Persuasion, inspiration or manipulation?

[Tomef]

According to Paul's letter to the Philippians, in his day there were already people preaching about Jesus for their own benefit. There are what look like some fairly obvious examples of that today, people who, for reasons I find hard to understand, are able to manipulate large numbers of people into giving them cash, power, even adulation. So, what is the dividing line between teaching that persuades or inspires people to follow a faith, and words used to manipulate for the speaker's gain? Is there a dividing line? Is all preaching manipulative to some degree?

Interested in hearing about personal experience of being manipulated, how you saw through it, or any examples of or stories about the same.

 

[Twilight Hue]

According to Paul's letter to the Philippians, in his day there were already people preaching about Jesus for their own benefit. There are what look like some fairly obvious examples of that today, people who, for reasons I find hard to understand, are able to manipulate large numbers of people into giving them cash, power, even adulation. So, what is the dividing line between teaching that persuades or inspires people to follow a faith, and words used to manipulate for the speaker's gain? Is there a dividing line? Is all preaching manipulative to some degree?

Interested in hearing about personal experience of being manipulated, how you saw through it, or any examples of or stories about the same.

It's a cottage industry. That applies to just about any religion or belief out there.

 

[PureX]

I think it's a mistake to presume one person can manipulate another against their will. Instead, they look for people that are feeling desperate and hoping for some kind of miracle solution, and then offer them that miracle solution ... while picking their pockets, of course. And their victims willingly oblige because they are desperately trying to believe that some sort of magic will save them. They really want to believe the lie. And so they do.

The rest of us look at them and think; 'how could they be so stupid?' But they aren't stupid. They're just desperate. But we don't see or care about their desperation. That means nothing to us. So we just think they're stupid. And so they deserve to be fleeced by these criminals. And what does that say about us?

 

[bobhikes]

I am not easily manipulated but I have a weakness when it comes to my family.

Back in the day people would come up to you in malls telling you how great your kid looked and they could be a model. Giving you their card. After multiple malls and several cards I decide they were right and followed up After two sessions and 600 dollars out of pocket I realized it was a scam. I wrote it off as lesson learn but the state went after then. I know because they called me to be a witness and after a few years I got all my money back.

That said when it comes to family I still have to be careful.

 

[Tomef]

It's a cottage industry. That applies to just about any religion or belief out there.

I think there’s some difference, though, between someone who teaches others what they genuinely believe they need to know, whether paid or not, and others whose motives are more cynical.

 

[Tomef]

I am not easily manipulated but I have a weakness when it comes to my family.

Back in the day people would come up to you in malls telling you how great your kid looked and they could be a model. Giving you their card. After multiple malls and several cards I decide they were right and followed up After two sessions and 600 dollars out of pocket I realized it was a scam. I wrote it off as lesson learn but the state went after then. I know because they called me to be a witness and after a few years I got all my money back.

That said when it comes to family I still have to be careful.

Lots of things can seem legit until we get burned I guess.

 

[Tomef]

I think it's a mistake to presume one person can manipulate another against their will. Instead, they look for people that are feeling desperate and hoping for some kind of miracle solution, and then offer them that miracle solution ... while picking their pockets, of course. And their victims willingly oblige because they are desperately trying to believe that some sort of magic will save them. They really want to believe the lie. And so they do.

The rest of us look at them and think; 'how could they be so stupid?' But they aren't stupid. They're just desperate. But we don't see or care about their desperation. That means nothing to us. So we just think they're stupid. And so they deserve to be fleeced by these criminals. And what does that say about us?

I think we can all be manipulated in one way or another. I mean, we’re not always switched on to the possibility, in every situation. University lecturers can be manipulative too, for example, and unless we’re consciously looking for subtle (or not so subtle) cues that’s one way on which our thinking can be influenced, unduly perhaps. If something comes pre-packaged with other ideas we already agree with, that can be quite potent. There are degrees between immutability and outright getting scammed.