KY County Clerk could be held in contempt of court for refusing to issue marriage licenses

[leibowde84]

The zaniness of the high court ruling that homosexuals can be married.

Your subjective opinion that the decision was "zany", or anyone elses for that matter, in no way gives anyone the right to break the law. The Judge did the right thing today. If she felt that she was not able to fulfill her duties because of her religious beliefs, it was on her to resign.

 

[columbus]

The Judge did the right thing today. If she felt that she was not able to fulfill her duties because of her religious beliefs, it was on her to resign.

What is hard about this?
If she were Muslim she couldn't refuse a Board of Health certificate to a restaurant because they serve pork. If she were Jewish she could not refuse to issue a permit for a public event on Saturday.

How did she manage to achieve martyr status?
Tom

 

[Kilgore Trout]

How did she manage to achieve martyr status?

Many Christians have a particular talent for achieving martyrdom in ways us lesser people could never hope to.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

While I applaud her principles, the zany current law has made it impossible for her to do her job. She really has no choice but to withdraw from the position.

How is it making it impossible for her to do her job? She is an elected official, sworn to uphold the constitutional law of America, and it was only her own stubbornness that keeps her from doing her job.

Usually, common law marriages require the people to live together and intermingle their finances for at least 7 years, something that, according to most religions, would be a sin.

It depends on the individual state if common-law marriages are allowed or not. Some do, and require various points to be met, and many states do not recognize them.

Divorce does not negate that a true marriage is supposed to be between a man and a woman. Sometimes it doesn't work out. She should be commended that she kept trying despite it not working out for her in the past.

According to the laws that she is claiming to espouse, she should never have been allowed to remarry, and because she did she should have been stoned to death.

How did she manage to achieve martyr status?

My guess, thinking back to my days as such a Conservative, is that for years now they have been hyping up a "doomsday" scenario in which Christianity becomes illegal, how the world is out to get them and prosecute them, and they can expect the world to treat them poorly because Jesus said to expect it. And now they see their religion is loosing favor in the public realm, and here they have an example of someone who stood on her religious grounds and denied gay marriage certificates. They aren't viewing it as an issue of equality, as an issue of separation of church and state (which does not exist to many of them), or even as an issue of a religious super-majority having to yield so that others who do not believe as they do can enjoy equal rights. Many of them adhere to some form of Dominion Theology, many of them view America as God's Country, and this incident is not an issue of equality but an issue of a Christian being persecuted for standing on Christian principle. They probably don't even focus much on her obligations as an elected official to uphold the law, ignoring how she pretty much said "**** the oath" and did what she wanted to anyways. The won't see the slippery slopes of other religious exceptions that could be made, but they will see her quoted as saying she acted on "God's authority."

 

[Deidre]

Yes.

Go be a bigot, I mean... ''practice'' your faith...somewhere else.

 

[HekaMa'atRa]

When will all this persecution of Christians and attacks on religious liberty end? It might not be so smart to denigrate and abuse people who have Almighty God on their side. It's only a matter of time before God swoops down, breaks her out of jail, and smites all the sodomites who are destroying the sanctity of marriage.

The United States of Sodom and Gomorrah!

Amiright?

 

[suncowiam]

Yes.

Go be a bigot, I mean... ''practice'' your faith...somewhere else.

Not only a bigot but a hypocrite concerning her marriages. Even the Westboro church dinged her on her past marriages.

I guess all is forgiven when you repent and born again. That gives her the right to condemn others that have not. I get the logic now.

 

[columbus]

It has been verified and confirmed by the woman herself. Sends kind of a mixed signal on her view toward the "sanctity of marriage", doesn't it?

I don't know if this is true or not. But at worst it is really juicy gossip.
According to my partner's Facebook sources, Ms Davis has 4 children. The kids have 3 different fathers. She never married 2 of the fathers, much less divorced them.
Perhaps someone who cares more than I do could verify or correct this.
Tom

 

[Shadow Wolf]

I don't know if this is true or not. But at worst it is really juicy gossip.
According to my partner's Facebook sources, Ms Davis has 4 children. The kids have 3 different fathers. She never married 2 of the fathers, much less divorced them.
Perhaps someone who cares more than I do could verify or correct this.
Tom

According to the New York Times, she has been married four times, and the guy she is with now she has married twice (the wording wasn't great - it seems that that is what the article is saying). I also found this quote from the judge who handled the case, which I thought was a great quote that sums up the heart of the issue:
“I myself have genuinely held religious beliefs,” the judge said, but “I took an oath.” He noted: “Mrs. Davis took an oath. Oaths mean things.”

 

[Deidre]

Don't think she should serve jail time. When they lock up all the Bishops, Cardinals and the rest of the clergy who 'knew' and covered up the sexual molestation cases of the priests they presided over, then maybe....but, there are far worse situations where no one serves jail time, but she should lose her job. That should be a given. Sometimes, I wonder if people like her though will just pull stunts like this to gain attention for themselves. Hard to say.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Don't think she should serve jail time. When they lock up all the Bishops, Cardinals and the rest of the clergy who 'knew' and covered up the sexual molestation cases of the priests they presided over, then maybe....but, there are far worse situations where no one serves jail time, but she should lose her job. That should be a given. Sometimes, I wonder if people like her though will just pull stunts like this to gain attention for themselves. Hard to say.

According to the judge, a fine will not be as strong of a message as jail that oaths mean something. But, I have to agree, jail time is not suitable. It isn't a violent offense, there is no reason she should be separated from the public, thus jail time does not seem appropriate. I think impeaching her would be more than a sufficient punishment, as that alone shows that oath breakers will not be tolerated.

 

[Jeremy Taylor]

She should obey the law, although I think that all those not obeying federal laws or those ignoring the separation of powers should be equally penalised.

 

[Copernicus]

Kim Davis's defenders are pointing out that she converted to her present faith only 4 years ago, so I'm guessing that she considers herself absolved of prior sins by virtue of that conversion. I have no idea what she considered herself before then.

There is another wrinkle to this case. Davis runs an office with appointed "deputies", who can issue the licenses in her stead. Apparently, since they work for her, she could fire them for insubordination if they issued the licenses without her approval. That's because they were not elected and can be removed without impeachment proceedings in the state legislature. (The next session of the legislature will be in January, and the governor refuses to call a special session just for these cases.) Some of her deputies have said that they are willing to issue those permits, and the judge has said that Davis can go free, if she lets that happen. However, she has forbidden her employees to obey the law. So this is not just personal qualms about herself signing off on the certificates. She is blocking her county government from signing off on them.

Basically, this case is becoming a political football, with Republicans largely getting behind Davis' unlawful behavior or staying silent on the matter. Even Democrats don't want to touch it, because there is a governor's race in progress. The Republican candidate for governor is applauding the illegal behavior and blaming the Democratic opponent for not cracking down on abortion rights, etc. In a conservative state, nobody wants to support the Constitutional separation of church and state.

 

[Jeremy Taylor]

Her sins don't matter. People have some very strange idea about hypocrisy means, even some hypocritical ideas. Hypocrisy doesn't necessarily mean you tell others not to do what you have done. It means you hide what you have done or hold yourself higher than others for what you have done. She isn't a hypocrite for simply holding to her beliefs in this way.

But she is breaking the law, though so are those who refuse to enforce other federal laws and provisions, from immigration to marijuana, so she shouldn't be singled out.

 

[columbus]

There is another wrinkle to this case. Davis runs an office with appointed "deputies", who can issue the licenses in her stead. Apparently, since they work for her, she could fire them for insubordination if they issued the licenses without her approval.

So, while she is in the slammer one of her deputies could do her lawful job. Then she could fire them for insubordination.
Then they could file suit for wrongful termination.

Boy, there is a case I would love to see go to court.
Tom

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

Divorce does not negate that a true marriage is supposed to be between a man and a woman.

Only when for True Scotsmen.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

At this point the vote is Yes 26, No 0. That would have been inconceivable a few decades ago. Not bad ...

 

[beenherebeforeagain]

Sometimes, I wonder if people like her though will just pull stunts like this to gain attention for themselves. Hard to say.

Or for their cause. Not everyone is out for glory for themselves, at least not entirely.

 

[Jainarayan]

When will all this persecution of Christians and attacks on religious liberty end? It might not be so smart to denigrate and abuse people who have Almighty God on their side. It's only a matter of time before God swoops down, breaks her out of jail, and smites all the sodomites who are destroying the sanctity of marriage.

I won't hang by my neck waiting.

 

[Deidre]

Or for their cause. Not everyone is out for glory for themselves, at least not entirely.

Yea, I have a feeling she won't be the last 'story' we read about.