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Muslims brotherhood to put Israel-Egypt peace pact to referendum

W

waterbear

Member
painted wolf said:
Tricky issue....

I generally don't think that if the MB outs the treaty that it means they want war... more likely they want a political leaver to use when dealing with Israel and political points from their neighbors.

Having said that, I totally understand why Israelis would be very nervous about this move.

wa:do
Click to expand...

Israel and it's main economic and military support, the U.S., is losing it's grip on the Middle East via the Arab Spring movement toppling Israeli/U.S. supported Arab dictators friendly with Israel and the U.S. even when this was always a minority Arab opinion in Middle East countries subjected to centuries of foreign control.

One notices a pattern in European colonization and takeover of non-European lands which is that when European colonists fail to substantially outnumber the indigenous populations those native peoples will eventually take back their countries, e.g. India, e.g. South Africa, e.g. Rhodesia, and eventually, Israel. By 2050 the Palestinian (Arab) Israeli population will outnumber the Israeli Jewish population in Israel. What's going to happen then to the Zionist goal? This future scenario scares Israeli strategists and so Israel is promoting war in region hoping to do another blitz war with America on its side to destroy first Iraqi competition, then Iranian competition, and any other Arab nation that dares to defy Israeli hegemony in the Middle East, such as a new Egypt might do given the immense and unending animosity in all Middle East Arab nations generated by the Zionist takeover of Palestine.
 
Gharib

Gharib

I want Khilafah back
Shermana said:
Making a peace treaty with the "Palestinians" is not viable. Why should Israel? What benefit is it to them? Fatah and Hamas will not honor it, their goal is to eliminate the Zionist presence. It would be suicide for Israel to make a deal with the Palestinians. Have the current peace agreements been beneficial to Israel? No? Then why should Israel expect any further deals to be?
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muslims are allowed to make peace treaties with non-muslims. and as far as i know israel is breaking the peace by taking palestinian land, why does it keep stealing land and when the palestinians fight for it it's 'they' who break the treaty for protecting their land.

If you even have to ask "What if Israel was putting it to a referendum", you display a total irrational understanding of the situation. Why would Israel put it to referendum? Why? Egypt has Muslim-brotherhood related reasons to do away with the peace. Israel doesn't.
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yeah it doesn't i know because israel is benefiting from the treaty and egypt isn't, shouldn't it be beneficial for both countries, you seem to agree that it should be with the palestinians, why not with egypt?

As for the Egyptian referendum, if they do away with the peace treaty, that means they want war and don't want peace. Nothing else. If they do away with it, Israel should start buying B-52s and fortify the western border like the Maginot line and expect for a massive invasion and get ready to retake the Sinai.
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muslims are forbidden from starting wars, however breaking the threaty means they can threaten israel for terrorizing palestinians and stealing their land, which might lead to war, to me personally thats what is spelled out by the treaty being put up for referendum, and i hope i'm right.

and the reason why israel doesn't want the treaty broken is because it knows egypt will defend palestine and that means war as you've said.

also the Sinai belongs to egypt, israel stole it, and sadat took it back. wasn't he the one who stormed the parliament house or something, he waged an uncalled for war on israel and won?
 
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Gharib

Gharib

I want Khilafah back
Caladan said:
But its not Israel who plans to nullify the peace treaty, isn't it right?
it's Egypt.
this peace treaty was signed with Israel handing to Egypt the entire Sinai peninsula, one thing that I don't understand is how easily Muslim members trivialise this fact and the signed agreement.
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i know israel doesn't plan on nullifying the treaty, the question is why? just like the other question about not making a peace treaty with palestine, why isn't it?

as for the Sinai, israel signed it back, it already belonged to egypt, israel stole it by waging war. they fought for a second time when sadat stormed israel unexpectedly and took it back. you don't know your own history, i have to tell it to you.
 
Caladan

Caladan

Agnostic Pantheist
Sajdah said:
I see your point which is a poor attempt to justify the "Israeli" arrogance but it is irrelevant!
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You on the other hand, make no points. you ramble on and on. if you can't answer my points, simply admit it.

Perhaps it was just the policy of the ousted regime of Mubarak who was an ally and a close friend to zionists so it is not strange at all...I'm not surprised though, that "Israeli soldiers" are unable to stop an attack they had prior knowledge about, because they are just trained on massacring women and babies, not only this but they lay the blame of their failure on others and give themselves the right to continuously raid on a neighboring country claiming to have a peace treaty with!!
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Let me get this straight. you believe Israeli soldiers should stop fire from inside Egyptian territory? and should stop rockets attacks from inside Egyptian territory?
so AGAIN, I'm asking.. why do you complain!
you show no desire for Egyptian soldiers to take possession and responsibility of their own territory.
 
Caladan

Caladan

Agnostic Pantheist
eselam said:
i know israel doesn't plan on nullifying the treaty, the question is why? just like the other question about not making a peace treaty with palestine, why isn't it?
Click to expand...
Perhaps you have not been following the historical time line. but negotiations are not a matter of days, or even weeks or months. sometimes its a matter of years. just like it took a long time for Egypt and Israel to strike a peace agreement. so do the negotiations between the Palestinians and the Israelis are counted in matter of years. and several stages of recognitions between the two parties have taken place, there is no point in ignoring that or denying that.

as for the Sinai, israel signed it back, it already belonged to egypt, israel stole it by waging war. they fought for a second time when sadat stormed israel unexpectedly and took it back. you don't know your own history, i have to tell it to you.
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Good lord. please, go learn history. the Sinai was not taken back by Sadat and Egypt by storming Israel. it was given back by Israel, by its own will in a peace agreement.
your knowledge of history is remarkably low if not non existent all together.
please, go and and learn the basic differences between the 1967 war, the 1973 war, and the fact that the Sinai remained in Israeli hands after the latter.
The Sinai peninsula was willingly handed to the Egyptians by the Israelis in order to strike a long term peace agreement. the same peace agreement that the Muslim Brotherhood now puts to referendum.
 
painted wolf

painted wolf

Grey Muzzle
waterbear said:
Israel and it's main economic and military support, the U.S., is losing it's grip on the Middle East via the Arab Spring movement toppling Israeli/U.S. supported Arab dictators friendly with Israel and the U.S. even when this was always a minority Arab opinion in Middle East countries subjected to centuries of foreign control.

One notices a pattern in European colonization and takeover of non-European lands which is that when European colonists fail to substantially outnumber the indigenous populations those native peoples will eventually take back their countries, e.g. India, e.g. South Africa, e.g. Rhodesia, and eventually, Israel. By 2050 the Palestinian (Arab) Israeli population will outnumber the Israeli Jewish population in Israel. What's going to happen then to the Zionist goal? This future scenario scares Israeli strategists and so Israel is promoting war in region hoping to do another blitz war with America on its side to destroy first Iraqi competition, then Iranian competition, and any other Arab nation that dares to defy Israeli hegemony in the Middle East, such as a new Egypt might do given the immense and unending animosity in all Middle East Arab nations generated by the Zionist takeover of Palestine.
Click to expand...
How does this relate to anything I had to say?

As for the "Israeli/America blitz war" that is one of the stupidest things I've ever heard. It's this sort of juvenile scare-mongering and villainization that keeps people from acting like responsible adults to solve their problems.

wa:do
 
Flankerl

Flankerl

Well-Known Member
eselam said:
also the Sinai belongs to egypt, israel stole it, and sadat took it back. wasn't he the one who stormed the parliament house or something, he waged an uncalled for war on israel and won?
Click to expand...


Oh yes egypt won big time. http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/d/dc/Yom_Kippur_War_map-2.png

:biglaugh:

Except of course that one egyptian army was cut off from any support and the other one couldnt advance either. While the evil zionist forces could've driven all the way to Alexandria.

Glorious victory.


eselam said:
yeah it doesn't i know because israel is benefiting from the treaty and egypt isn't, shouldn't it be beneficial for both countries, you seem to agree that it should be with the palestinians, why not with egypt?
Click to expand...

Oh really?
Hm lets have a look.

Before the peace treaty: http://s1.directupload.net/images/120109/refj5tbj.jpg

After the peace treaty: http://s14.directupload.net/images/120109/lqfb9dnj.jpg


As we can see egypt did NOT benefit from the peace treaty in any way. :rainbow1:
 
YmirGF

YmirGF

Bodhisattva in Recovery
Rakhel said:
yeah. It's usually "Evil Zionist" "Zionist occupier" "Zionist oppressor" Wah wah wah wawah wah
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Pfffft. Next you will be saying "The Protocols of the Elders of Zion" is fraudulent propaganda.

*starts looking under each rock and behind every bush for an evil Jew*
 
England my lionheart

England my lionheart

Rockerjahili Rebel
Premium Member
eselam said:
muslims are allowed to make peace treaties with non-muslims. and as far as i know israel is breaking the peace by taking palestinian land, why does it keep stealing land and when the palestinians fight for it it's 'they' who break the treaty for protecting their land.



yeah it doesn't i know because israel is benefiting from the treaty and egypt isn't, shouldn't it be beneficial for both countries, you seem to agree that it should be with the palestinians, why not with egypt?



muslims are forbidden from starting wars, however breaking the threaty means they can threaten israel for terrorizing palestinians and stealing their land, which might lead to war, to me personally thats what is spelled out by the treaty being put up for referendum, and i hope i'm right.

and the reason why israel doesn't want the treaty broken is because it knows egypt will defend palestine and that means war as you've said.

also the Sinai belongs to egypt, israel stole it, and sadat took it back. wasn't he the one who stormed the parliament house or something, he waged an uncalled for war on israel and won?
Click to expand...

images


I often wonder if some people even bother to read ,learn or even try to understand the history of the region,IMO it appears some people just totally ignore facts.
 
Debater Slayer

Debater Slayer

Vipassana
Staff member
Premium Member
I don't want to sound like I'm being antagonizing or anything here, but isn't there proof of Israeli war crimes such as besieging Gaza and killing children/women?

I'm not saying that "the Jews" are all bad or stereotyping here, but I think there's a fair bit of evidence for Israel's constant war crimes and breaches of human rights.
 
England my lionheart

England my lionheart

Rockerjahili Rebel
Premium Member
Debater Slayer said:
I don't want to sound like I'm being antagonizing or anything here, but isn't there proof of Israeli war crimes such as besieging Gaza and killing children/women?

I'm not saying that "the Jews" are all bad or stereotyping here, but I think there's a fair bit of evidence for Israel's constant war crimes and breaches of human rights.
Click to expand...

Wheres the evidence for these constant war crimes
 
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