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Porn Pastor

Meow Mix

Chatte Féministe

First link: regards unsafe sex (STI’s, STD’s, pregnancy, abortion, cancer from HPV)

Second link: Nigerian population of 100, also risks of unsafe sex

Third link: compulsivity, different issue than adults having casual sex

Fourth link: more HPV

Fifth link: exclusively drug-addicted prostitutes (which by the way is correlated, but correlation =/= causation)

Sixth link: more unsafe sex

Seventh link: mental trauma caused by other people judging casual sex

Eight and ninth links: more unsafe sex

So what about responsible, mature, consenting adults engaging in premarital sex?
 

Hockeycowboy

Witness for Jehovah
Premium Member
First link: regards unsafe sex (STI’s, STD’s, pregnancy, abortion, cancer from HPV)

Second link: Nigerian population of 100, also risks of unsafe sex

Third link: compulsivity, different issue than adults having casual sex

Fourth link: more HPV

Fifth link: exclusively drug-addicted prostitutes (which by the way is correlated, but correlation =/= causation)

Sixth link: more unsafe sex

Seventh link: mental trauma caused by other people judging casual sex

Eight and ninth links: more unsafe sex

So what about responsible, mature, consenting adults engaging in premarital sex?
That was quick!

I think you may have overlooked some of the findings?

How does “responsible “ fit in this context?
Maybe you, but how can you judge the other person as the same, if you don’t really know them?

Here’s a quote from the Psychology Today “ article:

“Researchers examining the mental health associations of hookup sex also report that participants who were not depressed before showed more depressive symptoms and loneliness after engaging in casual sex.
 

Meow Mix

Chatte Féministe
That was quick!

I think you may have overlooked some of the findings?

How does “responsible “ fit in this context?
Maybe you, but how can you judge the other person as the same, if you don’t really know them?

Here’s a quote from the Psychology Today “ article:

“Researchers examining the mental health associations of hookup sex also report that participants who were not depressed before showed more depressive symptoms and loneliness after engaging in casual sex.

Yes I noted this, but as I commented, correlation =/= causation.

Note the following: "Of course, this was a correlational study. We don’t know whether poor mental health caused individuals to be more likely to engage in casual sex or whether, as was shown in studies reviewed by Garcia, poor health resulted from casual sex."

The authors already commented just before the bit you posted that a lot of negative feelings were either reported as or suspecting of being as related to perceptions from others rather than de facto dissatisfaction with casual sex.
 

Meow Mix

Chatte Féministe
@Hockeycowboy

Also note "Our findings suggest that even though gender norms, biology, or some combination of the two may lead men to be more likely to seek (or at least to report seeking) casual sex, there are similar connections as for women between hookups and mental health. Moreover, the fact that we defined casual sex in the way that we did (with a stranger within the past month), it is possible that we were tapping into a population at particularly high-risk due to high levels of impulsivity. At that level, mental-health factors may trump socialization or biology to wipe out gender effects."
 

Meow Mix

Chatte Féministe
@Hockeycowboy

Try this one: Does-Casual-Sex-Harm-College-Students-Well-Being-A-Longitudinal-Investigation-of-the-Role-of-Motivation.pdf (researchgate.net)

From the abstract:

"Engagement in casual sex (or hooking up) is generally feared to have negative well-being consequences; however, empirical evidence is inconclusive, pointing toward potential moderators. Using self-determination theory (SDT), we hypothesized that well-being following hookups would depend on the type and level of motivation for hooking up. A university-wide sample of 528 undergraduates completed online surveys at the beginning (T1) and end (T3) of one academic year. After controlling for demographics, personality traits (i.e., neuroticism and extraversion), prior casual and romantic sex, and T1 well-being, having genital hookups between T1 and T3 for non-autonomous reasons (i.e., due to self-imposed pressures, external contingencies and controls, or complete lack of intentionality) was linked to lower selfesteem,higherdepressionandanxiety,andmorephysicalsymptoms. Autonomous hookup motivation (i.e., emanating from one’s self) was not linked to any outcomes. Compared to peers without hookups, those with high non-autonomy in their hookups typically had inferior well-being; this was not true of those with low non-autonomy hookups. Gender differences, implications for SDT and casual sex research, and implications for educational programs and clinical work are discussed"

In other words, people choosing to have casual sex of their own volition, being unconcerned with peer pressures and what society thinks of them, were not correlated with "lower self esteem, higher depression and anxiety, and more physical symptoms."
 

Meow Mix

Chatte Féministe
I think the takeaway point here is that engaging in sex should be done safely and responsibly, and people should stop judging people for doing so; because the "high non-autonomy" hookups are harmed by society's ill-placed judginess or driven to do it in the first place by these peer pressures.

Sex should be autonomous, consensual, and none of anyone else's place to judge.
 

Shadow Wolf

Certified People sTabber & Business Owner
Nope. Lets review.
Is There a Price to Pay for Promiscuity? - Longevity Center - Everyday Health
“It is comparable to, and may coincide with, behaviors such as heavy drinking, gambling, and other thrill-seeking behaviors like driving too fast."
Sexual promiscuity: knowledge of dangers in institutions of higher learning - PubMed
The result showed that students had a fair knowledge of sexual promiscuity, although in terms of medical consequences the knowledge was low for both groups.
Compulsive sexual behavior - Symptoms and causes
Compulsive sexual behavior is sometimes called hypersexuality, hypersexuality disorder or sexual addiction. It's an excessive preoccupation with sexual fantasies, urges or behaviors that is difficult to control, causes you distress, or negatively affects your health, job, relationships or other parts of your life.
More sexual partners, more cancer? - Harvard Health
Does this mean having sex leads to cancer?
The answer is almost surely no.

That’s because this type of study cannot assess whether sex causes cancer. It can only determine whether there is a correlation between the two. Also, we already know of ways that sexual behavior can indirectly affect cancer risk without actually causing cancer, especially through sexually transmitted infections. Some of the strongest connections are for:

  • human papilloma virus (HPV), which increases the risk of cancers of the cervix, mouth, penis, and anus
  • human immunodeficiency virus (HIV) infection, which increases the risk of cancers such as Kaposi’s sarcoma and lymphoma
  • hepatitis B and hepatitis C infection, which have been linked to liver cancer
  • gonorrhea, which increases the risk of prostate cancer (particularly among African American men).
In addition, people with more sexual partners tended to smoke more and drink more alcohol. These factors could, themselves, increase the risk of cancer. So, certain factors — in these cases, infections, smoking, and drinking — could have an impact on cancer risk, rather than having sex or the number of sexual partners.
Prevalence and Health Correlates of Prostitution Among Patients Entering Treatment for Substance Use Disorders
Studies of prostitution have focused largely on individuals involved in the commercial sex trade, with an emphasis on understanding the public health effect of this behavior. However, a broader understanding of how prostitution affects mental and physical health is needed. In particular, the study of prostitution among individuals in substance use treatment would improve efforts to provide comprehensive treatment.
Young people must consider risk of promiscuity
Many young, healthy adults foolishly think they are invincible to STDs, and therefore pursue promiscuous relationships without getting tested.
Effects of human sexual promiscuity | owlapps
Human sexual promiscuity is the practice of having many different sexual partners. In the case of men, this behavior of sexual nondiscrimination and hypersexuality is referred to as satyriasis, while in the case of women, this behavior is conventionally known as nymphomania. Both conditions are regarded as possibly compulsive and pathological qualities, closely related to hyper-sexuality.
Seems to me the problem is poor understanding of sex, lack of sexual education, high risk behaviors like smoking and drug abuse, prostitutes, and for whatever reason you decided to include pathological conditions and illnesses.
 

Kangaroo Feathers

Yea, it is written in the Book of Cyril...
No, my point was clearly that I can quantify the harm, but not with a measuring instrument but with words like depraved, lascivious, shallow, selfish, hedonistic, ...
Again, I'm talking about the porn star being under suspicion, that she will selfishly and disrespectfully try and seduce a married man due to her insatiable and indiscriminate lust. This is the damage, her desires are not appreciated by most people, nor what she stands for. The sentiment is, hide your daughters and your sons when a porn star walks into the room, due to either influence or engagement.

You need to show more perception, if you can't tell the difference between the behaviour of a women of ill-repute, and a decent, self-respecting and conservative one.
Plus, lay-off the imposition charges, ...you need to start discerning right from wrong, and if you're able to get that far, start correcting people when their getting in harm's way.
If you need an arbitrary value judgement to "quantify harm" that isn't actually quantifying harm. That's making an arbitrary value judgement.

You don't START with discerning right from wrong, you START with working out what hurts or helps people. What hurts people is what's wrong.
 

Kangaroo Feathers

Yea, it is written in the Book of Cyril...
I think the takeaway point here is that engaging in sex should be done safely and responsibly, and people should stop judging people for doing so; because the "high non-autonomy" hookups are harmed by society's ill-placed judginess or driven to do it in the first place by these peer pressures.

Sex should be autonomous, consensual, and none of anyone else's place to judge.
Yep.

I... personally... believe in committed monogamy. But that's what's right for me. I acknowledge it's a personal belief. So even though I have my own ideas about sexual morality, I don't make the mistake of assuming that just because something appears moral to me, I have any right to enforce those views on others.

If something causes objective harm or occurs without someone's informed consent? That I will condemn, quite vociferously and forcefully. What any given equal to or greater than one person/people chose to do with the full, informed consent of all involved, that doesn't cause any objective harm? Even if I don't personally approve of it, I'm not going to tell them they can't do it. I'll offer my opinion, if/when asked, but I don't make the mistake of thinking that just because I have an opinion about how other people live they are under any obligation to change their lives to accommodate my views. A lot of people seem to think having an opinion gives them the right to control what other people do, even when there is no objective harm nor lack of consent. Strangely these people seem to get upset pretty quickly as soon as you start telling them what they may not do.
 

Meow Mix

Chatte Féministe
Yep.

I... personally... believe in committed monogamy. But that's what's right for me. I acknowledge it's a personal belief. So even though I have my own ideas about sexual morality, I don't make the mistake of assuming that just because something appears moral to me, I have any right to enforce those views on others.

If something causes objective harm or occurs without someone's informed consent? That I will condemn, quite vociferously and forcefully. What any given equal to or greater than one person/people chose to do with the full, informed consent of all involved, that doesn't cause any objective harm? Even if I don't personally approve of it, I'm not going to tell them they can't do it. I'll offer my opinion, if/when asked, but I don't make the mistake of thinking that just because I have an opinion about how other people live they are under any obligation to change their lives to accommodate my views. A lot of people seem to think having an opinion gives them the right to control what other people do, even when there is no objective harm nor lack of consent. Strangely these people seem to get upset pretty quickly as soon as you start telling them what they may not do.

I’m a monogamist too — when I’m in a relationship. When I wasn’t, I wouldn’t be averse to taking someone home if I got to know her well enough even if there were no further intentions. And I think that’s fine.

And it’s fine for people that wouldn’t, too. My issue is when people bully and shame other people even when they’re doing things responsibly.
 

DNB

Christian
Being a porn star doesn't mean someone would wantonly disrespect someone's existing relationship though. A lot of people in the sex work industry are just sex positive, not jerks.
But there's a decadence and inordinate lust there. It's not healthy to be that infatuated with sex, it's gluttonous, no balanced person should ever require that much sex in a day, in a year, or in a lifetime. There's a hedonism that comes with the environment, where it would be imprudent to not have suspicions about the type of characters that indulge in such activities.
 

DNB

Christian
Do you think morality would exist if God or any other mind didn't? If no minds existed, would there be something about the universe that means it would be wrong to steal, even if nobody is there to steal? Such that the wrongness comes from something outside of minds?

That would be realism.

If you think minds have to exist for morality to exist, that's probably objective morality.
I believe that God has to exist in order for their to be an absolute morality. Otherwise, all activities on earth would just be action, and reaction, nothing else to assess. We may decide to avoid certain consequences, but there will never be grounds to condemn anyone based on principle alone.

Because morality is so innate in us, many take it for granted that only an external force, the source of the judgement, has instilled this within us. Otherwise, the material realm has absolutely no awareness or capacity to even conceive of such abstract intangibles.
 

Meow Mix

Chatte Féministe
But there's a decadence and inordinate lust there. It's not healthy to be that infatuated with sex, it's gluttonous, no balanced person should ever require that much sex in a day, in a year, or in a lifetime. There's a hedonism that comes with the environment, where it would be imprudent to not have suspicions about the type of characters that indulge in such activities.

I doubt they're having that much sex in a day. If it's anything like when I stripped I only had to work 2-3 nights a week and I was making more money than any of my friends (except the other strippers).
 

Meow Mix

Chatte Féministe
I believe that God has to exist in order for their to be an absolute morality. Otherwise, all activities on earth would just be action, and reaction, nothing else to assess. We may decide to avoid certain consequences, but there will never be grounds to condemn anyone based on principle alone.

Because morality is so innate in us, many take it for granted that only an external force, the source of the judgement, has instilled this within us. Otherwise, the material realm has absolutely no awareness or capacity to even conceive of such abstract intangibles.

If God is the source of morality, how does God know what is good? Are you sure you're not a Divine Command Theorist?
 

DNB

Christian
If you need an arbitrary value judgement to "quantify harm" that isn't actually quantifying harm. That's making an arbitrary value judgement.

You don't START with discerning right from wrong, you START with working out what hurts or helps people. What hurts people is what's wrong.
For crying out loud, how many times must I repeat myself - the harm is in the attitude and character that such activities elicit and engrain in a person. You've never heard the clichés 'talks like a truck driver', for example. There's an association between what one continuously engages in, and the type of character that they have. ....let's not get into truck drivers, you get the point.
 

DNB

Christian
I doubt they're having that much sex in a day. If it's anything like when I stripped I only had to work 2-3 nights a week and I was making more money than any of my friends (except the other strippers).
One movie alone is more than many have in a far longer period of time. Not to mention the amount of different partners. Their characters are clearly insatiable, it's not a lifestyle for the wise and prudent.
 
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