Oklahoma gun store and range declares itself a ‘Muslim-free’ zone

[Shadow Wolf]

I can't believe some people hate all of us (therefore hate me) this much.
Such news ruin my day for good. Enough RF for today.

At least you're among good company within "the hated."

 

[LuisDantas]

“I didn’t want any terrorists, or Muslims, cult, whatever you want to call them, training on my gun range,” Neal said. “There is a military recruiting station in the mall in Muskogee, and I thought this was one thing I could do to help protect our local soldiers.”

Not a wonderful motivation, but I think he is within his rights. There is no good reason why gun range owners should open their doors without religious discrimination.

(...) The Council on American-Islamic Relations tracks businesses that ban Muslims, and it called for the U.S. Department of Justice to investigate.

“It is clear to us that the establishment of Muslim-free zones is a violation of the law,” said Nihad Awad, executive director of CAIR. “There are clear laws that prohibit discrimination based on religion. This kind of thing is in violation of the U.S. Constitution and the American spirit of respect for the rule of law.”​

If there are such laws, they should be strongly questioned and if at all possible done with. The idea that people should have access to gun training regardless of their religious beliefs is just silly. Gun training is not at all a right.

 

[Twilight Hue]

I'm always curious as to why these people aren't required to take basic law and government classes in school.
I took 2 semesters of government (because I enjoy it) but it was an elective course.
Sad that the education system allows people like this to be produced.

The issue of him being anti-Muslim is different, of course.
I'm not trying to justify him here, but, I suppose it's possible that his views were caused by war.
It's possible that he could be a victim as well, with an incorrect perspective.
Maybe he could be persuaded out of his position, shown that people he fought in war do not represent all Muslims.

I dunno, just a thought.

I think It's accurate as to where people are coming from.

Lets face facts, there has been a whole lot of barbaric activity being perpetuated in the name of Islam with no sign of waning anytime soon, so it makes sense as to why people react in the manner that they do so as not to contribute to future acts brought about by services or facilities rendered.

Imagine how some people likely felt that serviced radicals who went out and did unspeakable horrible acts afterwards.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Not a wonderful motivation, but I think he is within his rights. There is no good reason why gun range owners should open their doors without religious discrimination.

In America, religion is protected under the civil rights act. It is considered discrimination here.

Lets face facts, there has been a whole lot of barbaric activity being perpetuated in the name of Islam with no sign of waning anytime soon, so it makes sense as to why people react in the manner that they do so as not to contribute to future acts brought about by services or facilities rendered.

There has been a whole lot of barbaric activity in the name of everything. It's much more likely the next public shooter will train in his establishment than a radical Muslim.

 

[Skwim]

Not a wonderful motivation, but I think he is within his rights. There is no good reason why gun range owners should open their doors without religious discrimination.



If there are such laws, they should be strongly questioned and if at all possible done with. The idea that people should have access to gun training regardless of their religious beliefs is just silly. Gun training is not at all a right.

See post #8.

 

[Bunyip]

I wonder how all of the Moslems who supported, protected and fought with this man in Iraq would feel? All of those Moslems his own troops were allied with? Who fought and died with US troops?

 

[Deathbydefault]

I think It's accurate as to where people are coming from.

Lets face facts, there has been a whole lot of barbaric activity being perpetuated in the name of Islam with no sign of waning anytime soon, so it makes sense as to why people react in the manner that they do so as not to contribute to future acts brought about by services or facilities rendered.

Imagine how some people likely felt that serviced radicals who went out and did unspeakable horrible acts afterwards.

That comes to a point, though.
There needs to be a line drawn or it'll progress into outright discrimination.

 

[Twilight Hue]

There has been a whole lot of barbaric activity in the name of everything. It's much more likely the next public shooter will train in his establishment than a radical Muslim.

Maybe. But there's a distinction concerning individual vs organisational/religious capabilities and Islam has a very poor track record atm. Islam right now dosent hold any distinction as being benevolent anytime soon towards those who don't hold to it's ideology. Affiliate yourself in a spotlight like that, and folks might not be too friendly towards you which seems to be the case here.

 

[Smart_Guy]

Hey, there's always going to someone, or more, who hates "your kind" no matter what kind you are.

You shouldn't worry about such things.
Everyone is hated by someone somewhere.
Consider......I have people IRL & on RF who hate me guts,
while you're loved (alas, not romantically) by all who know you..
Can't do better than that!

At least you're among good company within "the hated."

You guys are sweet.
Love ya

 

[Revoltingest]

You guys are sweet.
Love ya

Let's keep that love for me platonic, bub!

 

[LuisDantas]

In America, religion is protected under the civil rights act. It is considered discrimination here.

I consider it discrimination as well. But I don't see any reason why access to gun ranges should not be subject to arbitrary discrimination.

There has been a whole lot of barbaric activity in the name of everything. It's much more likely the next public shooter will train in his establishment than a radical Muslim.

On the other hand, that he is worried about it at all shows a degree of acknowledgement and may help awaken others.

 

[LuisDantas]

"The entire United States is covered by the Federal Civil Rights Act of 1964, which prohibits discrimination by privately owned places of public accommodation on the basis of race, color, religion or national origin. Places of “public accommodation” include hotels, restaurants, theaters, banks, health clubs and stores. Nonprofit organizations such as churches are generally exempt from the law.

So, no matter where you live, you cannot deny service to someone because of his or her race, color, religion, national origin or disability.
source​

Stores are places of public accommodation? I thought there were several that were exclusive to some degree or another?

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Islam right now dosent hold any distinction as being benevolent anytime soon towards those who don't hold to it's ideology.

Just because some are doesn't mean they all are. There are still many Christians who are not benevolent towards outsiders, but mainstream society has no issues with overlooking modern-day Christian terrorists; it even often dismisses the bad with "no true Christian would...." However, sentiments towards Islam aren't too far off from where sentiments towards Communism were during the mid-20th century, and still to the hatred is deeply ingrained in society, even though most people don't realize there is a difference between Marxism and communism. America has never really been that nice towards anyone who is outside of its ways, and Islam is on the receiving end of a long history of xenophobia.

 

[Twilight Hue]

Just because some are doesn't mean they all are. There are still many Christians who are not benevolent towards outsiders, but mainstream society has no issues with overlooking modern-day Christian terrorists; it even often dismisses the bad with "no true Christian would...." However, sentiments towards Islam aren't too far off from where sentiments towards Communism were during the mid-20th century, and still to the hatred is deeply ingrained in society, even though most people don't realize there is a difference between Marxism and communism. America has never really been that nice towards anyone who is outside of its ways, and Islam is on the receiving end of a long history of xenophobia.

Concidering the manner by which people are thrown in cages and burned alive, rigged up on cranes for public display, amputations without anesthesia or sterile "equipment" , stoned alive, slow beheadings using dull knives, honor killings and severe horrible mutilations , God knows what else.

Are you saying it's all actually unjustified xenophobia and Muslims collectively are simply misunderstood?

Christianity was no better in the middle ages, and deserved any retaliation they had coming to them at the time for their actions, especially the Roman Catholics, but since then, you don't see any modern day Christian theocracy employing barbarism on the sheer scale that many Muslims are doing right now. Hard to empathize under such circumstances.

When this kind of thing goes on indiscriminately with established organized religious governments and institutions, it's not any surprise that people get xenophobic over all that is seen and recorded, and react in a defensive manner.

People somehow seem to habitually forget that the mess all started with the world trade center, where it was Muslims in the name of Islam that first started this worldwide mess by the act of flying multiple aircraft with civilians on board into buildings on US soil.

 

[Smart_Guy]

Let's keep that love for me platonic, bub!

You...
You...
You broke my heart

 

[esmith]

Let's look at this in a realistic manner.
First who carries identification that states their religion; second do you really think that those that work in this place are really going to ask every person what their religion is? This is nothing more that basically a publicity stunt, other than the owner has an aversion to Muslims, just as those that have an aversion to any religion and want any symbolism expressing religion removed from public sight.. Or like store owners that put up signs that say "No firearms allowed" or "This is a gun free zone". This in itself is discrimination if you really think about it.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Are you saying it's all actually unjustified xenophobia and Muslims collectively are simply misunderstood?

Yes, I am. Most Muslims are not deranged violent lunatics committing the things you mentioned. And when you focus those things you mentioned, you will notice they overwhelming come from the same areas of the world, but even still not all Muslims in those few areas are deranged violent lunatics. When you look at Muslims, as a whole, a very large majority of them want nothing to do with extremism, they don't support it, they don't condone it, and we can find them dismissing it as "no true Muslim...." In America, animal and earth-rights extremists are some of the most active, they carry out more terrorist operations on American soil than Muslim extremists, yet the Republicans don't even bring it up when they are dismissing environmental concerns.

 

[Kilgore Trout]

The linked article's author alludes to a "growing list", but doesn't present one.
I've been in many gun stores, & I've yet to see such a sign, so I suspect it's pretty rare.
Perhaps it seems otherwise because it gets media attention whenever it occurs, eh?

Yeah, but with the one last year and this one now, the number has doubled in the last year.

 

[Revoltingest]

Yeah, but with the one last year and this one now, the number has doubled in the last year.

Oh, man.....I forgot about statistics!

 

[columbus]

Yeah, but with the one last year and this one now, the number has doubled in the last year.

That assumes the previous one still exists. It sounds like a desperate ploy to support a failing business to me.

One would like to think that the 2nd amendment gun toting freedom lovers would look at the sign and say, "Hey it's a free country! That means Muslims too ya know."

Tom