Let's Talk About Kali

[JustGeorge]

Kali is a complex goddess.

Emanating from Durga's head during a battle, she is a destructive goddess. She rules over time and the cycles it brings with it. She is loving, but not the type to coddle.

She was Sri Ramakrishna's beloved Maa, showing herself physically to him when he threatened to do away with himself.

What do you know about Kali? What do you want to know?

 

[Jimmy]

What’s a Maa?

 

[JustGeorge]

What’s a Maa?

Mother.

Some Hindus worship the Divine in a feminine form, and may refer to them as Mother.

 

[Jimmy]

Mother.

Some Hindus worship the Divine in a feminine form, and may refer to them as Mother.

I thought so. Thank you

 

[sun rise]

I've not been able to reconcile Kali Maa with the Kali Yuga (yuga - one of the 4 ages in the cycle of existence. (Satya, Treta, Dvapara and Kali). I can easily accept that we're in the Kali Yuga (iron age) when morality has deteriorated. The image of Kali I'm familiar with, bloody sword and all, certainly fits. But I can't get from that to Kali Maa. And the Divine Mother symbol during a time when the patriarchal view of life is ascendant is contradictory.

Also I am familiar with Ramakrishna (Narendra's) song which ends:

​

Upon the sea of the world unfolds the lotus of the New Day,​

And there the Mother sits enshrined in blissful majesty.​

See how the bees are mad with joy, sipping the nectar there!​

​

Behold the Mother's radiant face, which so enchants the heart​

And captivates the universe! About Her Lotus Feet​

Bands of ecstatic holy men are dancing in delight.​

​

What matchless loveliness is Hers! What infinite content​

Pervades the heart when She appears! O brothers, says Premdas,​

I humbly beg you, one and all, to sing the Mother's praise!​

 

[JustGeorge]

I've not been able to reconcile Kali Maa with the Kali Yuga (yuga - one of the 4 ages in the cycle of existence. (Satya, Treta, Dvapara and Kali). I can easily accept that we're in the Kali Yuga (iron age) when morality has deteriorated. The image of Kali I'm familiar with, bloody sword and all, certainly fits. But I can't get from that to Kali Maa. And the Divine Mother symbol during a time when the patriarchal view of life is ascendant is contradictory.

Think of Kali Maa like a Mother Bear. A mother bear takes care of her cubs at all costs. You definitely don't want to run into Maa Bear in the woods.

Another idea that comes to mind... chemotherapy. Its brutal. Terrible. It'll render you powerless. And it will save your life.

Patriarchy is... falling, in my opinion. Its still dominant. But, Dear Old Dad has had his time in the sun, and I suspect he'll take a nap sooner or later, and more Motherly figures or ideals may come forward. Some will eschew religion entirely, but take on Her ideals through environmentalism. Nature based religions, and cyclic religions are making slow but steady progress.

The fact that you and I, both both into patriarchal society, sit here and speak on this topic speaks volumes to me. Progress.

Some things(negative habits, trends, ideals, ways of life) will have to die, but there will be a great rebirth, I feel.

Also I am familiar with Ramakrishna (Narendra's) song which ends:

​

Upon the sea of the world unfolds the lotus of the New Day,​

And there the Mother sits enshrined in blissful majesty.​

See how the bees are mad with joy, sipping the nectar there!​

​

Behold the Mother's radiant face, which so enchants the heart​

And captivates the universe! About Her Lotus Feet​

Bands of ecstatic holy men are dancing in delight.​

​

What matchless loveliness is Hers! What infinite content​

Pervades the heart when She appears! O brothers, says Premdas,​

I humbly beg you, one and all, to sing the Mother's praise!​

Beautiful!

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

I've not been able to reconcile Kali Maa with the Kali Yuga (yuga - one of the 4 ages in the cycle of existence. (Satya, Treta, Dvapara and Kali). I can easily accept that we're in the Kali Yuga (iron age) when morality has deteriorated. The image of Kali I'm familiar with, bloody sword and all, certainly fits. But I can't get from that to Kali Maa. And the Divine Mother symbol during a time when the patriarchal view of life is ascendant is contradictory.

Also I am familiar with Ramakrishna (Narendra's) song which ends:

​

Upon the sea of the world unfolds the lotus of the New Day,​

And there the Mother sits enshrined in blissful majesty.​

See how the bees are mad with joy, sipping the nectar there!​

​

Behold the Mother's radiant face, which so enchants the heart​

And captivates the universe! About Her Lotus Feet​

Bands of ecstatic holy men are dancing in delight.​

​

What matchless loveliness is Hers! What infinite content​

Pervades the heart when She appears! O brothers, says Premdas,​

I humbly beg you, one and all, to sing the Mother's praise!​

The Kali referred to in the Kali Yuga is not the goddess Kali. It's an unrelated demon. Yugas are usually a concept found in Vaishnavism, which worships Vishnu as supreme, and centers around his incarnations as avatars throughout different ages. It's not a concept in Shaivism, Shaktism or Tantra, where the worship of the goddess Kali is usually found.

Kali (demon) - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

What do you know about Kali? What do you want to know?

A lot. I've experienced her love before when I was a Shakta. She's very beautiful and will hold your hand through struggles when you're ready. She prefers her devotees approach her as a child approaches their mother. She can be very tender. But she is very intense. She is viewed as black or dark blue and nude because this is a metaphor for eternity and the infinite. She's clad in the infinite.

Now she does have a more frightening aspect, which is rather vampiric. This is because she not only birthes the Cosmos, but she will eventually devour it in the great dissolution that is part of the eternal cycle of things. All things return to the Void from which all potential springs. This is scary to some, but it is just Nature and needs to be accepted. She has a lot of death aspects, being Time itself but saves her devotees through empowerment. She will help you see through illusion to the truth beyond, being the ruler of Maya.

I always loved this song:

"Maha Kali, dark mother dance for me
Let the purity of your nakedness awaken me
Yours are the fires of deliverance which shall bring me bliss
Yours is the cruel sword which shall set my spirit free

Devourer of life and death who rule beyond time
In thy name I shall fulfil my destiny divine
Maha Kali, formless one, destroyer of illusion
Your songs forever sung, the tunes of dissolution

Kalika, black tongue of fire, embrace me
Make me one with your power for all eternity
Awaken within me the reflection of your flame
Kiss me with your bloody lips and drive me insane

Jai Kalika! Jai Kali!
Make me one with your power for all eternity
Maha Kali come to me

Smashana Kali, I burn myself for thee
I cut my own throat in obscene ecstasy
I make love to abominations, embrace pain and misery
Until my heart becomes the burning ground and Kali comes to me

O dark mother, hear me calling thee
Mahapralaya, bring to me
Through all illusions I shall see
I shall cremate this world and set my essence free

Jai Kalika! Jai Kali!
Without fear I will dance with death and misery
Maha Kali, come to me

"O Kali, thou art fond of cremation grounds
So I have turned my heart into one, that thou may dance there unceasingly
O mother, I have no other fond desire in my heart
Fire of a funeral pyre is burning there."

[Female voice:]
Jai Maha Kali, Jai Ma Kalika
Jai Maha Kali, Jai Ma Kalika
Kali Mata, namo nama
Kali Mata, namo nama

Jai Kalika! Jai Kali!
At your left hand for endless victory
Maha Kali, come to me

Jai Kalika! Jai Kali!
Mahapralaya will set our spirits free
Maha Kali, come to me"

 

[sun rise]

Some things(negative habits, trends, ideals, ways of life) will have to die, but there will be a great rebirth, I feel.

That's for sure.

 

[vulcanlogician]

To me, Kali is a visceral and tactile representation of the Divine Mother (or feminine aspect of God). Pretty much a heavy metal version of the Catholics' BVM in terms of a devotional object. (I think, despite Catholic doctrines to the contrary, I think the BVM is an expression of the Divine Mother.) But that's my airy-fairy non-Hindu interpretation of her as a symbol.

What do you want to know?

I want to hear more from devotees of Kali. Favorite mantras, etc. And where she fits in the cosmic landscape.

 

[Vinidra]

I wish I knew how to put my feelings about Shakti in general and Kali in particular into words.

 

[GoodAttention]

I wish I knew how to put my feelings about Shakti in general and Kali in particular into words.

Shakti is the liberation of the feminine energy, constrained by patriarchal expectations that a woman must have four qualities to be feminine.

1) Fearful and timid
2) Coy, bashful, or insecure
3) Simple minded
4) Modest and meek, or weak

Kali is the embodiment of a woman without fear or limitation, and in some ways is the first sathi/shakti.

In one tradition, she is Sati, the first daughter of the first man Kanappa and woman Aithamma. Sati desired to be with Shiva, as she did not want to be wed to any of her younger brothers. Her father refused to have Sati leave him and forbade it, causing Sati to immolate herself so she could return to Shiva even if not as his wife.

Sati's father called out to Shiva, saying he would pluck out one of his eye as a sacrifice if Shiva would return his daughter to him. Sati's mother intervened, asking Shiva to instead take any part of her to return her daughter, but to save all the parts that she needed to be a dutiful wife.

So Sati's mother sacrificed her body to have her daughter return as Kali, and as part of her sacrifice Shiva allowed Kali to give birth to three daughters, who we know as Durga, Luxsmi, and Sarasvathi. The navarathiri festival is a celebration of this. Sati's mother becomes the dutiful wife to Shiva, who is Parah Sathi or Shakthi. The importance of Kali is her desire to be one with Shiva was greater than her fear of death. Only once we overcome fear, can we start to gain determination, knowledge, and valour to act righteously.

Kali yuga is said to be the fourth and last time period, but in reality it is the one that gives birth to the first three.

 

[MelancholicPotatoChip]

Kali is a complex goddess.

Emanating from Durga's head during a battle, she is a destructive goddess. She rules over time and the cycles it brings with it. She is loving, but not the type to coddle.

She was Sri Ramakrishna's beloved Maa, showing herself physically to him when he threatened to do away with himself.

What do you know about Kali? What do you want to know?

View attachment 96518

When I saw the heading regarding Kali I first thought why is Kali linux being discussed in a religious forum. Btw, I am now wondering how that specific linux distro received its name. I am guessing via this goddess because Kali linux is a pentesting/hacking linux distro.

 

[GoodAttention]

To me, Kali is a visceral and tactile representation of the Divine Mother (or feminine aspect of God). Pretty much a heavy metal version of the Catholics' BVM in terms of a devotional object. (I think, despite Catholic doctrines to the contrary, I think the BVM is an expression of the Divine Mother.) But that's my airy-fairy non-Hindu interpretation of her as a symbol.



I want to hear more from devotees of Kali. Favorite mantras, etc. And where she fits in the cosmic landscape.

Here is the Kali influence on Rock n Roll!

 

[GoodAttention]

Shakti is the liberation of the feminine energy, constrained by patriarchal expectations that a woman must have four qualities to be feminine.

1) Fearful and timid
2) Coy, bashful, or insecure
3) Simple minded
4) Modest and meek, or weak

Kali is the embodiment of a woman without fear or limitation, and in some ways is the first sathi/shakti.

In one tradition, she is Sati, the first daughter of the first man Kanappa and woman Aithamma. Sati desired to be with Shiva, as she did not want to be wed to any of her younger brothers. Her father refused to have Sati leave him and forbade it, causing Sati to immolate herself so she could return to Shiva even if not as his wife.

Sati's father called out to Shiva, saying he would pluck out one of his eye as a sacrifice if Shiva would return his daughter to him. Sati's mother intervened, asking Shiva to instead take any part of her to return her daughter, but to save all the parts that she needed to be a dutiful wife.

So Sati's mother sacrificed her body to have her daughter return as Kali, and as part of her sacrifice Shiva allowed Kali to give birth to three daughters, who we know as Durga, Luxsmi, and Sarasvathi. The navarathiri festival is a celebration of this. Sati's mother becomes the dutiful wife to Shiva, who is Parah Sathi or Shakthi. The importance of Kali is her desire to be one with Shiva was greater than her fear of death. Only once we overcome fear, can we start to gain determination, knowledge, and valour to act righteously.

Kali yuga is said to be the fourth and last time period, but in reality it is the one that gives birth to the first three.

To make a hopefully interesting segue, this story of Kali (more specifically, this is a Genesis story with many meanings) is also the (I believe) inspiration for The Wonderful Wizard of Oz.

Here, the four qualities or characters as represented -

1) Fearful and timid - Dorothy
2) Coy, bashful, or insecure - Tin Man
3) Simple minded - Scarecrow
4) Modest and meek, or weak - Cowardly Lion

The Good Witches of the North and South are Shakthi/Aithamma, whilst the Wicked Witch of the West and her "telescopic eye" is Kanappa.

Personally, I love this story, and of course loved the movie even more. The fact that I live in a world where Judy Garland could be a representation of Kaliamma blows my mind.

This of course makes Lyman Frank Baum, the author, a very interesting person. Completely full of sarcasm, even at the risk of offence, he was nevertheless reaching for a "moment of truth", and trusted himself to seek it.

"It was pure inspiration. It came to me right out of the blue. I think that sometimes the Great Author had a message to get across and He was to use the instrument at hand".

L. Frank Baum - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[vulcanlogician]

Here is the Kali influence on Rock n Roll!

It there a reference to Kali in the Rolling Stones icon? Or is that just you connecting the dots?

 

[GoodAttention]

It there a reference to Kali in the Rolling Stones icon? Or is that just you connecting the dots?

Any interest I have to the Rolling Stones is from Mick Jagger.

Any interest I have in Mick Jagger is from Jerry Hall.

My interest in Jerry Hall is because she was the wife of my good friend Rupert Murdoch.