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Living in Heaven or on Earth. Does the Bible give us that option? [For Jehovah's Witnesses]

RR144

Bible Student
All of the wonderful Jehovah’s Witnesses that have come to my door have expressed no desire for a heavenly hope. Their desire is to be on Paradise Earth forever. And what could be wrong with good food, a nice house, domesticated wild animals and beautiful scenery?

The problem is the difficulty in making a scriptural case for an earthly hope. Yes, the Bible clearly teaches about the earthly kingdom, but for the Christian, the Bible only speaks of a heavenly hope as in the following scriptures: (Note: All scriptures are from the New World Translation of the Holy Scriptures).

Philippians 3:20 - “But our citizenship exists in the heavens, and we are eagerly waiting for a savior from there, the Lord Jesus Christ.”​
Colossians 1:5 - “the hope that is being reserved for YOU in the heavens.​
Hebrews 3:1 - “Consequently, holy brothers, partakers of the heavenly calling, consider the apostle and high priest whom we confess-Jesus.”​
Matthew 5:12 - “Rejoice and leap for joy, since YOUR reward is great in the heavens; for in that way they persecuted the prophets prior to YOU.”​
Luke 6:22-23 - “Happy are you whenever men hate you, and when they exclude you and reproach you and denounce your name as wicked for the sake of the Son of man. Rejoice in that day and leap for joy, for look! your reward is great in heaven, for those are the same things their forefathers used to do to the prophets.”​
2 Corinthians 5:1-2 - “For we know that if our earthly house, this tent, should be dissolved, we are to have a building from God, a house not made with hands, everlasting in the heavens. For in this dwelling house we do indeed groan, earnestly desiring to put on the one for us from heaven,”​
Hebrews 6:19-20 - “We have this hope as an anchor for the soul, both sure and firm, and it enters in within the curtain, where a forerunner has entered in our behalf, Jesus, who has become a high priest in the manner of Melchizedek forever.”​
1 Corinthians 15:42-45 - “So it is with the resurrection of the dead. It is sown in corruption; it is raised up in incorruption. It is sown in dishonor; it is raised up in glory. It is sown in weakness; it is raised up in power. It is sown a physical body; it is raised up a spiritual body. If there is a physical body, there is also a spiritual one. So it is written: “The first man Adam became a living person.”​
1 Corinthians 15:49 - “And just as we have borne the image of the one made of dust, we will bear also the image of the heavenly one."​
John 14:2-3 - "In the house of my Father are many dwelling places. Otherwise, I would have told you, for I am going my way to prepare a place for you. Also, if I go my way and prepare a place for you, I will come again and will receive you home to myself, so that where I am you also may be."​
1 John 3:2 - “Beloved ones, we are now children of God, but it has not yet been made manifest what we will be. We do know that when he is made manifest we will be like him, because we will see him just as he is.”​
Philippians 3:14 - “I am pressing on toward the goal for the prize of the upward call of God by means of Christ Jesus.”​

The Upward Call is to HEAVEN. Compare Colossians 3:1 "If, however, you were raised up with the Christ, go on seeking the things above, <Strong's #507> where the Christ is seated at the right hand of God." Now compare: John 8:23 “He went on to say to them: “You are from the realms below; I am from the realms above. <Strong's #507> You are from this world; I am not from this world.”

Daniel 12:3 - “And those having insight will shine as brightly as the expanse of heaven, and those bringing the many to righteousness like the stars, forever and ever.”​

None of these scriptures indicate any other hope for the Christian than the heavenly hope. As a matter of fact, Eph 4:4 says, “One body there is, and one spirit, even as YOU were called in the one hope to which YOU were called” (Eph 4:4). So, for the Christian there is only one hope; the heavenly hope. Throughout the book of Acts, whenever anyone is baptized, nobody is ever given the option of whether they want to choose an earthly or a heavenly reward.

Even the Great Crowd are said to be in Heaven in Rev 19:1 which says: “After these things I heard what was as a loud voice of a great crowd in heaven.” The Greek words translated great crowd is exactly the same as in Rev 7:9.
 

2ndpillar

Well-Known Member
All of the wonderful Jehovah’s Witnesses that have come to my door have expressed no desire for a heavenly hope. Their desire is to be on Paradise Earth forever. And what could be wrong with good food, a nice house, domesticated wild animals and beautiful scenery?

The problem is the difficulty in making a scriptural case for an earthly hope. Yes, the Bible clearly teaches about the earthly kingdom, but for the Christian, the Bible only speaks of a heavenly hope as in the following scriptures: (Note: All scriptures are from the New World Translation of the Holy Scriptures).

Philippians 3:20 - “But our citizenship exists in the heavens, and we are eagerly waiting for a savior from there, the Lord Jesus Christ.”​
Colossians 1:5 - “the hope that is being reserved for YOU in the heavens.​
Hebrews 3:1 - “Consequently, holy brothers, partakers of the heavenly calling, consider the apostle and high priest whom we confess-Jesus.”​
Matthew 5:12 - “Rejoice and leap for joy, since YOUR reward is great in the heavens; for in that way they persecuted the prophets prior to YOU.”​
Luke 6:22-23 - “Happy are you whenever men hate you, and when they exclude you and reproach you and denounce your name as wicked for the sake of the Son of man. Rejoice in that day and leap for joy, for look! your reward is great in heaven, for those are the same things their forefathers used to do to the prophets.”​
2 Corinthians 5:1-2 - “For we know that if our earthly house, this tent, should be dissolved, we are to have a building from God, a house not made with hands, everlasting in the heavens. For in this dwelling house we do indeed groan, earnestly desiring to put on the one for us from heaven,”​
Hebrews 6:19-20 - “We have this hope as an anchor for the soul, both sure and firm, and it enters in within the curtain, where a forerunner has entered in our behalf, Jesus, who has become a high priest in the manner of Melchizedek forever.”​
1 Corinthians 15:42-45 - “So it is with the resurrection of the dead. It is sown in corruption; it is raised up in incorruption. It is sown in dishonor; it is raised up in glory. It is sown in weakness; it is raised up in power. It is sown a physical body; it is raised up a spiritual body. If there is a physical body, there is also a spiritual one. So it is written: “The first man Adam became a living person.”​
1 Corinthians 15:49 - “And just as we have borne the image of the one made of dust, we will bear also the image of the heavenly one."​
John 14:2-3 - "In the house of my Father are many dwelling places. Otherwise, I would have told you, for I am going my way to prepare a place for you. Also, if I go my way and prepare a place for you, I will come again and will receive you home to myself, so that where I am you also may be."​
1 John 3:2 - “Beloved ones, we are now children of God, but it has not yet been made manifest what we will be. We do know that when he is made manifest we will be like him, because we will see him just as he is.”​
Philippians 3:14 - “I am pressing on toward the goal for the prize of the upward call of God by means of Christ Jesus.”​

The Upward Call is to HEAVEN. Compare Colossians 3:1 "If, however, you were raised up with the Christ, go on seeking the things above, <Strong's #507> where the Christ is seated at the right hand of God." Now compare: John 8:23 “He went on to say to them: “You are from the realms below; I am from the realms above. <Strong's #507> You are from this world; I am not from this world.”

Daniel 12:3 - “And those having insight will shine as brightly as the expanse of heaven, and those bringing the many to righteousness like the stars, forever and ever.”​

None of these scriptures indicate any other hope for the Christian than the heavenly hope. As a matter of fact, Eph 4:4 says, “One body there is, and one spirit, even as YOU were called in the one hope to which YOU were called” (Eph 4:4). So, for the Christian there is only one hope; the heavenly hope. Throughout the book of Acts, whenever anyone is baptized, nobody is ever given the option of whether they want to choose an earthly or a heavenly reward.

Even the Great Crowd are said to be in Heaven in Rev 19:1 which says: “After these things I heard what was as a loud voice of a great crowd in heaven.” The Greek words translated great crowd is exactly the same as in Rev 7:9.
You seem to be heavy on the rants of the false prophet Paul. As for Rev 19:1, that is with respect to the "angels" in heaven. As for Mt 5:19, apart from some modern Weymouth bible, that is not what is stated. As for the "kingdom", that will be ruled from Jerusalem (Zech 14:16), and as for Jerusalem, it will be "coming down from heaven" (Rev 21:2). As for who will rule, that would be the sole shepherd, and prince, and that would be Daivd per Ezekiel 34 after judgment of the sheep. As for who will be king, and rule from the land given to Jacob/Israel, that would be David (Ezekiel 37:24-25). As for who will be "destroyed", well, that would be the nations/Gentiles (Jeremiah 30:11). As for who will be judged at the "day of the LORD", that would be the nations/Gentiles (Joel 2:31-3-8). As for Yeshua's prayer, they kingdom come, that would be for the kingdom to be set up for 1000 years, ruled from Jerusalem, in collaboration with those who rise from the dead, who do not have the mark of the beast, and those who had been beheaded because of the Word of God. (Rev 20:4) As for Daniel 2:45, after the nations/Gentiles have been crushed, a new kingdom will be set up which will endure forever. As stated in Joel 3:18, that kingdom will be one on earth.
 
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2ndpillar

Well-Known Member
So Paul is a "false prophet"? Maybe we should tear all his letters out of the BIble.
According to most scholars, half of Paul's letters are supposedly from another person besides Paul. As for Hebrews, well, enough said, your scholars don't know who wrote that, but since it doesn't start with building up of Paul, I kind of think it is not Paul. As for Luke, that is a bunch of articles written by some guy Luke, with no reference to who in particular these sources were. As for Paul himself, he would represent the leaven of the Pharisees (hypocrisy) so much maligned by Yeshua. Paul is also the conduit of the "message" of the "devil"/"enemy", the message of "lawlessness" as pointed out in Matthew 13:24-49. Paul would be the main "false prophet" in demon form, per Revelation 16:13, and among the "false prophets" of Matthew 7:15, who led the "many" down the wide path to "destruction". As for taking them (tares) out, well, that is reserved for the "end of the age" (Mt 13:27-29). The "message" of the "devil", Paul's false gospel of grace, the message of lawlessness, would be the "tare seed", planted by the "devil"/"serpent", where as you surely shall not die (Gensis 3:4). Oh wait, we are now at the "end of the age". Judah and Jerusalem are now being "revived" (Joel 3:1), and the "nations"/Gentiles are coming against Jerusalem (Zechariah 14:1-2), and Har-Magedon, "day of the LORD", is at the door. You are free to push your false prophets, but remember that the "false prophet" has a room reserved in the "lake of fire" (Rev 20:10). As for the "bible" (NT), that would be the "field" in which the "message" of the "devil" and the "son of man" are planted next to each other (Mt 13:25).
 

Elihoenai

Well-Known Member
All of the wonderful Jehovah’s Witnesses that have come to my door have expressed no desire for a heavenly hope. Their desire is to be on Paradise Earth forever. And what could be wrong with good food, a nice house, domesticated wild animals and beautiful scenery?

The problem is the difficulty in making a scriptural case for an earthly hope. Yes, the Bible clearly teaches about the earthly kingdom, but for the Christian, the Bible only speaks of a heavenly hope as in the following scriptures: (Note: All scriptures are from the New World Translation of the Holy Scriptures).

Philippians 3:20 - “But our citizenship exists in the heavens, and we are eagerly waiting for a savior from there, the Lord Jesus Christ.”​
Colossians 1:5 - “the hope that is being reserved for YOU in the heavens.​
Hebrews 3:1 - “Consequently, holy brothers, partakers of the heavenly calling, consider the apostle and high priest whom we confess-Jesus.”​
Matthew 5:12 - “Rejoice and leap for joy, since YOUR reward is great in the heavens; for in that way they persecuted the prophets prior to YOU.”​
Luke 6:22-23 - “Happy are you whenever men hate you, and when they exclude you and reproach you and denounce your name as wicked for the sake of the Son of man. Rejoice in that day and leap for joy, for look! your reward is great in heaven, for those are the same things their forefathers used to do to the prophets.”​
2 Corinthians 5:1-2 - “For we know that if our earthly house, this tent, should be dissolved, we are to have a building from God, a house not made with hands, everlasting in the heavens. For in this dwelling house we do indeed groan, earnestly desiring to put on the one for us from heaven,”​
Hebrews 6:19-20 - “We have this hope as an anchor for the soul, both sure and firm, and it enters in within the curtain, where a forerunner has entered in our behalf, Jesus, who has become a high priest in the manner of Melchizedek forever.”​
1 Corinthians 15:42-45 - “So it is with the resurrection of the dead. It is sown in corruption; it is raised up in incorruption. It is sown in dishonor; it is raised up in glory. It is sown in weakness; it is raised up in power. It is sown a physical body; it is raised up a spiritual body. If there is a physical body, there is also a spiritual one. So it is written: “The first man Adam became a living person.”​
1 Corinthians 15:49 - “And just as we have borne the image of the one made of dust, we will bear also the image of the heavenly one."​
John 14:2-3 - "In the house of my Father are many dwelling places. Otherwise, I would have told you, for I am going my way to prepare a place for you. Also, if I go my way and prepare a place for you, I will come again and will receive you home to myself, so that where I am you also may be."​
1 John 3:2 - “Beloved ones, we are now children of God, but it has not yet been made manifest what we will be. We do know that when he is made manifest we will be like him, because we will see him just as he is.”​
Philippians 3:14 - “I am pressing on toward the goal for the prize of the upward call of God by means of Christ Jesus.”​

The Upward Call is to HEAVEN. Compare Colossians 3:1 "If, however, you were raised up with the Christ, go on seeking the things above, <Strong's #507> where the Christ is seated at the right hand of God." Now compare: John 8:23 “He went on to say to them: “You are from the realms below; I am from the realms above. <Strong's #507> You are from this world; I am not from this world.”

Daniel 12:3 - “And those having insight will shine as brightly as the expanse of heaven, and those bringing the many to righteousness like the stars, forever and ever.”​

None of these scriptures indicate any other hope for the Christian than the heavenly hope. As a matter of fact, Eph 4:4 says, “One body there is, and one spirit, even as YOU were called in the one hope to which YOU were called” (Eph 4:4). So, for the Christian there is only one hope; the heavenly hope. Throughout the book of Acts, whenever anyone is baptized, nobody is ever given the option of whether they want to choose an earthly or a heavenly reward.

Even the Great Crowd are said to be in Heaven in Rev 19:1 which says: “After these things I heard what was as a loud voice of a great crowd in heaven.” The Greek words translated great crowd is exactly the same as in Rev 7:9.
Revelation 12:12

12 Therefore rejoice, ye heavens, and ye that dwell in them. Woe to the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea! for the devil is come down unto you, having great wrath, because he knoweth that he hath but a short time.



I Am Christian Gnostic.

The so-called Carnal Christian Desires and Cherishes an Earthly Paradise. The Real Christians Journey is Citizenship in Heaven. The Journey of the Real Christian is Rejected by almost every person on the planet because it is "The Hardest Road Less Travelled".
 

2ndpillar

Well-Known Member
Revelation 12:12

12 Therefore rejoice, ye heavens, and ye that dwell in them. Woe to the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea! for the devil is come down unto you, having great wrath, because he knoweth that he hath but a short time.
Revelation 12:12 refers to the angels in heaven (Rev 12:7), who are waging war in heaven. The "dragon" who was thrown down went to make war with the saints who keep the commandments of God (Rev 12:17). The warriors of the "dragon" support the dragon's lawless claims and will wind up drinking from the cup of God's anger (Rev 14:10). Just saying.
 

1213

Well-Known Member
All of the wonderful Jehovah’s Witnesses that have come to my door have expressed no desire for a heavenly hope. Their desire is to be on Paradise Earth forever. ...
What do you say about these:

And I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth passed away, and the sea no longer is. And I, John, saw the holy city, New Jerusalem, coming down out of Heaven from God, having been prepared as a bride, having been adorned for her Husband. And I heard a great voice out of Heaven, saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God with men! And He will tabernacle with them, and they will be His people, and God Himself will be with them as their God. And God will wipe away every tear from their eyes. And death shall be no longer, nor mourning, nor outcry, nor pain will be any longer; for the first things passed away. And the One sitting on the throne said, Behold, I make all things new. And He says to me, Write, because these words are faithful and true.
Rev. 21:1-5

"Behold, the days come," says Yahweh, "That the plowman shall overtake the reaper, And the one treading grapes him who sows seed; And sweet wine will drip from the mountains, And flow from the hills. I will bring back the captivity of my people Israel, And they will rebuild the ruined cities, and inhabit them; and they will plant vineyards, and drink wine from them. They shall also make gardens, And eat the fruit of them. I will plant them on their land, And they will no more be plucked up out of their land which I have given them," says Yahweh your God.
Amos 9:13-15
 

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
I Am Christian Gnostic.

The so-called Carnal Christian Desires and Cherishes an Earthly Paradise. The Real Christians Journey is Citizenship in Heaven. The Journey of the Real Christian is Rejected by almost every person on the planet because it is "The Hardest Road Less Travelled".
How many Christians do you think pay any attention to the following verses? I am the only person who ever posts them, and I am not even a Christian!

John 12:24-26 Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except a corn of wheat fall into the ground and die, it abideth alone: but if it die, it bringeth forth much fruit. He that loveth his life shall lose it; and he that hateth his life in this world shall keep it unto life eternal. If any man serve me, let him follow me; and where I am, there shall also my servant be: if any man serve me, him will my Father honour.
 

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
What do you say about these:

And I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth passed away, and the sea no longer is. And I, John, saw the holy city, New Jerusalem, coming down out of Heaven from God, having been prepared as a bride, having been adorned for her Husband. And I heard a great voice out of Heaven, saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God with men! And He will tabernacle with them, and they will be His people, and God Himself will be with them as their God. And God will wipe away every tear from their eyes. And death shall be no longer, nor mourning, nor outcry, nor pain will be any longer; for the first things passed away. And the One sitting on the throne said, Behold, I make all things new. And He says to me, Write, because these words are faithful and true.
Rev. 21:1-5

"Behold, the days come," says Yahweh, "That the plowman shall overtake the reaper, And the one treading grapes him who sows seed; And sweet wine will drip from the mountains, And flow from the hills. I will bring back the captivity of my people Israel, And they will rebuild the ruined cities, and inhabit them; and they will plant vineyards, and drink wine from them. They shall also make gardens, And eat the fruit of them. I will plant them on their land, And they will no more be plucked up out of their land which I have given them," says Yahweh your God.
Amos 9:13-15
I believe that there will eventually be a Paradise on earth, and that is what those New Jerusalem verses and other verses about the new earth are about.

Where I believe the JWs go off track is that they believe that will be raised from their graves after they die to live on this new earth forever.
I believe that the new earth will be for people who are LIVING when after the new earth is built by humans, and for future generations of LIVING people.

People who die will be resurrected in a spiritual body and go to live in heaven forever. That was the promise of Jesus.

Ecclesiastes 12:7 Then shall the dust return to the earth as it was: and the spirit shall return unto God who gave it.
 

2ndpillar

Well-Known Member
How many Christians do you think pay any attention to the following verses? I am the only person who ever posts them, and I am not even a Christian!

John 12:24-26 Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except a corn of wheat fall into the ground and die, it abideth alone: but if it die, it bringeth forth much fruit. He that loveth his life shall lose it; and he that hateth his life in this world shall keep it unto life eternal. If any man serve me, let him follow me; and where I am, there shall also my servant be: if any man serve me, him will my Father honour.
You are referring to being born again, which also with respect to 1 John 3:9,"No one who is born of God practices sin, because His seed abides in him; and he cannot sin, because he is born of God." The "seed" being the good seed, the "message" of the "son of man" (Mt 13:24-49). And of course, the bad seed, the "tare" seed, being the "message" of the "devil", which is the message of lawlessness, the false gospel of grace, and of course the other messages of the other false prophets. The "tares" the product of the tare seed, will be coming to an ending (Mt 13:30).
 

2ndpillar

Well-Known Member
I believe that there will eventually be a Paradise on earth, and that is what those New Jerusalem verses and other verses about the new earth are about.

Where I believe the JWs go off track is that they believe that will be raised from their graves after they die to live on this new earth forever.
I believe that the new earth will be for people who are LIVING when after the new earth is built by humans, and for future generations of LIVING people.

People who die will be resurrected in a spiritual body and go to live in heaven forever. That was the promise of Jesus.

Ecclesiastes 12:7 Then shall the dust return to the earth as it was: and the spirit shall return unto God who gave it.
The people who are resurrected, are those who have had their heads cut off because they held onto the Word of God and did not receive the mark of the beast (Rev 20:4). They will be resurrected for 1000 years until the white throne judgment, whereupon everyone will rise from their graves and be judged (Rev 20:12-13). As for the new Jerusalem, not everyone will get into the gates (Rev 22:14-15). As for the "nations"/Gentiles who survive the "day of the LORD"/Har-Magedon, well they will live until they are at least 100 years of age, unless they are accursed (Isaiah 65.20).
 

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
1 John 3:9,"No one who is born of God practices sin, because His seed abides in him; and he cannot sin, because he is born of God."
Then I guess there are not very many Born Again Christians because every man I know who calls themself a Christian is looking to have sex out of wedlock. I know that because I am a member of two dating sites. I cannot find a man because I won't have sex out of wedlock.
 

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
All of the wonderful Jehovah’s Witnesses that have come to my door have expressed no desire for a heavenly hope. Their desire is to be on Paradise Earth forever.
In my opinion, the desire to live on a paradisaical earth forever is childlike thinking. The state of the earth is not going 'back to Eden.'
Earth will never be a paradise because of all the physical requirements we have to endure on earth simply to exist. That is why God made heaven.
There is nothing physical in heaven so there will be no physical requirements and no accidents, injuries or diseases.
And what could be wrong with good food, a nice house, domesticated wild animals and beautiful scenery?
Jesus offered eternal life, and given we are going to exist forever, that would get boring after a while, even if it was possible.
And what about new people being born? If everyone was raised to live on earth forever how could the earth ever sustain such a population?
Then of course humans would still have the physical requirements and problems they have now.
The problem is the difficulty in making a scriptural case for an earthly hope. Yes, the Bible clearly teaches about the earthly kingdom, but for the Christian, the Bible only speaks of a heavenly hope as in the following scriptures:
There is no scriptural case for being raised to live on earth forever. Such a belief requires twisting the meaning of a great many verses.
 

2ndpillar

Well-Known Member
Then I guess there are not very many Born Again Christians because every man I know who calls themself a Christian is looking to have sex out of wedlock. I know that because I am a member of two dating sites. I cannot find a man because I won't have sex out of wedlock.
Sin is transgression of the law. Your Pauline "Christian" is under the impression that the law is nailed to a cross. The Law of God precludes adultery (7 Commandment). Yeshua precludes looking at a woman with lust (Mt 5:27). To enter into the kingdom, one must surpass the righteousness of the Pharisees (Mt 5:20). "Christians", per Hebrews 8:13, feel that the law has been made "obsolete". (Hebrews 8:13) "He has made the first obsolete". Most people are like the guy who "hears the word" and "receives it with joy", and "has no firm root" and "immediately falls away" (Mt 13:20-21). On the other hand, the "many" hear the "message"(tare seed) of the "enemy"/"devil", by way of false prophets (Mt 7:15), and take root, and as tares, produce no fruit (Mt 13:24-30), and will be gathered at the end of the age and thrown into the fire (Mt 13:30).

Matthew 5:27-28

“You have heard that it was said, ‘You shall not commit adultery.’ But I say to you that everyone who looks at a woman with lustful intent has already committed adultery with her in his heart.
 

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
Matthew 5:27-28
“You have heard that it was said, ‘You shall not commit adultery.’ But I say to you that everyone who looks at a woman with lustful intent has already committed adultery with her in his heart.
From what I remember Jesus considered adultery to include having sex out of wedlock which most unmarried Christians do. :oops:
 

2ndpillar

Well-Known Member
From what I remember Jesus considered adultery to include having sex out of wedlock which most unmarried Christians do. :oops:
Adultery is to sleep with your neighbor's wife. Now with respect to the message of Paul, he gives a list of things, which I think might include fornication (immorality) and with respect to inheriting the kingdom of God. Yeshua lists "fornications" alongside sins with respect to "evil thoughts". Fornication (Immorality) will get one into real trouble, and block one from entering the kingdom of heaven, but as for it being a transgression of the law, you will have to give a chapter and verse. As for "married Christians", well they can apparently get married and unmarried at will. Back in the day, one paid money to the Roman church, and they simply annulled the marriage. Today, gays can marry. Don't put too much emphasis on being legally married, although the original concept is proper (Genesis 2:24), it is rarely the case.

Genesis 2:24 For this reason a man shall leave his father and his mother, and be joined to his wife; and they shall become one flesh.

1 Corinthians 6:18
Flee immorality. Every other sin that a man commits is outside the body, but the immoral man sins against his own body.

1 Corinthians 6:9
Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals,

Matthew 15:19
0For out of the heart come evil thoughts, murders, adulteries, fornications, thefts, false witness, slanders.
 

Elihoenai

Well-Known Member
How many Christians do you think pay any attention to the following verses? I am the only person who ever posts them, and I am not even a Christian!

John 12:24-26 Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except a corn of wheat fall into the ground and die, it abideth alone: but if it die, it bringeth forth much fruit. He that loveth his life shall lose it; and he that hateth his life in this world shall keep it unto life eternal. If any man serve me, let him follow me; and where I am, there shall also my servant be: if any man serve me, him will my Father honour.
I have posted John 12:25. More than posting, I practice what I post and write.
 

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
Ok, please give the scripture also, not that I don't believe, but I would like to see where is that said.
1 Corinthians 15
New Living Translation

35 But someone may ask, “How will the dead be raised? What kind of bodies will they have?”

40 There are also bodies in the heavens and bodies on the earth. The glory of the heavenly bodies is different from the glory of the earthly bodies. 41 The sun has one kind of glory, while the moon and stars each have another kind. And even the stars differ from each other in their glory.

42 It is the same way with the resurrection of the dead. Our earthly bodies are planted in the ground when we die, but they will be raised to live forever. 43 Our bodies are buried in brokenness, but they will be raised in glory. They are buried in weakness, but they will be raised in strength. 44 They are buried as natural human bodies, but they will be raised as spiritual bodies. For just as there are natural bodies, there are also spiritual bodies.

50 What I am saying, dear brothers and sisters, is that our physical bodies cannot inherit the Kingdom of God. These dying bodies cannot inherit what will last forever.

51 But let me reveal to you a wonderful secret. We will not all die, but we will all be transformed!

~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Heaven is what will last forever so that is where we will reside forever in a spiritual body.

The promise of Jesus is that we will have eternal life.

John 3:16: For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life.​
1 John 5:13 I write these things to you who believe in the name of the Son of God that you may know that you have eternal life.​
John 11:25-26 Jesus said to her, “I am the resurrection and the life. He who believes in Me, though he may die, he shall live. And whoever lives and believes in Me shall never die. Do you believe this?”​

We will not have eternal life on earth because nobody can live forever in a physical body on earth.
 

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
Adultery is to sleep with your neighbor's wife. Now with respect to the message of Paul, he gives a list of things, which I think might include fornication (immorality) and with respect to inheriting the kingdom of God.
What does Jesus say about premarital sex?

The Bible clearly and explicitly says that premarital sex is wrong. The Bible just as clearly, if more implicitly, teaches that premarital sex is personally selfish and publicly subversive of the goods that marriage is meant to promote and protect. Oct 18, 2023

Is It Wrong to Have Sex Before Marriage? | Clearly Reformed



Fornication includes sex out of wedlock. Both adultery and fornication are prohibited in the Bible.

What is the difference between adultery and fornication?

In legal use there is a difference between adultery and fornication. Adultery is only used when at least one of the parties involved (either male or female) is married, whereas fornication may be used to describe two people who are unmarried (to each other or anyone else) engaging in consensual sexual intercourse.

Fornication Definition & Meaning - Merriam-Webster


 
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