46

For the wages of sin is death, but the free gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.
Romans 6:23

 

[metis]

The Religious Right wants wars (Iraq, Afghanistan, North Korea, Niger, Iran, and rattle sabers at Russia--threatening nuclear war), torture camps, gun rights (must be a member of the National Rifle Association to run for the presidency). They pamper the rich with lower taxes, insist that universal health care is Socialism, and don't realize that Jesus was for it (healed everyone, didn't charge). They outsource factories for cheap foreign labor, they beg for donations, claiming that God will pay them back ten fold. Joel Olsteen bought a multi-million dollar jet with donated money.

It is hard to believe that the Religious Right and the Catholic church are part of the same religion. By the way, the pope is on the enemies list of the NRA.

So well said, imo!!!

 

[metis]

Sorry, I don't believe Jews have been loyal to God, for example because this happened:

Not all Jews are the same, so why accept a stereotype of them?

For the wages of sin is death, but the free gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.
Romans 6:23

So, if one is not a Christian, what supposedly happens to them?

 

[wellwisher]

In Christianity, when people talk about "justification by faith alone" what exactly do they mean by "faith" in this context?

One way to explain this is with an example. Say you were in the army and at war. Your Commanding Officer tells you and your peers you need to take and secure the enemy hill.

A good soldier is required to not ask any questions, but to follow the order. You may have questions and inner doubts, but you must use faith in the order and fate, the context of the situation, and go for it.

If you fall short, and the enemy keeps the hill, there is no shame, since you walked into the jaws of fear, without knowing what to expect. You fought the good fight have been justified by faith and fate.

Or if, if when taking over the hill, the fear and stress of the blood and death makes you so full of adrenaline, that you shoot people who wish to become prisoners. There is no crime, in the face of war, since you were following orders to secure the hill. Faith puts you above the law, in favor of a higher type of law.

In most scenarios of faith in life, things are not as dire. But the process of faith is still about following the orders and wishes of a different commander in chief. There is no fear, guilt or shame for your works of faiths, since one is justify by faith apart from the works of the law; soldier in Christ.

 

[InChrist]

The Religious Right wants wars (Iraq, Afghanistan, North Korea, Niger, Iran, and rattle sabers at Russia--threatening nuclear war), torture camps, gun rights (must be a member of the National Rifle Association to run for the presidency). They pamper the rich with lower taxes, insist that universal health care is Socialism, and don't realize that Jesus was for it (healed everyone, didn't charge). They outsource factories for cheap foreign labor, they beg for donations, claiming that God will pay them back ten fold. Joel Olsteen bought a multi-million dollar jet with donated money.

It is hard to believe that the Religious Right and the Catholic church are part of the same religion. By the way, the pope is on the enemies list of the NRA.

Well, you are talking about politics, politicians, religionists, greedy televangelists, scammers and war mongers.
I’m talking about faith in Jesus Christ alone for forgiveness and eternal life.

 

[1213]

Not all Jews are the same, so why accept a stereotype of them?

Sorry, I didn't mean to say they all are the same. Many Jews have been righteous and many have not been. If they all would have been righteous all the time, I don't think they would have had to endure so much difficulties.

So, if one is not a Christian, what supposedly happens to them?

By what the Bible tells, Christian is a disciple of Jesus. I don't think it is a problem if person is not a disciple of Jesus. The crucial thing is, is the person righteous or not, because eternal life is promised only for righteous.

These will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.
Mat. 25:46

For the wages of sin is death, but the free gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.
Romans 6:23

And I think it is possible to count person righteous, even if he has not heard of Jesus, by this:

For as many as have sinned without law will also perish without the law. As many as have sinned under the law will be judged by the law. For it isn't the hearers of the law who are righteous before God, but the doers of the law will be justified (for when Gentiles who don't have the law do by nature the things of the law, these, not having the law, are a law to themselves, in that they show the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience testifying with them, and their thoughts among themselves accusing or else excusing them) in the day when God will judge the secrets of men, according to my gospel, by Jesus Christ.
Romans 2:12-16

 

[metis]

If they all would have been righteous all the time, I don't think they would have had to endure so much difficulties.

But isn't this also true of Christians as well?

The crucial thing is, is the person righteous or not, because eternal life is promised only for righteous.

Makes sense to me.

And I think it is possible to count person righteous, even if he has not heard of Jesus, by this:

For as many as have sinned without law will also perish without the law. As many as have sinned under the law will be judged by the law. For it isn't the hearers of the law who are righteous before God, but the doers of the law will be justified (for when Gentiles who don't have the law do by nature the things of the law, these, not having the law, are a law to themselves, in that they show the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience testifying with them, and their thoughts among themselves accusing or else excusing them) in the day when God will judge the secrets of men, according to my gospel, by Jesus Christ.
Romans 2:12-16

We're pretty much on the same page, so thanks for the clarification.

 

[1213]

But isn't this also true of Christians as well?
...

I think so.

 

[paarsurrey]

In Christianity, when people talk about "justification by faith alone" what exactly do they mean by "faith" in this context?

They mean blindfaith and or blind-belief, one gets to know:

"If a blind man leads a blind man, both will fall into a pit.”
Matthew 15:14 Disregard them! They are blind guides. If a blind man leads a blind man, both will fall into a pit."
Right?

Regards

 

[Jedster]

@Eddi

John 29 Then Jesus told him, “Because you have seen me, you have believed; blessed are those who have not seen and yet have believed.”


"......blessed are those who have not seen and yet have believed.”

 

[Messianic Israelite]

In Christianity, when people talk about "justification by faith alone" what exactly do they mean by "faith" in this context?

If we truly have faith in Yahshua, we won't be breaking the commandments of Yahweh. Why? Because Yahshua our Savior was a commandment keeper who kept all of Yahweh's commandments perfectly. If we believe that Yahshua was resurrected because he was perfect, and pleased Yahweh in all his ways, then we also would also keep the commandments in order to receive the resurrection to eternal life. He is after all, our rabbi, teacher and Savior. Isn't that what the Passover is all about? Imitating what Yahshua did, when he knelt and washed the disciples feet. The lesson is that we are to imitate Yahshua and Yahshua kept the commandments of Yahweh.

Romans 3:31 says: "Do we, then, nullify the law by this faith? Not at all! Rather, we uphold the law."

When Chr-stianity claims the Law has been done away with, they're not showing faith in Yahshua. Yahshua suffered bled and died to show us it is possible, especially with the help of the Holy Spirit, to keep all of Yahweh's commandments. I think sometimes how Yahweh must view Chr-stianity. They have the idea that the Law has been done away with, similar to thinking that half of a journey (up to Yahshua) we obey all the rules of the road, stop at traffic lights, observe speed limits etc but on the way back (after Yahshua) we could break all these rules. It's going to end in a terrible car crash for those who adhere to these evil ideas which have been promulgated by Satan.

Romans 4:13 says righteousness comes of faith. The definition of righteousness is given in the Bible. It is obedience to the commandments, Deut 6:25. Atheists many times say they don't have to have faith to be good, but without faith we won't be keeping all of the commandments. It's as simple as that. The Law of Yahweh demands we have faith in Him. The first commandment in the Ten Commandment proves this.

 

[Wildswanderer]

So, basically to have faith means to believe that the claims of Christianity are true?

But isn't there more to it than that?

Such as a commitment to live your life accordingly?

Our works cannot contribute anything to our salvation. We do good, rather, as a result of salvation.

 

[Secret Chief]

By inclination, yeah, I guess I am.

If I were asked to compile a personal Bible, it would include - alongside The Psalms, Ecclesiastes, The Gospels and Revelation - The Dhammapada, The Baghavad Gita, The Upanishads, The Tibetan Book of the Dead, The Tao te Ching, and the poetry of Rumi and Attar.

You're just a confused young man

 

[RestlessSoul]

You're just a confused *young man

* Old. But yeah.

 

[Secret Chief]

* Old. But yeah.

Well, a tad younger than me

 

[paarsurrey]

They mean blindfaith and or blind-belief, one gets to know:

"If a blind man leads a blind man, both will fall into a pit.”
Matthew 15:14 Disregard them! They are blind guides. If a blind man leads a blind man, both will fall into a pit."
Right?

Jesus did not support the " blindfaith", it shows, please. Right?

Regards

 

[Brian2]

If we truly have faith in Yahshua, we won't be breaking the commandments of Yahweh. Why? Because Yahshua our Savior was a commandment keeper who kept all of Yahweh's commandments perfectly. If we believe that Yahshua was resurrected because he was perfect, and pleased Yahweh in all his ways, then we also would also keep the commandments in order to receive the resurrection to eternal life. He is after all, our rabbi, teacher and Savior. Isn't that what the Passover is all about? Imitating what Yahshua did, when he knelt and washed the disciples feet. The lesson is that we are to imitate Yahshua and Yahshua kept the commandments of Yahweh.

Romans 3:31 says: "Do we, then, nullify the law by this faith? Not at all! Rather, we uphold the law."

When Chr-stianity claims the Law has been done away with, they're not showing faith in Yahshua. Yahshua suffered bled and died to show us it is possible, especially with the help of the Holy Spirit, to keep all of Yahweh's commandments. I think sometimes how Yahweh must view Chr-stianity. They have the idea that the Law has been done away with, similar to thinking that half of a journey (up to Yahshua) we obey all the rules of the road, stop at traffic lights, observe speed limits etc but on the way back (after Yahshua) we could break all these rules. It's going to end in a terrible car crash for those who adhere to these evil ideas which have been promulgated by Satan.

Romans 4:13 says righteousness comes of faith. The definition of righteousness is given in the Bible. It is obedience to the commandments, Deut 6:25. Atheists many times say they don't have to have faith to be good, but without faith we won't be keeping all of the commandments. It's as simple as that. The Law of Yahweh demands we have faith in Him. The first commandment in the Ten Commandment proves this.

Romans 13:8 Let no debt remain outstanding, except the continuing debt to love one another, for whoever loves others has fulfilled the law. 9 The commandments, “You shall not commit adultery,” “You shall not murder,” “You shall not steal,” “You shall not covet,” and whatever other command there may be, are summed up in this one command: “Love your neighbor as yourself.” 10 Love does no harm to a neighbor. Therefore love is the fulfillment of the law.,

Gal 5:14 For the entire law is fulfilled in keeping this one command: “Love your neighbor as yourself.

So there is no need to judge your brothers and sisters over the law and whether they should be keeping all the individual commands when they fulfil the law by loving their neighbour and acting accordingly.
It's not a matter of "loving our neighbour means that we need to keep all the commands" it is the other way around, "loving our neighbour means that we are keeping all the commands"
The principle of the law remains, love, and the Spirit was given at Pentecost (the day the Law was given through Moses).
The whole question of Gentiles needing to keep the law was answered at the council of Jerusalem (Acts 15)
The reason that the letter was sent out to Christians to do certain things was so that the Jewish Christians would not feel as if they could not fellowship with the Gentile Christians, the list seems to have been the same things that Gentiles had to obey to become God fearers.
It was all about appeasing Jewish scruples.