Misconceptions/questions about Unitarian Universalism

[Green Gaia]

Ok, I know Lilithu had started several threads in other religion forum asking for what people thought were misconceptions about their religion.

I thought it would be cool to do something similar for UU since I've encountered many people on this forum, and in general, who've never heard of UUism before and if they have they don't know much or anything about it.

So, first what do we UUs think are some common misconceptions about our faith? And how can we work to dispell those misunderstandings?

Secondly, I'd like to invite anyone who has a question about UUism to ask it here and we will try to answer it for you.

 

[Green Gaia]

I can think of a couple misconceptions people have about us:

1)Some people assume we are just another Christian denomination. While historically this may be true, it is not today. We value our Christian teachings, but we realize as a movement that we are set apart from them as well.

2)Some think we are just a new age religion, completely unconnected to a larger faith tradition such as Christianity. Yes, our name "Unitarian Universalist" may be relatively new, but the ideas and concepts behind the movement have a long history within the JudeoChristian tradition. We have come to embrace and celebrate all the world's faith traditions, but that doesn't mean we've forgotten where we historically came from.

 

[Green Gaia]

Here's another one:

Misconception about UUs: That we're all liberals. Well, we are all religious liberals and many of us are social and politicial liberals as well, but not everyone. There are political (usually more economic than social) conservatives in our ranks as well. I think UUs forget this as much as anyone else sometimes.

 

[Davidium]

I think my largest mis-conception prior to becoming a UU... and even the first year or so after I became one, was not realizing that there is a completely independent UU Theology separate from the different faith traditions we find at our base...

I have spent the last few years exploring that UU specific theology...

Now, of course, not every UU would agree with me that there is a separate UU Theology... because that is one of the big debates in UU at the moment...

Yours in Faith,

David

 

[jonny]

I'll be honest - I never knew that Unitarian Universalism existed until I moved to Utah and you sued the LDS church (don't worry, no hard feelings - we won ). I thought it was interesting that the congregation decided to do this by voting. Is this common? (the voting)

Also, since I grew up in Washington, I was wondering if UU is more common in certain areas of the country than others? I can't believe I went 25 years without even hearing the name of Unitarian Universalism. How long has it been around?

I must add that what I have learned since coming to Religious Forums has been very good. I don't know that I really have any misconceptions because the UUs here are my only source of information on the religion.

 

[Green Gaia]

I'll be honest - I never knew that Unitarian Universalism existed until I moved to Utah and you sued the LDS church (don't worry, no hard feelings - we won ). I thought it was interesting that the congregation decided to do this by voting. Is this common? (the voting)

Yes, most everything is decided by the congregation and/or committees. If you are a member of the congregation you can vote and be on committees that decide church policy and actions and just about everything else. David or Lilithu can probably explain better than I about this. But that's basically the way things are done.

Also, since I grew up in Washington, I was wondering if UU is more common in certain areas of the country than others? I can't believe I went 25 years without even hearing the name of Unitarian Universalism. How long has it been around?

Well, the name Unitarian Universalism has been around since 1961 when the Unitarians and Universalists decided they had more in common than differences and became one group. I won't get into the long history of each group but they've both been around for a while. You read some more info here on our history.

UU churches are easier to find in some places rather than others. For example, in Massachusetts there are 142 UU churches compared with Illinois (who has twice the population of MA) which only has 37 UU churches. Or compare MA's 142 churches to Washington's 31, when the 2 states have roughly the same population. You're more likely to find a UU church in the Northeast than the South or Midwest. And I would say (although I have not verified this) that all large cities will have at least one UU church.

 

[Davidium]

But at the same time... UU churches are growing fast in Urban areas...

There are 9 UU Churches here in the Houston Area, for example. Several of them are above 400 members.

No UU megachurches yet... but there is a movement to found one. It is outside Austin and is known as Pathways.

In America, UU Church history goes back to the late 1700's.... but for a long time we were two separate denominations. The two denominations merged in 1961. We are an ever changing denomination.

We are congregational in Polity. What that means is that the controling authority in the church is the individual member. The members of each church elect a Board of Trustees (or Directors). The Board of Directors hires a minister and other staff. The Board of Directors selects voting representatives to attend our Annual General Assembly, where denominational officers, and committee's are elected. The representatived (called delegates) of each congregation also vote on all the issues facing the denomination... all the major decisions.

In other words, the denomination works for each individual church, not the other way around. Each church has control over their own worship, their own finances, their own ordinations, and their own decisions. The denomination exists for coordination, communication, and to serve the needs of the individual congregations/churches.

There is no "Pope" in UU. Our Denominational President, is indeed the ultimate servant in the denomination. Our ministers are answerable to their Boards of directors and their congregational membership. And the ultimate authority in all decisions within our faith lies with the individual.

So, an individual congregation could take such a vote... or congregational delegates could take such a vote for the denomination as a whole. Such votes are binding... no matter if the leadership agrees with the results of the voting. I am a leader in my church, and the congregation has several times gone in ways I wish they had not... but C'est la vie... I was obviously not persuasive enough.

You win some, you lose some.

I hope that clears it up a bit. In many ways, we are very different than the other denominations in this country.

Yours in faith,

David Pyle
Fellowship Administrator
UU Fellowship of Galveston County
www.uugalveston.org

 

[lilithu]

The biggest misconception that I want to address is something I've heard from both non-UUs and UUs alike. And it really drives me nuts when UUs say it. That is the misconception that just because we are non-credal, UUs are free to believe anything they want. That is simply not true. We UUs cannot believe anything that denigrates or harms other people. We can't believe anything racist, or classist, or sexist, or hetero-sexist, ageist, ableist, etc. UUs are free to believe what our consciences demand us to believe, and nothing less than that.

 

[Unedited]

2)Some think we are just a new age religion, completely unconnected to a larger faith tradition such as Christianity. Yes, our name "Unitarian Universalist" may be relatively new, but the ideas and concepts behind the movement have a long history within the JudeoChristian tradition. We have come to embrace and celebrate all the world's faith traditions, but that doesn't mean we've forgotten where we historically came from.

I believe this was my biggest misconception when I first learned about UU. In my defense, I first heard of it through a Pagan group that held meetings at the church here, so I didn't really assume that it could be connected to Christianity.

 

[Davidium]

A fairly good case can be made that both Unitarian and Universalist thought go back to Arius leaving the Council of Nicea in 325 AD, and being declared a heretic.

Certainly there were many Unitarian Heretics through Christian history... and many of the Gnostic traditions follow Universalist thought.

Pope John Paul once said that the Unitarian Universalists were those who took all the Heresies and made them into one religion.

On Lilithu's point... I take it one step further. I think there is an actual UU Theology that we ascribe to... the problem is that for many of us it is taken as a given. One day I will be able to clarify this theology in detail. One aspect of it though that seems importan to Lilithu's point.

UU's believe that revelation is ongoing, and not limited to one particular teacher or faith tradition. In other words, we believe that the divine (however you percieve that) can be perceived by many or even all... and that all of us may learn something slightly different, but similar. We can learn much by studying the perception of others of the Divine.

Some people perceive the Divine in amazing ways. This list includes Rabbi Jesus, Ghandi, Mohammed, Emerson, Confucius, and so many more... Now, we each find a tradition that speaks to us more than others (or two or three traditions, in my case) but a central part of our faith is the realization that our particular tradition that we most favor does not have a lock on truth or revelation. We can learn from all of them.

We are also guided in that search by realizing that not everything in each of these traditions is forever valid, or interpreted correctly. The exclusion of the Gnostic teachings from the Christian tradition for nearly 1800 years is a good example of how a religious tradition can be incomplete. The completely invalid nature of many Old Testament laws in today's society is an example of how parts of such a tradition can become invalid. The misunderstanding between what is being said about homosexuality by many Christian ministers and what the bible actually says in its original language is an example of how a tradition can be mis-interpreted.

I used Christianity (which is one of my three primary faith traditions, along with Deism and Confucian thought) simply because it is the one which is most familiar. UU's believe we have to use human reason in looking at all religious thought, and accept that which "speaks to you"... or that which makes sense to you.

Ok, I could go on and on... but I believe that there is a deep UU Theology which we ascribe too, only for us it is often so taken for granted that we dont think about it. It is part of what confuses people about our faith.

Yours in faith,

David Pyle

 

[Green Gaia]

The biggest misconception that I want to address is something I've heard from both non-UUs and UUs alike. And it really drives me nuts when UUs say it. That is the misconception that just because we are non-credal, UUs are free to believe anything they want. That is simply not true. We UUs cannot believe anything that denigrates or harms other people. We can't believe anything racist, or classist, or sexist, or hetero-sexist, ageist, ableist, etc. UUs are free to believe what our consciences demand us to believe, and nothing less than that.

Thank you for addressing that (I'd hoped you would ). That is something that irkes me too. Non-UUs I can forgive and educate them, UUs should know better. If someone comes to a UU church with an "anything goes" attitude, I'm afraid they will be in for an awakening. We do not believe in anything that is in conflict with the seven prinicples we affirm.

 

[TashaN]

The biggest misconception that I want to address is something I've heard from both non-UUs and UUs alike. And it really drives me nuts when UUs say it. That is the misconception that just because we are non-credal, UUs are free to believe anything they want. That is simply not true. We UUs cannot believe anything that denigrates or harms other people. We can't believe anything racist, or classist, or sexist, or hetero-sexist, ageist, ableist, etc. UUs are free to believe what our consciences demand us to believe, and nothing less than that.

Actually, before i saw this post i thought that a UU can believe in anything as long as he belong to the UU church

I would like to ask, assume that any country want to make the UU religion the law and religion of that particular country so would they apply the christians law, secular law or mix?

Does the the idea of UU religion was only to gather people from all good religions in one church without considering the importance of the community and govrenment laws?

 

[Katzpur]

I don't know that I have any real misconceptions about Unitarians, Maize, unless the jokes you hear about Unitarians are promoting the misconception that Unitarians are very much into analyzing, critiquing and debating doctrine. You might want to clear that one up.

I would be most interested in what a typical Unitarian Universalist worship service is like -- again, if the word "typical" can even be applied. I just have a really hard time trying to picture atheists and Christians worshipping side by side. I don't understand how it could work.

Thanks,

Kathryn

 

[lilithu]

I would like to ask, assume that any country want to make the UU religion the law and religion of that particular country so would they apply the christians law, secular law or mix?

Does the the idea of UU religion was only to gather people from all good religions in one church without considering the importance of the community and govrenment laws?

Namaste Truth,

I'm not sure I understand your question. Are you asking for our views on the relationship between church and state? UUs are pretty uniformly in favor of the separation of church and state. We would be against government establishing any religion as the official religion, even if it is ours. We believe that government laws should be strictly secular.

That doesn't mean that we don't care about community and government. In fact, we care about both very much. While we believe that the govt should not support any particular religion, we also believe that different religious groups, including ours, should be actively involved in the community and government/politics. And we are very active in both.

 

[Davidium]

I would be most interested in what a typical Unitarian Universalist worship service is like -- again, if the word "typical" can even be applied. I just have a really hard time trying to picture atheists and Christians worshipping side by side. I don't understand how it could work.

Perhaps I can help there...

I recently posted what I call my "full service version" of a sermon I gave at the UU Fellowship of Galveston County. I dont think I should post it here... too long. But I can give you a link to it. You can see what kind of service it was.

And in my audience when I gave it were Christians, Humanists, Pagans, Athiests, and many others.

Here is the link...

http://dynamicdeism.org/forum/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=776

I hope that answers some questions... You will see in many ways of form it is close to a protestant service...

Yours in faith,

David

 

[lilithu]

On Lilithu's point... I take it one step further. I think there is an actual UU Theology that we ascribe to... the problem is that for many of us it is taken as a given. One day I will be able to clarify this theology in detail. One aspect of it though that seems importan to Lilithu's point.

UU's believe that revelation is ongoing, and not limited to one particular teacher or faith tradition. In other words, we believe that the divine (however you percieve that) can be perceived by many or even all... and that all of us may learn something slightly different, but similar. We can learn much by studying the perception of others of the Divine.

Some people perceive the Divine in amazing ways. This list includes Rabbi Jesus, Ghandi, Mohammed, Emerson, Confucius, and so many more... Now, we each find a tradition that speaks to us more than others (or two or three traditions, in my case) but a central part of our faith is the realization that our particular tradition that we most favor does not have a lock on truth or revelation. We can learn from all of them.

We are also guided in that search by realizing that not everything in each of these traditions is forever valid, or interpreted correctly. The exclusion of the Gnostic teachings from the Christian tradition for nearly 1800 years is a good example of how a religious tradition can be incomplete. The completely invalid nature of many Old Testament laws in today's society is an example of how parts of such a tradition can become invalid. The misunderstanding between what is being said about homosexuality by many Christian ministers and what the bible actually says in its original language is an example of how a tradition can be mis-interpreted.

I used Christianity (which is one of my three primary faith traditions, along with Deism and Confucian thought) simply because it is the one which is most familiar. UU's believe we have to use human reason in looking at all religious thought, and accept that which "speaks to you"... or that which makes sense to you.

Ok, I could go on and on... but I believe that there is a deep UU Theology which we ascribe too, only for us it is often so taken for granted that we dont think about it. It is part of what confuses people about our faith.

Yours in faith,

David Pyle

Namaste David,

In addition to your point about on-going revelation, I would also emphasize that UU theology is based on the idea of community. All of us, whether theist or atheist, believe in something greater than ourselves. As you often mention, our faith is based on covenant, and that is inherently communal. Our emphasis on social justice is also based on a communal view of religion. Something that I've repeatedly said here and elsewhere is that as UUs, we may have different views on what "salvation" is, but we all believe that whatever it is, it's communal. No one is "saved" until all are "saved."

So two other misconceptions about UU that even UUs sometimes make are extremes in either direction - either the idea that UU spirituality is only about self-cultivation with no thought of others, or the idea that UUs have no self-cultivation and only work for social justice. No. As a UU, our self-cultivation is intimately tied with social justice. We do one so that we can do the other and vice versa. The movement inward is intimately tied to the movement outward. (Something we share with Christian liberation theology and socially engaged Buddhism, to name two of the traditions from which I draw. )

 

[TashaN]

Namaste Truth,

It seems that you are coming from a Buddhist background if i'm not mistaken.

I'm not sure I understand your question. Are you asking for our views on the relationship between church and state? UUs are pretty uniformly in favor of the separation of church and state. We would be against government establishing any religion as the official religion, even if it is ours. We believe that government laws should be strictly secular.

That doesn't mean that we don't care about community and government. In fact, we care about both very much. While we believe that the govt should not support any particular religion, we also believe that different religious groups, including ours, should be actively involved in the community and government/politics. And we are very active in both.

Thanks for the reply and yes, you did answer my question.

I hope that visiting you guys in your home (Unitarian Universalism forum) would not bother you and in case i have more questions i will be so glad to come here again and ask.

Peace be upon you.

 

[lilithu]

It seems that you are coming from a Buddhist background if i'm not mistaken.

Actually, I got that from Hinduism, but I have seen Buddhists use it too. And yes, I do have some background in Buddhism. Half of my extended family is Buddhist.

I hope that visiting you guys in your home (Unitarian Universalism forum) would not bother you and in case i have more questions i will be so glad to come here again and ask.

Peace be upon you.

Please come by and ask! I think that's what Maize started the thread for.

And peace be upon you too.

 

[lilithu]

I would be most interested in what a typical Unitarian Universalist worship service is like -- again, if the word "typical" can even be applied. I just have a really hard time trying to picture atheists and Christians worshipping side by side. I don't understand how it could work.

We don't know how it works either but it does.

I don't know what a typical UU service is like but I can tell you what a typical service is like at my church, with the caveat that my church is more heavily steeped in the Christian tradition than most.

typical order of service

our church bell is rung

lighting of the chalice - and a worship associate calls for quiet and explains the significance of the chalice.

music for meditation while members of the congregation who have a joy or concern to share go up to light candles of rememberance from our chalice.

processional hymn - led by the choir as they walk down the center aisle, followed by the ministers. This song is usually upbeat, and more often than not an African-American spiritual.

the call to worship, by one of our ministers: blah, blah, blah... something timely and/or relevant to the theme of the sermon .... and then "Come, let us worship together."

the singing of the first hymn

the worship associate welcomes everyone, expains the history of our church, and asks if there are any visitors with us. She or he then lists announcements for big events at the church. We then shake hands or hug those around us and welcome any visitors.

the choir sings an anthem. This can be christian, or Jewish, or Hindu, or Buddhist, or tribal, or a relevant piece of classical or popular music.

a minister shares congregational joys and concerns - wedding announcements, deaths, illnesses, people leaving and returning - and invites us to call out the names of those we are concerned about in order for the community to embrace them.... then leads us in prayer. The prayer is almost always addressed to "Holy One, Spirit of Life, God of many names..."

then a short moment of quiet meditation.

then someone from the choir breaks the silence with a prelude to "Spirit of Life."

the congregations sings "Spirit of Life" (which is the equivalent of our doxology) This also serves to put us in a much quieter, more receptive mood for the sermon.

The minister gives the opening reading and then the sermon. The biggest difference between a service at my church and at yours, I would imagine, is that the opening reading is just as likely to be a poem or a quote as it is to be from scripture. And if it is from scripture, it's just as likely to be from Hindu or Buddhist or Taoist scripture as it is from Christian. Our sermons also draw from a number of sources, and while we do touch often on Christian themes, Jesus would never be presented as God.

more music as we pass the collection plates. the ushers bring the money up to the altar (as a symbol of community offering) and then into the back for counting.

we sing the second hymn

the minister says something to send us out into the world again: blah, blah, blah... something timely and/or relevant to the theme of the sermon .... and then "Go in peace and in love."

and we end with more music. The music at the end of the service is often upbeat again. If the sermon was rousing and the energy is there, the congregation is usually clapping and singing and dancing along to the music by then.

the minister extinguishes the chalice; people line up to tell him or her what they liked or disliked (we are UUs afterall) about the sermon.

And then there's lunch and about a half a dozen committee meetings.

 

[Ciscokid]

*snip*
And then there's lunch and about a half a dozen committee meetings.

You may be a UU if:

You bring your day planner to church rather than the Bible....LOL!!

Thanks again Maize, that one kills me.