Phony advertising from churches Huffington Post

[McBell]

Expecting churches to tell the truth and not lie and not use trickery to sell their church is not anywhere near a pedestal, in some cases its against the law, some churches are scamming people. The bible says not to use trickery, if you claim that your church is liberal and Universal, you better be a Universal liberated church if your not your a liar.

With the scams and lies being told I'm shocked people are up here defending scamming and lieing. Bazzarre.

Who gets to decide if the church is liberal and universal enough?
Would that not be each individual?
One wonders how many of the churches your condemn are also being accused of being TOO liberal and or universal?

Who is right?
You or the ones claiming they are TOO liberal and or universal?

 

[BSM1]

But Demonslayer isn't entitled to his belief about them?

Absolutely, but that's not what he's saying. He seems to want the "religious" to change to fit his world view.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

It seems you are doing that which you are despising. It seems you are forcing your views on others. If you are not happy with your particular religious group, start your own.

It's not a matter of forcing. It's just natural progression. They're going to change on that topic eventually, like they have on many others. It's not a matter of dogma, after all.

I'm not a Protestant or a schismatic so "start your own" doesn't work with me.

 

[Riders]

Who gets to decide if the church is liberal and universal enough?
Would that not be each individual?
One wonders how many of the churches your condemn are also being accused of being TOO liberal and or universal?

Who is right?
You or the ones claiming they are TOO liberal and or universal?

Nobody is saying your church is too liberal, according to the Huffington Post article it was a criticism for conservative churches directed at how liberal and accepting of people they are when they wernt. Theyre complaining your too conservative and saying your not.Thats the issue.

I remember I use to hear preachers on tv saying " we had better learn to have an answer straight forward answer about the gosple to the sinner. People are going to start demanding a straight forward truthful answer on what your church teaches exactly about GLBTs.

Its gonna get to where people will probably start asking exact questions on your beliefs.

Universalism means you accept and embrace all religions , not one religion only, Christianity, Universalism is a description of all religions. Non denominational churches have folks from different denominations and say they don't care what church your from, its not the same thing.
You still believe that Jesus is the only way, but what denomination your from doesn't matter. Universalists don't believe in one religion, we have Pagans Atheists Muslims in our church.

Teaching Jesus as the only way that you can saved only from a ritual you call accepting Jesus is different.

There is absolutely nothing about that that is Universal, Universal preachers preach about and to all religions , not the one only Christian Gosple. Its a joke that youd even insinuate any of you guys are Universal.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

Absolutely, but that's not what he's saying. He seems to want the "religious" to change to fit his world view.

And what's wrong with wanting that?

What's wrong with even taking steps to make that happen? If someone tried to get rid of religious homophobia through consensual conversations aimed at convincing the religious people to freely choose to abandon their homophobia, what would be the problem?

Just because you're opposed to someone's view doesn't mean that you support violating their rights to get your way.

 

[BSM1]

And what's wrong with wanting that?

What's wrong with even taking steps to make that happen? If someone tried to get rid of religious homophobia through consensual conversations aimed at convincing the religious people to freely choose to abandon their homophobia, what would be the problem?

Just because you're opposed to someone's view doesn't mean that you support violating their rights to get your way.

This is really not what we are talking about. Just because I may oppose you point of view that does not give the right to come into your place of worship and force you to change (and I am not trying to defend any one's point of view). By the same token religions should not have the right to come out of their places of worship and try to force any "sinner" to change. As trite as it may sound you have the freedom not to attend a religious concern and find, or start, you own church that will reflect your point of view.

 

[Riders]

This is really not what we are talking about. Just because I may oppose you point of view that does not give the right to come into your place of worship and force you to change (and I am not trying to defend any one's point of view). By the same token religions should not have the right to come out of their places of worship and try to force any "sinner" to change. As trite as it may sound you have the freedom not to attend a religious concern and find, or start, you own church that will reflect your point of view.

That's true, and when conservative Christians personally invite me to their church and use lies and trickery to make their church sound like its Universal and accepting of everyone; Then I get their and their preaching hell fire and brimstone that's exactly what theyre doing .Theyre forcing their religions down my throat.

You manipulated and tricked me to get me in to shove your gospel down my throat.

 

[columbus]

Want to make a betty bet, if I'm expecting someone to be accepting of me and my lesbian girlfriend when I go to church arm and arm with her and we get hate messages about homosexuality while were theyre,Im going to be completely traumatized. That in no way compares to a stupid perfume commercial.

I don't bet much.
I certainly would not bet against someone who is determined to be traumatized. No matter how naively ignorant they might be.
I live in the USA and am familiar with the culture. Most Christian churches are not very welcoming of openly gay people. I would not walk in to one arm and arm with my spouse of 20+ years and expect everyone in the place to be welcoming. Because I live in reality and not your fantasy world where everything you read in an advertisement is necessarily the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth.
Tom

 

[BSM1]

That's true, and when conservative Christians personally invite me to their church and use lies and trickery to make their church sound like its Universal and accepting of everyone; Then I get their and their preaching hell fire and brimstone that's exactly what theyre doing .Theyre forcing their religions down my throat.

You manipulated and tricked me to get me in to shove your gospel down my throat.

That's true, and when conservative Christians personally invite me to their church and use lies and trickery to make their church sound like its Universal and accepting of everyone; Then I get their and their preaching hell fire and brimstone that's exactly what theyre doing .Theyre forcing their religions down my throat.

You manipulated and tricked me to get me in to shove your gospel down my throat.

So let me get this straight, they chain you to the pew? If you really had the courage of your conviction couldn't you simply stand up and walk out?

 

[columbus]

So let me get this straight, they chain you to the pew? If you really had the courage of your conviction couldn't you simply stand up and walk out?

This is the bottom line.
Take responsibility for your own choice to go and your reaction to the very predictable message preached.

Don't blame others for your inability to see or deal with the obvious.
Tom

 

[Riders]

Wrong if you tell a lie to get people in youll have to deal with your choice and one way were dealing with that is we dont want to go there. If you sin and obviously yoru defending committing a sin scamming people to get them in youll have to deal with your consequence, I don't go to Christian churches dear, this is one reason why.


But according to Huffingtom Post this is one reason why people don't want to go, your a Christian church your not suppose to lie to get people in, you do you've got the consequences. Huffington Post says some churches are paying the price, I'm not paying a price.

Its true we have the right to walk out but were choosing it and were choosing not to go so do go wining about why people don't go to your church if your willing to lie to get people in. People dont want to be lied to. Your suppose to spread the gospel of Jesus not the Gospel of deceit.

I have no consequences to my behavior but you are suffering them.

 

[Riders]

Not chaining me to a pew doesn't make it ok to lie to and manipulate people.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

Just because I may oppose you point of view that does not give the right to come into your place of worship and force you to change (and I am not trying to defend any one's point of view).

Who do you think is arguing that people be forced to change?

 

[BSM1]

Not chaining me to a pew doesn't make it ok to lie to and manipulate people.

When you realize you've been lied to and manipulated, maybe it's time to move on.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

When you realize you've been lied to and manipulated, maybe it's time to move.

Or maybe it's time to speak up. Do you have a problem with people speaking out against religions? You seem to not have a problem with people speaking out against the LGBT community.

 

[BSM1]

Or maybe it's time to speak up. Do you have a problem with people speaking out against religions? You seem to not have a problem with people speaking out against the LGBT community.

Obviously you feel the need to vent. So you speak up? So What? And no, I have absolutely no problem speaking against religions; been doing it for years. But I do not believe I have the right to go into a church, temple, synagogue,or goat sacrifice and tell those folks they need to change their evil ways. If they come at me then that's a different story. I don't feel my religious beliefs have to be validated or ratified by any institutions. Also, I have never spoken out against the LGBT community. Unless you can cite one incident where I have, then you owe me an apology. Sometimes we let emotions cloud perceptions

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

Obviously you feel the need to vent. So you speak up? So What? And no, I have absolutely no problem speaking against religions; been doing it for years. But I do not believe I have the right to go into a church, temple, synagogue,or goat sacrifice and tell those folks they need to change their evil ways. If they come at me then that's a different story. I don't feel my religious beliefs have to be validated or ratified by any institutions. Also, I have never spoken out against the LGBT community. Unless you can cite one incident where I have, then you owe me an apology.

You need to read more carefully. I didn't say you spoke out against the LGBT community yourself; I said you supported those who did.

... and you did so right here:

Not trying to be argumentative but "the religious" do not have to give up their "War on Gays". This is their belief and they are entitled to it. By the same token gays or any other segmented faction can opt to find a religion or a religious sect that will be more accepting and loving. Trying to force someone or some group usually ends badly for all participants.

Religious groups are entitled to a "war on gays", but telling them that they ought not to wage this war is "forcing"?

Your posts in this thread have a consistent theme: anti-gay religious people should be free to express their hate unchallenged, and people who have a problem with this should just shut the hell up.

 

[Twilight Hue]

It kinda baffles me as to just why would a person want to walk in a hostile orientated environment in the first place?

If a church proves non conformist or less than stellar in any capacity, then it's clearly not for those at odds.

Isn't there something about bearing fruit?

 

[BSM1]

You need to read more carefully. I didn't say you spoke out against the LGBT community yourself; I said you supported those who did.

... and you did so right here:



Religious groups are entitled to a "war on gays", but telling them that they ought not to wage this war is "forcing"?

Your posts in this thread have a consistent theme: anti-gay religious people should be free to express their hate unchallenged, and people who have a problem with this should just shut the hell up.

I have never supported those that speak against the LBGT community. Still waiting for that apology.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

I have never supported those that speak against the LBGT community.

... except in the post I quoted?

Still waiting for that apology.

Good luck with that.