Life Without The Apple Incident

[Skwim]

What would our life be like today, 6,021 years since the creation of Adam & Eve, if they never "fell"?

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Overpopulation?
No wars?
No competitive spirit?
No hate?
No comparative love?
Nowhere to necessarily go on Sunday mornings?​

Your reckoning _____________________________________________________.

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[rosends]

Not an answer but a book recommendation -- Perelandra by C.S. Lewis.

 

[Jesster]

I prefer the golden apple incident from Greek mythology. It's a much better story.

 

[Skwim]

Not an answer but a book recommendation -- Perelandra by C.S. Lewis.

Read a synopsis, and what I gather is that "A&E" never reproduce (they're the only ones on the planet) and they have absolutely no ambition. "They live on the floating raft-islands [of vegetation] and are forbidden to sleep on the 'Fixed Land'."

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[Stevicus]

What would our life be like today, 6,021 years since the creation of Adam & Eve, if they never "fell"?

​

Overpopulation?
No wars?
No competitive spirit?
No hate?
No comparative love?
Nowhere to necessarily go on Sunday mornings?​

Your reckoning _____________________________________________________.

.

Well, there'd be no Apple Records. No Apple computers. No apple pie.

 

[Kenny]

Populating the galaxies.

 

[BSM1]

No catchy nick name for that protrudence in the male throat...

 

[Phantasman]

The tree of life/knowledge gave just that. I see it through the gospel/Spirit, not through the orthodox. Man gained his spirit (never given by the creator god). Without it, man would have just been another animal, naked, spiritless, a flesh and soul with no knowledge.

 

[Jesster]

The tree of life/knowledge gave just that. I see it through the gospel/Spirit, not through the orthodox. Man gained his spirit (never given by the creator god). Without it, man would have just been another animal, naked, spiritless, a flesh and soul with no knowledge.

Heh. When I was a Christian and made the same kind of statement as your last sentence during a bible study group, everyone sharply disagreed with me. It takes all sorts, I guess.

 

[Phantasman]

Heh. When I was a Christian and made the same kind of statement as your last sentence during a bible study group, everyone sharply disagreed with me. It takes all sorts, I guess.

I used to see it the orthodox way. But in study, the non Canon (non catholic) books inspired me to a different perception.

"And the archons took him and placed him in paradise. And they said to him, 'Eat, that is at leisure,' for their luxury is bitter and their beauty is depraved. And their luxury is deception and their trees are godlessness and their fruit is deadly poison and their promise is death. And the tree of their life they had placed in the midst of paradise.

"And I shall teach you (pl.) what is the mystery of their life, which is the plan which they made together, which is the likeness of their spirit. The root of this (tree) is bitter and its branches are death, its shadow is hate and deception is in its leaves, and its blossom is the ointment of evil, and its fruit is death and desire is its seed, and it sprouts in darkness. The dwelling place of those who taste from it is Hades, and the darkness is their place of rest.

"But what they call the tree of knowledge of good and evil, which is the Epinoia of the light, they stayed in front of it in order that he (Adam) might not look up to his fullness and recognize the nakedness of his shamefulness. But it was I who brought about that they ate."

And to I said to the savior, "Lord, was it not the serpent that taught Adam to eat?" The savior smiled and said, "The serpent taught them to eat from wickedness of begetting, lust, (and) destruction, that he (Adam) might be useful to him. And he (Adam) knew that he was disobedient to him (the chief archon) due to light of the Epinoia which is in him, which made him more correct in his thinking than the chief archon. And (the latter) wanted to bring about the power which he himself had given him. And he brought a forgetfulness over Adam."- Secret John

Jesus saying these words to John lines more with the Gospel message than the OT.

John 6:
Therefore Jesus saith to them, Truly, truly, I say to you, Moses gave you not bread from heaven, but my Father giveth you very bread from heaven;

If Jesus says one thing and Moses gave another, I know who I believe.

Without Eve bringing sin on the world, patriarchy wouldn't have a leg to stand on.

Jesus never taught patriarchy, IMO.

 

[sun rise]

Funny, when I read the thread title my first thought was that it was relating to the latest Apple FUBAR about slowing down phones with slightly older batteries. Then I saw who opened the thread and knew I had, as they say, barked up the wrong tree.

Since the knowledge of "good and evil" is dependent on a certain level of intellectual functioning, the answer is that we'd still be lower animals acting out of instinct.

 

[David T]

Populating the galaxies.

Are you kidding watch the Dr who documentary.. Heck I just watched the guardian of the galaxy 2. And and and the classic galaxy quest. In fact that happened at a comic con event even!!!

 

[David T]

Heh. When I was a Christian and made the same kind of statement as your last sentence during a bible study group, everyone sharply disagreed with me. It takes all sorts, I guess.

NO YOU DIDN'T DID YOU??!!. It's like if you go to a Tolkien gathering dressed like a star trek character, that just is totally inappropriate. How dare you totally different genre.

 

[Skwim]

The tree of life/knowledge gave just that. I see it through the gospel/Spirit, not through the orthodox. Man gained his spirit (never given by the creator god). Without it, man would have just been another animal, naked, spiritless, a flesh and soul with no knowledge.

Since the knowledge of "good and evil" is dependent on a certain level of intellectual functioning, the answer is that we'd still be lower animals acting out of instinct.

I assume then that both of you feel the fall has been good for mankind. Let's hear it for disobedience to god!

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[9-10ths_Penguin]

What would our life be like today, 6,021 years since the creation of Adam & Eve, if they never "fell"?

​

Overpopulation?
No wars?
No competitive spirit?
No hate?
No comparative love?
Nowhere to necessarily go on Sunday mornings?​

Your reckoning _____________________________________________________.

.

No Jesus.

No “Second Adam” without a first Adam.

 

[Grandliseur]

What would our life be like today, 6,021 years since the creation of Adam & Eve, if they never "fell"?

​

Overpopulation?
No wars?
No competitive spirit?
No hate?
No comparative love?
Nowhere to necessarily go on Sunday mornings?​

Your reckoning _____________________________________________________.

.

While the fruit is unknown, not an apple, the serpent in your picture is cute, not quite the diabolical devil we know.
Sin would still have happened, someone would have sinned; however, it wouldn't have caused the huge problem it did. Murphy must be old by now.

 

[Terese]

Tolkein's elves, or Eldar, are supposed to be what man would have been like if Adam and Eve never sinned in the Garden of Eden. Violence, anger, and jealousy still do exist within the Eldar, but most live in an eden-like harmony with each other, and do not age nor succumb to illness. In fact, The Vanyar, a species of Eldar, live on Valinor, a perfect place free of death which is where all the Valar, akin to angels, reside. All Eldar can go back to Valinor, and eventually, they will.

I love the Silmarillion

 

[Skwim]

While the fruit is unknown, not an apple, the serpent in your picture is cute, not quite the diabolical devil we know.

Interesting that while you say the fruit is unknown you can confidently say it wasn't an apple.

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[Grandliseur]

Interesting that while you say the fruit is unknown you can confidently say it wasn't an apple.

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Well, I agree that I could be wrong, but, here is the argument for that:

There was one tree of life and one of knowledge of good and bad in the whole garden. They were expelled from the garden after having eaten of the latter tree's fruit so that they would not be able to touch the first one's. This somewhat to me tells me that neither fruit were found outside the garden, that those two kinds of fruit were one of an item things each.

Outside the garden, they had access to what was common around the globe. While it cannot be stated with any certainty or authority at all, it is my opinion that the garden of Eden was located around where we have the Congo (Zaire), in the east part. I don't think apples are very common there.

So, you are welcome to tell me what you think, but saying 'apple' pins it down, which I think I cannot do, but I have been wrong before! ​

 

[Skwim]

Well, I agree that I could be wrong, but, here is the argument for that:

There was one tree of life and one of knowledge of good and bad in the whole garden. They were expelled from the garden after having eaten of the latter tree's fruit so that they would not be able to touch the first one's. This somewhat to me tells me that neither fruit were found outside the garden, that those two kinds of fruit were one of an item things each.

Outside the garden, they had access to what was common around the globe. While it cannot be stated with any certainty or authority at all, it is my opinion that the garden of Eden was located around where we have the Congo (Zaire), in the east part. I don't think apples are very common there.

So, you are welcome to tell me what you think, but saying 'apple' pins it down, which I think I cannot do, but I have been wrong before! ​

The most commonly agreed upon location of Eden was at the confluence of the Tigris and Euphrates rivers, now known as Mesopotamia.

In Mesopotamia the Mesopotamians had grown many crops and used them in their daily life everyday. Major crops were barley,dates, wheat, lentils, peas, beans, olives, pomegranates, grapes, vegetables, and pistachio nuts. In Mesopotamia normally people ate only two meals a day, except for the rich, most people drank large amounts of beer up to a gallon a day and unleavened bread. Since meat was so pricey, most people ate cooked vegetable stews. They grew many fruits, apples, pears, grapes, figs, quinces, plums, apricots, mulberries, melons, and pomegranates.
source

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