Neat Video Explaining the Evidence of Our Relationship To the Other Great Apes

[ChristineM]

According to the head of the Atheist church, Richard Dawkins, the sole purpose of life is

That is untrue on at least 2 counts
1/ Dawkins is not the head of any church, atheist or otherwise
2/ Dawkins admits that he is not atheist but at most, agonistic.

The only problem is Atheists are not very good at being reproduction machines, yet the people they love to attack those that have a much better track record of this sole 'purpose of life'.

Seems to be that you are the one doing the attacking. And atheist procreate as well as any faithful, perhaps better and with more joy because they are not limited by religious sexual dogma.

Recent studies shows atheism to be the fastest growing group, outstripping Islam which is claimed as the fastest growing religioius religious group.

The share of Americans who identify as atheists has roughly doubled in the past several years. Pew Research Center’s 2014 Religious Landscape Study found that 3.1% of American adults say they are atheists when asked about their religious identity, up from 1.6% in a similarly large survey in 2007. An additional 4.0% of Americans call themselves agnostics, up from 2.4% in 2007.
10 facts about atheists
Can Islam say its doubled in seven years?

 

[Bob the Unbeliever]

Your struggling with simple facts:

1 God does not need us
2 No amount of worship from humans could ever repay the gift of sight etc
3 God gives us guidance in the form of Religious Scriptures
4 We follow that guidance and benefit both ourselves and man kind <<<< This pleases God and makes Him more inclined to forgive us when we return to Him.

Nothing I've said contradicts these 4 statements.

1) false. Your #3 and #4 contradict this.

2) this does not explain the blind and or deaf. Did they "sin" or something?

Worship is what slaves do. No being who wanted or even approves of slavery, is Good. Such a being is evil.

3) False. Proof? The "guidance" includes demands to murder other humans, to hate specific groups of humans, and to treat women as if they were property--to be traded around like cattle.

Moreover, the "guidance" is rife with contradiction--- and that is 100% proof that there never was any god behind it-- no god would be so .... clumsy.

4) I have seen what happens when people follow the "guidance" of self-titled "holey" books. Evil. War. Women-as-property. "Unapproved" people tossed off of high buildings. Children abused and mistreated. Suppression of knowledge <=== the very worst kind of sin imaginable.

And, again, #4 contradicts the above: "This pleases God and makes Him more inclined to forgive us when we return to Him."

Apparently this "god" of yours is like some kind of "Worship Merchant" in that we "buy" our "mercy" by lots and lots of Ego Stroking (prayers).

that's not good.

 

[Bob the Unbeliever]

You people even have your own Churches to come together and discuss your faith. What happens at an atheist church? - BBC News

You as an individual may shun this Church and belong to another, I don't know. Perhaps you keep yourself to yourself at home whist gazing at the lord dawkins screensaver, again I don't know. But look, don't get touchy and shouty about it. Everyone is free to follow what ever belief rocks their boat. I respect your right to hold your beliefs

Not My Circus. Not My Monkeys. There is no such thing as "atheist church".

There is no "atheist bible".

There is no "atheist handbook".

The link you refer to? Is a Social Club (like ALL churches) that happens to NOT be associated with any Mythical Beings (like god or unicorns or Santa Claus)

 

[Bob the Unbeliever]

Yes IF they are right I lose.

IF the follower of Thor, the God Of Thunder is right? You also lose.

At last count, there were thousands of separate and distinct ideas of "god"--

Your odds are rather poor.

 

[Muslim-UK]

That is untrue on at least 2 counts
1/ Dawkins is not the head of any church, atheist or otherwise
2/ Dawkins admits that he is not atheist but at most, agonistic.

Head of the Atheist Church is a joke I was having with 'It aint necessarily so'. Dawkins is the face of Atheism, and its number 1 spokesperson. There are also Atheist Churches, so you can see where my humour stems from:

The 25 Most Influential Living Atheists | Super Scholar

"Weighing in at the top spot is, of course, Richard Dawkins. Using science, and especially the evolutionary theory of Darwin, to undercut the factual basis of religious belief, he has turned against religion as rationally and morally incoherent. Dawkins is the most conspicuous public voice and face of contemporary atheism."

Books: The God Delusion, A Devil’s Chaplain, The Selfish Gene

Seems to be that you are the one doing the attacking. And atheist procreate as well as any faithful, perhaps better and with more joy because they are not limited by religious sexual dogma.

Recent studies shows atheism to be the fastest growing group, outstripping Islam which is claimed as the fastest growing religioius religious group.

The share of Americans who identify as atheists has roughly doubled in the past several years. Pew Research Center’s 2014 Religious Landscape Study found that 3.1% of American adults say they are atheists when asked about their religious identity, up from 1.6% in a similarly large survey in 2007. An additional 4.0% of Americans call themselves agnostics, up from 2.4% in 2007.
10 facts about atheists
Can Islam say its doubled in seven years?

The Pew study looking at future predictions confirms what you're saying. Atheism will rise in America and elsewhere, but as a percentage of the overall Global population projected for 2050, Atheists will have shrunk. Muslims and Christians do a better job according to the meaning of life by atheist's understanding. I thought it funny is all

 

[Muslim-UK]

IF the follower of Thor, the God Of Thunder is right? You also lose.

At last count, there were thousands of separate and distinct ideas of "god"--

Your odds are rather poor.

Yes with all the different concepts of God out there, the odds look abysmal. Of course once you start to examine the evidences brought forward by all the different ideas and concepts, then ONE clear winner emerges, One clear path shared by Jews, Christians and Muslims.

 

[Valjean]

The Pew study looking at future predictions confirms what you're saying. Atheism will rise in America and elsewhere, but as a percentage of the overall Global population projected for 2050, Atheists will have shrunk. Muslims and Christians do a better job according to the meaning of life by atheist's understanding. I thought it funny is all

Religiosity appears to be tied to security. In prosperous, secure societies people feel less need for divine assistance or reassurance.
I think future trends are more difficult to predict than these studies account for. I suspect there are more political and ecological factors than can be accurately predicted.

 

[Muslim-UK]

Religiosity appears to be tied to security. In prosperous, secure societies people feel less need for divine assistance or reassurance.
I think future trends are more difficult to predict than these studies account for. I suspect there are more political and ecological factors than can be accurately predicted.

Religion and Spirituality is also tied in with happiness and well being. I do agree the these sorts of projections aren't set in stone. We'll just have to wait an see how things pan out. What we can be assured of is, Religion and Spirituality will be around until the Sun permanently stops radiating.

 

[sayak83]

Yes with all the different concepts of God out there, the odds look abysmal. Of course once you start to examine the evidences brought forward by all the different ideas and concepts, then ONE clear winner emerges, One clear path shared by Jews, Christians and Muslims.

We Hindus disagree

 

[Muslim-UK]

We Hindus disagree

Well I can only go by my interactions with Hindus online. In my humble opinion, they seem very reluctant to explain their beliefs, much less bring forth evidences. Perhaps you could start a thread explaining why your belief holds truth, and I can read along and ask questions. I'll keep an eye out for it, or send me a link to the thread if you decide to go ahead.
Peace

 

[sayak83]

Well I can only go by my interactions with Hindus online. In my humble opinion, they seem very reluctant to explain their beliefs, much less bring forth evidences. Perhaps you could start a thread explaining why your belief holds truth, and I can read along and ask questions. I'll keep an eye out for it, or send me a link to the thread if you decide to go ahead.
Peace

Please go to the Hinduism DIR and see a few threads to get a general idea. It's quite active. Otherwise get a book. We generally do not have a commission from God to convert people or to prove our way is the best for you. If you have questions, ask in the interfaith or debates thread and include me. Just do not declare superiority without knowing Hinduism, Buddhism, Jainism, Confucius and Daoist views that have been the foundations of some of the greatest living civilizations in the world.

 

[Bob the Unbeliever]

Yes with all the different concepts of God out there, the odds look abysmal. Of course once you start to examine the evidences brought forward by all the different ideas and concepts, then ONE clear winner emerges, One clear path shared by Jews, Christians and Muslims.

To your claim in bold? False. I have looked-- there is absolutely zero actual evidence.

I do not count hearsay nor personal feelings as "evidence". Neither do I count friend-of-a-friend stories.

And that covers 100% of the Abrahamic religion's "evidence".

Gossip, in short.

I expect superior workmanship from a being entitled to the label "God". The Abrahamic books simply do not cut it-- they are too flawed, too obscure, too ..... Human.


It behooves this "God" of yours to be more clear, less obscure and less controversial, if, as you claim, the consequences are so ..... Dire.

To do anything less? Would be Immoral.

With Absolute Power, comes Absolute Responsibility.

 

[Muslim-UK]

To your claim in bold? False. I have looked-- there is absolutely zero actual evidence.

I do not count hearsay nor personal feelings as "evidence". Neither do I count friend-of-a-friend stories.

And that covers 100% of the Abrahamic religion's "evidence".

Gossip, in short.

I expect superior workmanship from a being entitled to the label "God". The Abrahamic books simply do not cut it-- they are too flawed, too obscure, too ..... Human.


It behooves this "God" of yours to be more clear, less obscure and less controversial, if, as you claim, the consequences are so ..... Dire.

To do anything less? Would be Immoral.

With Absolute Power, comes Absolute Responsibility.

Billions of people disagree with you including ardent sceptics. You likely haven't studied, but that's ok. Just live a good life and treat others how you wish to be treated.

 

[ChristineM]

Head of the Atheist Church is a joke I was having with 'It aint necessarily so'. Dawkins is the face of Atheism, and its number 1 spokesperson. There are also Atheist Churches, so you can see where my humour stems from:

The 25 Most Influential Living Atheists | Super Scholar

"Weighing in at the top spot is, of course, Richard Dawkins. Using science, and especially the evolutionary theory of Darwin, to undercut the factual basis of religious belief, he has turned against religion as rationally and morally incoherent. Dawkins is the most conspicuous public voice and face of contemporary atheism."

Books: The God Delusion, A Devil’s Chaplain, The Selfish Gene



The Pew study looking at future predictions confirms what you're saying. Atheism will rise in America and elsewhere, but as a percentage of the overall Global population projected for 2050, Atheists will have shrunk. Muslims and Christians do a better job according to the meaning of life by atheist's understanding. I thought it funny is all

Yet your statement is still untrue. And your reply stinks of religious bias

No i can't see where your humour comes from, would you call a shiite iman a leader of sunnis?

Richard Dawkins: I can't be sure God does not exist
"He told the Archbishop of Canterbury, Dr Rowan Williams, that he preferred to call himself an agnostic rather than an atheist."

That's from the guy himself, not some hype site with their own ax to grind.


As for your interpretation of pews research, nonsense. For a start, pew omits Europe and more importantly China where at least twice the population of america are atheist.

Sure Islam is growing but not as fast as the population is growing, hence in realm terms, Islam is actually shrinking.

Christianity is in dire straights, shrinking at an alarming rate,

Atheism to Defeat Religion By 2038 | HuffPost

That of course omits the (perhaps) millions of atheists closeted in Muslim countries who are unable to voice their lack of faith for fear of their and their families lives.

 

[Muslim-UK]

Richard Dawkins: I can't be sure God does not exist
"He told the Archbishop of Canterbury, Dr Rowan Williams, that he preferred to call himself an agnostic rather than an atheist."

That's from the guy himself, not some hype site with their own ax to grind.

Yes from his own lips, (i'm going to paraphrase) on a scale of 1-7 where 7 is outright rejection of God, he is a 6.9 :/

He also says an Agnostic would be 50/50 (3.5 on the scale on his scale.) Does he really have to be any clearer? He was obviously a little embarrassed being in the presence of a God fearing Archbishop.

As for your interpretation of pews research, nonsense. For a start, pew omits Europe and more importantly China where at least twice the population of america are atheist.

The report did mention China:
The Future of World Religions: Population Growth Projections, 2010-2050

Meanwhile, the Asia-Pacific region is expected to have a declining share of the world’s population (53% in 2050, compared with 59% in 2010). This will be reflected in the slower growth of religions heavily concentrated in the region, including Buddhism and Chinese folk religions, as well as slower growth of Asia’s large unaffiliated population. One exception is Hindus, who are overwhelmingly concentrated in India, where the population is younger and fertility rates are higher than in China or Japan. As previously mentioned, Hindus are projected to roughly keep pace with global population growth. India’s large Muslim population also is poised for rapid growth. Although India will continue to have a Hindu majority, by 2050 it is projected to have the world’s largest Muslim population, surpassing Indonesia.

China’s 1.3 billion people (as of 2010) loom very large in global trends. At present, about 5% of China’s population is estimated to be Christian, and more than 50% is religiously unaffiliated. Because reliable figures on religious switching in China are not available, the projections do not contain any forecast for conversions in the world’s most populous country. But if Christianity expands in China in the decades to come – as some experts predict – then by 2050, the global numbers of Christians may be higher than projected, and the decline in the percentage of the world’s population that is religiously unaffiliated may be even sharper. (For more details on the possible impact of religious switching in China, see Chapter 1.)

Christianity is in dire straights, shrinking at an alarming rate,

Let's hope it plummets amongst the Bible belt. The single area of Christians in the World, who have the ability to unleash Armageddon on the rest of the Planet.

Owning a Bible was banned for 1,000 years helping to keep alive hope of salvation in Hundreds of Millions of English speaking people. Most of those people turning their backs on Christianity will turn to Spirituality of some kind.

That of course omits the (perhaps) millions of atheists closeted in Muslim countries who are unable to voice their lack of faith for fear of their and their families lives.

Yes, I have no doubts about this.

 

[ChristineM]

Yes from his own lips, (i'm going to paraphrase) on a scale of 1-7 where 7 is outright rejection of God, he is a 6.9 :/

He also says an Agnostic would be 50/50 (3.5 on the scale on his scale.) Does he really have to be any clearer? He was obviously a little embarrassed being in the presence of a God fearing Archbishop.

The report did mention China:
The Future of World Religions: Population Growth Projections, 2010-2050

Meanwhile, the Asia-Pacific region is expected to have a declining share of the world’s population (53% in 2050, compared with 59% in 2010). This will be reflected in the slower growth of religions heavily concentrated in the region, including Buddhism and Chinese folk religions, as well as slower growth of Asia’s large unaffiliated population. One exception is Hindus, who are overwhelmingly concentrated in India, where the population is younger and fertility rates are higher than in China or Japan. As previously mentioned, Hindus are projected to roughly keep pace with global population growth. India’s large Muslim population also is poised for rapid growth. Although India will continue to have a Hindu majority, by 2050 it is projected to have the world’s largest Muslim population, surpassing Indonesia.

China’s 1.3 billion people (as of 2010) loom very large in global trends. At present, about 5% of China’s population is estimated to be Christian, and more than 50% is religiously unaffiliated. Because reliable figures on religious switching in China are not available, the projections do not contain any forecast for conversions in the world’s most populous country. But if Christianity expands in China in the decades to come – as some experts predict – then by 2050, the global numbers of Christians may be higher than projected, and the decline in the percentage of the world’s population that is religiously unaffiliated may be even sharper. (For more details on the possible impact of religious switching in China, see Chapter 1.)

Let's hope it plummets amongst the Bible belt. The single area of Christians in the World, who have the ability to unleash Armageddon on the rest of the Planet.

Owning a Bible was banned for 1,000 years helping to keep alive hope of salvation in Hundreds of Millions of English speaking people. Most of those people turning their backs on Christianity will turn to Spirituality of some kind.


Yes, I have no doubts about this.

So your faith decree's that a man who prefers to call him self agnostic because he can't be sure if a god exist is an atheist and be dammed or is that just your personal opinion?

With about 1.3 billion Muslims with an approximate growth of 1.8% p/a, that's an increase of 23,400,000 million per year.

World population at 7.5 billion, increase 1.1% = 82,500,000 increase per year. Subtract 29,000,000 annual death gives an approximate current population growth of 53,500,000

Over twice the Muslim increase, so although the Muslim population is increasing, as a proportion of world population growth it failing to hold its own, just like every other faith.

Christianity does seem to be declining rapidly in the US, by 8% in seven year to 2014. Having said that, certain sections of the Muslim world are doing a pretty good impression of armageddon.

We are not discussing ancient history. But no, most didn't turn their backs on Christianity hence the reason Christianity is the worlds biggest faith, for now.

 

[Muslim-UK]

So your faith decree's that a man who prefers to call him self agnostic because he can't be sure if a god exist is an atheist and be dammed or is that just your personal opinion?

So hang on a minute. If he's 99% sure no God exists and is classed as a Agnostic, could you please define what a Atheist actually is? If it's someone who is 100% sure no God exists, then in reality there aren't that many Atheists in the World.

We are not discussing ancient history. But no, most didn't turn their backs on Christianity hence the reason Christianity is the worlds biggest faith, for now.

I wasn't talking about ancient history either. I said those that leave Christianity will mostly turn to Spirituality.

 

[ChristineM]

So hang on a minute. If he's 99% sure no God exists and is classed as a Agnostic, could you please define what a Atheist actually is? If it's someone who is 100% sure no God exists, then in reality there aren't that many Atheists in the World.

I wasn't talking about ancient history either. I said those that leave Christianity will mostly turn to Spirituality.

Hang on a minute, who said he's 99% sure gods don't exist?

Ben Stein: “So you’re a science guy. Can you quantify your assertion that there is no god? I mean, how sure are you?”

Richard Dawkins: “I really don’t feel comfortable putting a number on it.”

Ben Stein: “Ninety-nine percent?”

Richard Dawkins: “Yes, I guess 99 percent.”

Ben Stein: “Why not 97?”

Richard Dawkins: “I suppose it could be 97. I’m not really—”


Which boils down to the gut is not sure, like he said.

Atheist : a person who disbelieves or lacks belief in e existence of God or gods.

Agnostic : a person who believes that nothing is known or can be known of the existence or nature of God.

Oxford English dictionary.

Dawkins, by his own words, on several occasions is unsure.

By definition that is an agnostic view, not atheist.

Hope that helps alleviate some of your confusion.


You said and i quote "Owning a Bible was banned for 1,000 years helping to keep alive hope of salvation in Hundreds of Millions of English speaking people."

That occurred during the dark and middle ages, a restriction imposed by priests to perpetuate their mystique. Not that it made much difference to mr or mrs average who was unable to read any way.

By my reckoning the dark and middle ages are pretty ancient history.

 

[DavidFirth]

How can anyone be 100% sure no God exists? That's blind faith.

 

[ChristineM]

How can anyone be 100% sure no God exists? That's blind faith.

Easy when over thousands of years, literally billions of god believers have provided exactly 0% evidence gods exist. See where the balance is set?

Add to that the various other proofs that no gods exist and the confirmation is simply verified