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"Paedophilia"

Fluffy

A fool
Whilst I was searching for statistics to back up my argument that a lower age of consent would not reduce paedophilia, I came across a wealth of information (although not the statistics I was looking for) debunking common misconceptions on all kinds of sexual deviancy. I was, personally, surprised at some of the things I found out and was interested to know whether it was merely my ignorance or whether this kind of thing was more widely misconceived. So here are a few of the things I learnt.

The term paedophilia applies to the sexual attraction towards children under the age of 13 (or prepubescent). There is a move to introduce a seperate this from the attraction to children under the age of 2, under the name infantophilia or nepiophilia since many scientists believe this to be a different condition than that, for example, of being attracted to an 11 year old. The latter is also much more uncommon.

Ephebophilia or hebophilia is the sexual attraction towards postpubescent children. This is NOT paedophilia in any sense of the word even though it is always called this by the media. Whilst it is uncommon to develop the kind of dependancy on this sexual attraction which the term ephebophilia, sexual desires towards postpubescent children, under the age of 17 are common in society with most studies showing that, amongst men, 25% are attracted to children in this region.

This is further backed up by the case of Traci Lords of which I have copy and pasted a passage from www.wikipedia.org for those who are unfamiliar with her.
the case of actress Traci Lords. On September, 1984, the 15-year old was the centerfold of the U.S. Penthouse magazine. She used a fake I.D. saying she was 22 and everyone believed. During her minority, she also appeared in other U.S. adult magazines like Oui, Hustler, High Society and Swank. Overall, she starred 107 porn movies at ages 15 to 17. Later on, the FBI confiscated all the material, which is now considered child pornography. Millions and millions of consumers (mostly adults) felt sexual attraction to this underage adolescent.
Countries such as France and Brazil are not only tolerant of ephebophilia but have made it legal. This seemed so odd to me since it sits in stark contrast with the media-fed fear of paedophilia which is certainly sweeping the UK and America.

Furthermore a large proportion of illegal sexual assaults on children below the age of 13 are STILL not consider paedophilia in the eyes of the law, only in the eyes of the media. This is because much of child molestation is circumstantial, ie the rapist just wanted to rape somebody and the child happened to be in the wrong place at the wrong time or the rapist wanted to take advantage of the fact that the child might be less likely to come forward/easier to kidnap etc. These examples are not paedophilic in nature because the rapist does not have the condition (although he is certainly suffering from A condition).

My final thoughts were these. What if paedophilia was a treatable psychological disease (rather than the approach that is taken by the majority at the moment of control/contain but not cure)? What if there were far far far more people suffering from this condition than are known about because they are able to refrain from committing an offence but feel too isolated by social attitudes towards their condition to seek help?
 

michel

Administrator Emeritus
Staff member
I am surprised by what you have come up with, Fluffy.

Like you were, I was ignorant of the fact that paedophelia is actually only the 'label' for one group of a whole range. I am evem more astounded by your assertion that it is not a crime;
PART QUOTE["Furthermore a large proportion of illegal sexual assaults on children below the age of 13 are STILL not consider paedophilia in the eyes of the law, only in the eyes of the media. This is because much of child molestation is circumstantial"QUOTE]

I don't know the source of your information, but if look at :-http://www.bbc.co.uk/crime/fighters/nhtcu.shtml

You will find that paedophelia is indeed a crime; that is why the NHTCU was formed - who often confiscate computers from people believed to be involved in this crime - and there is also a fact that paedophiles now go onto a sex offender's register. I'd be interested to know the source of your material.:confused:
 

Fluffy

A fool
Sorry michel I did not mean to imply that paedophilia was legal. Just that a large proportion of sexual assualts which are labelled paedophilia are in fact not paedophilia. These sexual assualts are still illegal but I think misrepresenting what is essentially a mental illness in such a way is not very responsible of the media. In this paragraph I have used the term paedophilia has it should be used (as in an attraction to prepubescent children).

When you look hebophilia, the laws get a lot more murky. For example it can be legal for a 40 year old to date a 15 year old but not a 10 year old. In France and Brazil, sexual intercourse between the 40 year old and the 15 year old would be legal but not with the 10 year old. Child pornography laws are much more clear cut (ignoring the murky yet very legal issue of child erotica) since it cannot involve situational paedophilia/hebophilia and the difference between paedophilia and hebophilia is irrelevant.

My concern is that a feeling which is present in 25% of men (hebophilia) is being labelled and demonised based on the actions of pedophiles when they are cleary different things. Fear leads to hatred, and not just hatred but irrational blinded hatred. I am not saying that child molestation is right (being a child, I would not want to be molested by a older person) but there is a proper way to respond to such things and I am a little edgy at how people are beginning to do so.
 

ness

Member
When you look hebophilia, the laws get a lot more murky. For example it can be legal for a 40 year old to date a 15 year old but not a 10 year old. In France and Brazil, sexual intercourse between the 40 year old and the 15 year old would be legal but not with the 10 year old.

To me that is sick... just my opinion.

I understand what you are saying and I agree each "disease" as its called should have a different label so to speak. I think that it is all looked at in a "general" way and grouped all together because we associate men with anyone who is under the legal age as pedophiles. Aswell as women.
 

kreeden

Virus of the Mind
Any stats can be misleading . One has to look closely at how the question was defined , worded and what was being looked for at the time . As for 26% of men being hebophilia{ lites } ??? It does appear rather high to me , but as I said , it would depend upon what one defines it and how one defines sexual attraction . { is a hug or kiss on the cheek really sexual ? or just a show of affection ? It can be either , depending upon the culture } . Worrying about people in the matter , what they MAY do , before they do it ... kinda , well , I think we all would be in prison for some crime that we may do sometime in the future . :)

As for the types of sexual attraction , Canadian Law no longer uses the word " rape " but has different forms of " sexual assault ". The is why the " Age of Consent " varies here .

And one last note . Have you ever seen a picture of Tacy Lords when she was 15 or 16 ? She really didn't look her age . :) I myself was going out with a 19 year old when I was 14 . Never though anything of it , untill my mother told her my age . Then she dropped me so fast .... lol { it is funny now , but wasn't at the time }
 

ness

Member
kreeden said:
Any stats can be misleading . One has to look closely at how the question was defined , worded and what was being looked for at the time . As for 26% of men being hebophilia{ lites } ??? It does appear rather high to me , but as I said , it would depend upon what one defines it and how one defines sexual attraction . { is a hug or kiss on the cheek really sexual ? or just a show of affection ? It can be either , depending upon the culture } . Worrying about people in the matter , what they MAY do , before they do it ... kinda , well , I think we all would be in prison for some crime that we may do sometime in the future . :)
Yes I can se your point here ... so we are agreed :)


And one last note . Have you ever seen a picture of Tacy Lords when she was 15 or 16 ? She really didn't look her age
I have seen pictures of her yes... not the nasty ones but normal.. I saw her Biography a while back. Your right she did not look her age but.... That is still no excuse.
 

kreeden

Virus of the Mind
Yes Ness , I believe that we do agree . My point was that we are not mind readers though . I don't think that Kuzma { Lords } is a good excample to use when argueing agaisnt child aduse . And I hope not to come across as if I am defending child aduse . I am not . { just wanted to make that clear :) }
 

ness

Member
kreeden said:
Yes Ness , I believe that we do agree . My point was that we are not mind readers though . I don't think that Kuzma { Lords } is a good excample to use when argueing agaisnt child aduse . And I hope not to come across as if I am defending child aduse . I am not . { just wanted to make that clear :) }
Nope that she isnt, woohoo we agree again lol.

It doesnt look to me as though u are defending child abuse in any way at all so no worries :)
 

Yerda

Veteran Member
ness said:
Sexual attraction to a "child"
She wasn't exactly a toddler according to all accounts.

There is giving a kiss or a hug ~ nutral
Then there is giving a kiss or a hug ~ sexual
I suppose there is. Are you making a point here?
 

ness

Member
truthseekingsoul said:
She wasn't exactly a toddler according to all accounts.

I suppose there is. Are you making a point here?

If you go back and read the other post my point has already been made :)
 

Melody

Well-Known Member
I can understand an adult being sexually attracted to a minor who doesn't look like a child (i.e. Tracy Lords) *but* once you find they are a child, you should be able to mentally put them off limits. It's called "self-control".
 

michel

Administrator Emeritus
Staff member
Melody said:
I can understand an adult being sexually attracted to a minor who doesn't look like a child (i.e. Tracy Lords) *but* once you find they are a child, you should be able to mentally put them off limits. It's called "self-control".
Exactly.:)
 

kreeden

Virus of the Mind
I couldn't agree more Melody . :) But then , these days a 30 year old seems young to me ... ;)

{ and that was only half joking } :(
 
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