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Let's see if we can figure this out about the old Piltdown Man

Heyo

Heyo

Veteran Member
Wildswanderer said:
That assumes that everyone who eats cake vomits it up. This certainly isn't the case with cake or religion.
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It is the case that each religion has a different colour of vomit. So, without any experience, I can conclude that not all religions can be right - but they can all be wrong.
I'll do what I do with competing scientific hypothesis. I wait which side brings up the better arguments and successful predictions in the discourse. When one religion has convinced all the religious people, I'll take a closer look.
 
W

Wildswanderer

Veteran Member
Heyo said:
It is the case that each religion has a different colour of vomit. So, without any experience, I can conclude that not all religions can be right - but they can all be wrong.
I'll do what I do with competing scientific hypothesis. I wait which side brings up the better arguments and successful predictions in the discourse. When one religion has convinced all the religious people, I'll take a closer look.
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Religion isn't just about the mind.
It's not a formula. You have to engage the spirit to understand the spiritual.
 
Heyo

Heyo

Veteran Member
Wildswanderer said:
Religion isn't just about the mind.
It's not a formula. You have to engage the spirit to understand the spiritual.
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There's only one problem: I'm a mutant, I have no spirit. That part of the brain that is usually concerned with the spiritual is all connected to the mind in my brain.
 
ppp

ppp

Well-Known Member
Wildswanderer said:
It certainly does matter. Because you will find what you are looking for either way.
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What about all of the times I found something other than what I thought I would find? What about all the times I found what I didn't want and accepted the correction? You are assuming that because your existential beliefs are governed by your wants and desires that everyone must be. You do know that not everyone shares your temperament?
 
W

Wildswanderer

Veteran Member
Policy said:
What about all of the times I found something other than what I thought I would find? What about all the times I found what I didn't want and accepted the correction? You are assuming that because your existential beliefs are governed by your wants and desires that everyone must be. You do know that not everyone shares your temperament?
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It's not my temperament I'm talking about.
If you search honestly you will find God because you will find him when you seek with all your heart.
But if half hearted or cynical it's unlikely.
 
Valjean

Valjean

Veteran Member
Premium Member
YoursTrue said: ↑
Life is a miracle. Not all see that either.
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Certainly not those who see the underlying mechanism. Once you understand the mechanism of a miracle, it no longer appears miraculous.
There was once a time when sunrise, earthquakes, seasons, wind and rain were miraculous works of God.
 
Valjean

Valjean

Veteran Member
Premium Member
Wildswanderer said: ↑
According to liberal " scholars" perhaps. Not in reality.
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No, according to historians and biblical scholars, of every political bent.
Wildswanderer said: ↑
Have you read them in order to find faith or in order to find fault?
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So read them with a confirmation bias vs reading them critically?
Faith us unsupported belief. Why would anyone seek it?
Wildswanderer said:
It's not my temperament I'm talking about.
If you search honestly you will find God because you will find him when you seek with all your heart.
But if half hearted or cynical it's unlikely.
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So if you already presume God, then you will "find him" if you seek him?
People have been doing this for thousands of years, and all they find is a deity confirming their own values and biases. But since the advent of critical analysis and skepticism, human knowledge and technology has skyrocketed, and all agree on the facts.
 
tas8831

tas8831

Well-Known Member
Wildswanderer said:
Because obviously leaning left could never influence their " science" especially if they are being funded by people with like views...
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Why not leave in the context?

When the scientist is proved wrong, he/she admits the error and moves on*. When the Preacher makes an error, they deny they were wrong, and call the doubters blasphemers and such.​


*Unless the scientist is aligned with the political right, then they double down because they have a built-in tribe of mouth-breathers that hang on their every word even when the facts are presented to them. E.g., the Demon Sperm doctor, the fools claiming HCQ and Ivermectin cure/prevent Covid, Malone claiming to have invented mRNA vaccines, etc.
​
What did I write that is not true?
 
tas8831

tas8831

Well-Known Member
Wildswanderer said:
It's as simple as opening your mind to new possibilities... This is exactly what people do when they want to get in shape for example. At first it seems impossible because they have ingrained habits they have formed for years. So you first have to deliberately give yourself a pep talk whenever you go to work out. Once you know change is possible, you start to see change, even if it is in tiny increments. You might not think you can just decide to believe in God, but if you allow it as a possibility, and start to explore the benefits soon it will be a new groove that your brain accepts as normal.
Click to expand...

For many years, I was totally convinced of the reality of alien abduction. I read Whit Strieber's books and was hooked. Everything seemed legitimate. I can remember shaking my head at 'the deniers', wondering why they could not accept the truth of the claims of these people.

Then.... I started learning more about science. I learned about psychoses and neuroses and the power of suggestion, I saw tapes of the hypnosis sessions and interviews of the abductees and realized it was not as I had believed. I now regret being so gullible. In a way, I still wish this stuff was true because I find it fascinating. But it isn't.

I opened my mind to new possibilities when I read the books and saw the TV specials early on.
Then I opened my mind to the possibility that I had been wrong to accept it all at face value. And when I did that, the transition was simple - the evidence was against abductions, and in favor of various other explanations.

If only you could take your own advice, like I did.
 
tas8831

tas8831

Well-Known Member
Wildswanderer said:
Well, some believers would say you were never really a Christian then, as many accept the Once saved, always saved doctrine. I don't necessarily believe that's always the case, but it is a real possibility.
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Right - when others don't fall for the scam, it MUST be the No True Scotsman fallacy!
 
tas8831

tas8831

Well-Known Member
Wildswanderer said:
I didn't plagiarize, so you lied and also you miss used a smiley, breaking two forum rules.
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Right - you didn't plagiarize, you just copy-pasted the exact quote Bumpkin had written in his post - to include the use of square brackets. Oh, wait - you didn't cut very well and lopped of the first bracket - but totally not plagiarism...

Also, if using a smiley was against the forum rules when one thinks something is funny, how am I breaking the rules?


YOU WROTE:

"T]he entire cell can be viewed as a factory that contains an elaborate network of interlocking assembly lines, each of which is composed of a set of large protein machines.… Why do we call the large protein assemblies that underlie cell function protein machines? Precisely because, like machines invented by humans to deal efficiently with the macroscopic world, these protein assemblies contain highly coordinated moving parts."
(U.S. National Academy of Sciences Bruce Albert)​

Did you not?

Here is what I found on Bumkin's anti-evolution page:

[T]he entire cell can be viewed as a factory that contains an elaborate network of interlocking assembly lines, each of which is composed of a set of large protein machines.… Why do we call the large protein assemblies that underlie cell function protein machines? Precisely because, like machines invented by humans to deal efficiently with the macroscopic world, these protein assemblies contain highly coordinated moving parts.​

(Bruce Alberts, “The Cell as a Collection of Protein Machines: Preparing the Next Generation of Molecular Biologists,” Cell, 92 (February 6, 1998): 291–294)


Are we to conclude that you just happened to quote the exact same thing that Bumkin did, to include the use of square brackets? Excuse me - you just used one closing bracket?

Who do you think you are fooling?

I should add that it may not have been plagiarized from that specific page of Bumkin's - he has used the exact same quote with the exact same use of square brackets on more than a dozen of his sites/essays.

Suffice it to say, it is beyond the realm of mere chance that this creationist could have read and chosen to copy-paste the exact same quote using the exact same notation (failed copy job notwithstanding) by chance alone.
 
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