Prophecies Jesus failed to fulfill?

[Subduction Zone]

cOLTER, He was the Jewish messiah, most of them just missed him. The prophecies haven't failed. What has failed is man's understanding of the prophecies.

Again, no. You need to do more than post denials. How are you going to support your beliefs?

 

[TrueBeliever37]

Because they're the only way to know the Messiah has come at all. They're the messianic prophecies that tell you what the Messiah will do. What other criteria are you going to use and why would you?

The prophecies have been fulfilled. But some use carnal thinking in regards to spiritual prophecies, and then claim they haven't been fulfilled. For instance the temple to be rebuilt was a spiritual temple for the dwelling of the Spirit. God said in Joel 2: that in the last days he would pour out his Spirit on all flesh, and he has been doing that for a long time now. We are living stones built up a spiritual temple for the Spirit. He dwells in his people like he said he would.

 

[Rival]

The prophecies have been fulfilled. But some use carnal thinking in regards to spiritual prophecies, and then claim they haven't been fulfilled. For instance the temple to be rebuilt was a spiritual temple for the dwelling of the Spirit. God said in Joel 2: that in the last days he would pour out his Spirit on all flesh, and he has been doing that for a long time now. We are living stones built up a spiritual temple for the Spirit. He dwells in his people like he said he would.

You're just redefining words that had a well-understood meaning at the time the prophecy was given. Why is there any reason to conveniently change the definition?

 

[Colt]

cOLTER, He was the Jewish messiah, most of them just missed him. The prophecies haven't failed. What has failed is man's understanding of the prophecies.

No, Jesus is the Son of God. He realized that he couldn't live up to the rigid expectations of a Jewish Messiah as the Jews understand it. The problem isn't Jesus, the problem is those erroneous expectations.

 

[TrueBeliever37]

No, it was quite clear what he said. Honest Christian theologians have openly admitted this.

You can't afford to understand what he said.

Why don't you be specific in what you are claiming? Quote your scripture.

 

[TrueBeliever37]

No, Jesus is the Son of God. He realized that he couldn't live up to the rigid expectations of a Jewish Messiah as the Jews understand it. The problem isn't Jesus, the problem is those erroneous expectations.

Erroneous expectations is what I was talking about. But it sounds like you are saying he wasn't the Messiah. He was.

 

[TrueBeliever37]

Again, no. You need to do more than post denials. How are you going to support your beliefs?

You need to state your specifics better.

 

[Subduction Zone]

The prophecies have been fulfilled. But some use carnal thinking in regards to spiritual prophecies, and then claim they haven't been fulfilled. For instance the temple to be rebuilt was a spiritual temple for the dwelling of the Spirit. God said in Joel 2: that in the last days he would pour out his Spirit on all flesh, and he has been doing that for a long time now. We are living stones built up a spiritual temple for the Spirit. He dwells in his people like he said he would.

And this is the sort of argumentation that makes the Bible worthless.

 

[Subduction Zone]

You need to state your specifics better.

It was clear what was being talked about.

If you openly admit your error then I will be clearer.

 

[TrueBeliever37]

You're just redefining words that had a well-understood meaning at the time the prophecy was given. Why is there any reason to conveniently change the definition?

Please give the specific verses you are talking about. You just think they were well understood at the time. Pre conceived ideas - that is why the fulfillment was missed.

 

[Colt]

Erroneous expectations is what I was talking about. But it sounds like you are saying he wasn't the Messiah. He was.

He left without fulfilling the expectations of the Jewish Messiah. Also there were different schools of thought about what a Messianic figure would be and do.

The coming of the Son or deliverer had been known for ages by ancient seers and prophets. That was the basis for the development of the ideas in Judaism.

 

[Rival]

Please give the specific verses you are talking about. You just think they were well understood at the time.

Everyone at the time knew what the Temple was. There's no reason at all for the recipients of this prophecy to assume it means anything else.

 

[TrueBeliever37]

It was clear what was being talked about.

If you openly admit your error then I will be clearer.

If you are afraid to make your case, then no need to continue.

 

[Colt]

Why Don't Jews Believe In Jesus | The difference between Judaism and Christianity

 

[TrueBeliever37]

Everyone at the time knew what the Temple was. There's no reason at all for the recipients of this prophecy to assume it means anything else.

No verse given, so it's hard to discuss properly. Also, God has given many prophecies with a natural fulfillment and a spiritual fulfillment.

 

[Subduction Zone]

If you are afraid to make your case, then no need to continue.

I am not afraid. You already admitted to others that you merely stated that they were incorrect without even looking at the specific verses where your Bible failed. That is not a proper way to debate. You screwed up by jumping in late and assuming that you were right.

An honest interlocutor would do so. You appear to be just echoing Christian apologists, aka Liars for Jesus. You have bought into the lies that they have told you. But you appear to know that you cannot defend them yourself.

 

[Subduction Zone]

No verse given, so it's hard to discuss properly. Also, God has given many prophecies with a natural fulfillment and a spiritual fulfillment.

Again, we all seem to be aware of the failure that was being discussed. You claimed that we were wrong in our interpretation. You screwed up and have showed it. Admit that you are lost and we can begin again.

 

[TrueBeliever37]

He left without fulfilling the expectations of the Jewish Messiah. Also there were different schools of thought about what a Messianic figure would be and do.

The coming of the Son or deliverer had been known for ages by ancient seers and prophets. That was the basis for the development of the ideas in Judaism.

That's the problem - their expectations are wrong. Expectations based on carnal thinking, and preconceived ideas of what had to be fulfilled according to their way of thinking.

 

[TrueBeliever37]

I am not afraid. You already admitted to others that you merely stated that they were incorrect without even looking at the specific verses where your Bible failed. That is not a proper way to debate. You screwed up by jumping in late and assuming that you were right.

An honest interlocutor would do so. You appear to be just echoing Christian apologists, aka Liars for Jesus. You have bought into the lies that they have told you. But you appear to know that you cannot defend them yourself.

Seems like you are afraid to me, since you just want to argue rather than debate. State your specifics and I will defend my position.

 

[Subduction Zone]

That's the problem - their expectations are wrong. Expectations based on carnal thinking, and preconceived ideas of what had to be fulfilled according to their way of thinking.

You need more than unsupported nonsense. When you accuse others of "carnal thinking' you take on a burden of proof. How are you going to prove that?