Protesters attempt to tear down statue of Andrew Jackson in DC

[Stevicus]

Protesters try to topple Andrew Jackson statue near White House | WTOP

D.C. police said that it appeared that protesters Monday were trying to take down a statue of Andrew Jackson in a park near the White House.

D.C. police and U.S. Park Police moved demonstrators back from Lafayette Square Park, as protesters tell NBC Washington that they wanted to tear down the statue.

A line of law enforcement was formed to try to stop the protesters from gaining access to the statue, NBC Washington’s Shomari Stone told WTOP. Earlier, he said some protesters put ropes around the statue in an attempt to pull it down.

Apparently, they were trying to set up a zone similar to what they have in Seattle.

Trump is threatening them with up to 10 years in prison.

Secretary of the Interior David L. Bernhardt said in a statement, “Let me be clear: we will not bow to anarchists. Law and order will prevail, and justice will be served.”

The Interior Department also reported that the cannons surrounding the statue were destroyed.

Stone said the protesters were sprayed with something that burned their eyes.

There was also a small fire in front of St. John’s Episcopal Church that was quickly extinguished, and the letters B-H-A-Z were written on the pillars of the church, which stands for Black House Autonomous Zone, WTOP’s Dan Friedell reported.

President Donald Trump called the attempt to take down the statue and the writing on the church “disgraceful vandalism.” He said in a tweet that it’s 10 years in prison under the Veteran’s Memorial Preservation Act and said, “Beware!”

 

[Sunstone]

Hell yes, Jackson's statue should come down. Maybe not through vandalism, but it should come down. We should never have erected a statue to that mass murderer in the first place. Tear it down! And let the Cherokee do it!

And don't give me any nonsense about altering history. You don't erect statues primarily to promote history. You write history books for that. You erect statues primarily to honor people. Jackson does not deserve to be honored -- and his statue dishonors America. It dishonors every genuinely honorable American.

I'd like to see him off the Twenty, too. Replaced with Jonas Salk.

 

[SomeRandom]

Being largely unfamiliar with Mr Jackson I did a google.
Yeah...topple that *******.

 

[Secret Chief]

Being largely unfamiliar with Mr Jackson I did a google.
Yeah...topple that *******.

Me neither.
Genocide and slavery. Time to take the trash out.

 

[Stevicus]

Hell yes, Jackson's statue should come down. Maybe not through vandalism, but it should come down. We should never have erected a statue to that mass murderer in the first place. Tear it down! And let the Cherokee do it!

And don't give me any nonsense about altering history. You don't erect statues primarily to promote history. You write history books for that. You erect statues primarily to honor people. Jackson does not deserve to be honored -- and his statue dishonors America. It dishonors every genuinely honorable American.

I'd like to see him off the Twenty, too. Replaced with Jonas Salk.

I've visited the Hermitage in Tennessee; that's where Jackson is buried.

I thought they were due to take Jackson off the Twenty and have Harriet Tubman put on there.

The original plan was to have it come out this year, but for some reason, it's been delayed until 2028. Apparently, Jackson is Trump's favorite president, so he suggested putting Tubman on the $2 bill. Harriet Tubman $20 bill no longer coming in 2020: Mnuchin says redesign postponed

 

[Windwalker]

Hell yes, Jackson's statue should come down. Maybe not through vandalism, but it should come down. We should never have erected a statue to that mass murderer in the first place. Tear it down! And let the Cherokee do it!

And don't give me any nonsense about altering history. You don't erect statues primarily to promote history. You write history books for that. You erect statues primarily to honor people. Jackson does not deserve to be honored -- and his statue dishonors America. It dishonors every genuinely honorable American.

I'd like to see him off the Twenty, too. Replaced with Jonas Salk.

I was just thinking that to play to Trump's narcissism, make a bargain with him that if he makes and executive order to remove all of these monuments to America's racism, tax payers will erect a 50 foot tall statue of him in his honor in Washington D.C.

Promise him the greatest statue ever, the best, everyone will love it, etc. Tell him anything he wants to hear. Then once all the racist statues are gone, this single statue will be erected to honor his greatness. 11 photos of NYC’s naked Trump statue

 

[Revoltingest]

Removing the statue doesn't fix anything. Nay, it silences
history. We are not the Taliban. This is a wonderful opportunity
to illuminate Jackson's fanatically brutal record.
I propose an artistic solution, one which contrasts the honor
with shame....

1) The statue remains.
2) Encircle it with other smaller statues in the same style.
Each subject looks up at the larger Jackson on his horse.
- Slaves grimace in agony with backs flayed open
as a Jackson applies lash after lash to each.
- Indians stagger & collapse on the Trail Of Tears, with
a Jackson threatening each by either gun or bludgeon.
3) Interpretive info about Jackson's life & record in
government....warts & all.

I hereby offer gratis the National Park
Service my services to design this vision.

 

[Twilight Hue]

Hell yes, Jackson's statue should come down. Maybe not through vandalism, but it should come down. We should never have erected a statue to that mass murderer in the first place. Tear it down! And let the Cherokee do it!

And don't give me any nonsense about altering history. You don't erect statues primarily to promote history. You write history books for that. You erect statues primarily to honor people. Jackson does not deserve to be honored -- and his statue dishonors America. It dishonors every genuinely honorable American.

I'd like to see him off the Twenty, too. Replaced with Jonas Salk.

I was going to defend the statue for reasons that criminal activity ought not to be a means to an end, but now that you mention the Cherokee, I think I changed my mind.

It would feel real good to just let them have a proper go at it.

 

[Twilight Hue]

Removing the statue doesn't fix anything. Nay, it silences
history. We are not the Taliban. This is a wonderful opportunity
to illuminate Jackson's fanatically brutal record.
I propose an artistic solution, one which contrasts the honor
with shame....

1) The statue remains.
2) Encircle it with other smaller statues in the same style.
Each subject looks up at the larger Jackson on his horse.
- Slaves grimace in agony with backs flayed open
as a Jackson applies lash after lash to each.
- Indians stagger & collapse on the Trail Of Tears, with
a Jackson threatening each by either gun or bludgeon.
3) Interpretive info about Jackson's life & record in
government....warts & all.

I hereby offer gratis the National Park
Service my services to design this vision.

I know something really interesting? My high school history class made no mention of it other than making Jackson out to be a great American hero and a people's president.

 

[Revoltingest]

I know something really interesting? My high school history class made no mention of it other than making Jackson out to be a great American hero and a people's president.

There are rather heroic aspects to him....born into poverty, prisoner of war.
Let the statue remain so that his other 'qualities' become known.

 

[Twilight Hue]

I've visited the Hermitage in Tennessee; that's where Jackson is buried.

I thought they were due to take Jackson off the Twenty and have Harriet Tubman put on there.

The original plan was to have it come out this year, but for some reason, it's been delayed until 2028. Apparently, Jackson is Trump's favorite president, so he suggested putting Tubman on the $2 bill. Harriet Tubman $20 bill no longer coming in 2020: Mnuchin says redesign postponed

I think Harriet Tubman's image would be an amazing choice to place on our currency

 

[Windwalker]

Removing the statue doesn't fix anything. Nay, it silences
history.

No it does not. It corrects history. Glorifying the racist South with a honorific statue, is what actually silences history. It silences the reality of what it was to be a black person underneath a racist system controlled by these men.

We are not the Taliban.

To compare this with the Taliban, is ludicrous. These are not statues from antiquity. They are modern, revisionist propaganda statues, manufacturing a "nobel" history about a war whose sole purpose was the right to own other human beings.

This is a wonderful opportunity
to illuminate Jackson's fanatically brutal record.
I propose an artistic solution, one which contrasts the honor
with shame..


1) The statue remains.
2) Encircle it with other smaller statues in the same style.
Each subject looks up at the larger Jackson on his horse.
- Slaves grimace in agony with backs flayed open
as a Jackson applies lash after lash to each.
- Indians stagger & collapse on the Trail Of Tears, with
a Jackson threatening each by either gun or bludgeon.
3) Interpretive info about Jackson's life & record in
government....warts & all.

I hereby offer my services to design my vision.

But what you propose is shaming it. Removing it, and assigning it to the scrap heap of an ignoble history silences it its racist voice today (which is the point of it), without drawing attention to it. Why empower it at all?

 

[Twilight Hue]

There are rather heroic aspects to him....born into poverty, prisoner of war.
Let the statue remain so that his other 'qualities' become known.

It probably would have gone better had they had wild parties at the White House like Jackson did. They should move his statue down to the beach given his reputation as a party animal.

 

[Revoltingest]

No it does not. It corrects history. Glorifying the racist South with a honorific statue, is what actually silences history. It silences the reality of what it was to be a black person underneath a racist system controlled by these men.


To compare this with the Taliban, is ludicrous. These are not statues from antiquity. They are modern, revisionist propaganda statues, manufacturing a "nobel" history about a war whose sole purpose was the right to own other human beings.


But what you propose is shaming it. Removing it, and assigning it to the scrap heap of history silences it, without drawing attention to it. Why empower it at all?

We must agree to disagree.
Empower the Jackson statue?
Yes, you're right.
I would indeed make it a far more powerful
message....but a very different message.

Imagine that you approach the statue from a distance.
You see a larger than life Jackson, the war hero astride
his nobil & trusty steed. It just oozes bravery & patriotism.
But then as you approach, the smaller figures come into view.
You see heinous acts of brutality. He's surrounded by people
in agony & the throes of death. You read the plaques to
discover that this is Jackson's real legacy...no longer one
of honor....tis one of enormity & shame.

 

[Revoltingest]

It probably would have gone better had they had wild parties at the White House like Jackson did. They should move his statue down to the beach given his reputation as a party animal.

You're thinking of the 1400# wheel of cheese consumed in a couple hours, eh.

 

[Windwalker]

We must agree to disagree.

FYI, I absolutely despise that cliche. It's meaningless in a discussion. It's a one-sided statement that speaks for the other person, who does not "agree to disagree", whatever that really means. It's like saying all opinions are equally valid, which is a bogus claim. This is a discussion of differing opinions and weighing the weight of the arguments, not a pseudo-postmodernist kumbaya love fest.

Empower the Jackson statue?
Yes, you're right.
I would indeed make it a far more powerful
message....but a very different message.

I did see your point with it. It was creative, and I did agree that it would be effective. I just think ignoring it would be better than drawing attention to it in the first place. We don't build statues to Hitler, and then surround it with murdered Jews. We honor the victims, not the victimizers.

This is not to say as an art installment, that doesn't make a statement. But we wouldn't put that up as a permanent statue in the city. Those are generally positions of honor and respect, not intended as vehicles of public shame.

Consider the conflict between the older noble
portrayal of Jackson as hero with the new
additions which utterly demolish that nobility.

I think as perhaps an art piece it works. I do like the imagery. In a public square setting, then it would just galvanize the South and its racists causes to this very day. It's like defiling a god to them. "How dare they drag his good name through the mud, Boregard. I protest these additions that besmirch our nobel South and its nobel, but lost cause to own slaves".

 

[Revoltingest]

FYI, I absolutely despise that cliche. It's meaningless in a discussion. It's a one-sided statement that speaks for the other person, who does not "agree to disagree", whatever that really means. It's like saying all opinions are equally valid, which is a bogus claim. This is a discussion of differing opinions and weighing the weight of the arguments, not a pseudo-postmodernist kumbaya love fest.

We must agree to disagree about that.
I find it useful.
1) It ends an argument, thereby preventing descent into repetitive bickering.
2) I suggests friendly punctuation, ie, no hard feelings about disagreeing.

RF is chock full of arguments which end in hostilities.
We should avoid that.

I did see your point with it. It was creative, and I did agree that it would be effective. I just think ignoring it would be better than drawing attention to it in the first place. We don't build statues to Hitler, and then surround it with murdered Jews. We honor the victims, not the victimizers.

I'm not proposing building new statues to evildoers.
This is about how to address long standing ones which are being reconsidered.

This is not to say as an art installment, that doesn't make a statement. But we wouldn't put that up as a permanent statue in the city. Those are generally positions of honor and respect, not shame.

I propose a new view of statues, ie, one of education & shame.
Honor....I never much cared for that theme anyway.
Shame is so much more interesting & compelling.
Caersi's disgrace in the Walk Of Shame (Game Of Thrones)
really affected me. Such grisly power of that moment.

I think as perhaps an art piece it works. I do like the imagery. In a public square setting, then it would just galvanize the South and its racists causes to this very day. It's like defiling a god to them.

Detente!

 

[Stevicus]

I know something really interesting? My high school history class made no mention of it other than making Jackson out to be a great American hero and a people's president.

One point that was raised about Jackson when I visited the Hermitage was that he favored removing the requirement that a citizen own property in order to vote. As long as one was white and male, one could vote, even if one didn't own property. So, that's kind of "liberal" in a relative sense. A similar trend existed in Europe among the more liberal nationalists, who believed in social programs and good treatment for the poor within their own country, while taking the exact opposite approach towards their colonial subjects or anyone deemed "other."

We didn't have anything like the revolutions of 1848 in Europe, since Jackson and others offered the poor, landless white peasants more land, virtually free land in areas previously occupied by Natives. In Europe, they were running out of land, but in America, we had plenty of "lebensraum." It was a great deal for white people, which is why so many accepted the racist/capitalist system and all that it meant. That's why they loved Andrew Jackson so much. That's something that often gets missed, as a lot of people view racism more on an abstract level, failing to realize that people were making money off of it.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Removing the statue doesn't fix anything. Nay, it silences
history. We are not the Taliban. This is a wonderful opportunity
to illuminate Jackson's fanatically brutal record.

My great, great grandmother was Cherokee. Jackson butchered and slaughtered her people. We don't need a statue to remember that genocidal ****. We have history books, and those do keep history alive, and the do illuminate a few Jacksons grievous crimes, that today we would call violations of the Geneva Convention and heinous crimes against humanity.
Melt it down.

 

[Revoltingest]

My great, great grandmother was Cherokee. Jackson butchered and slaughtered her people. We don't need a statue to remember that genocidal ****. We have history books, and those do keep history alive, and the do illuminate a few Jacksons grievous crimes, that today we would call violations of the Geneva Convention and heinous crimes against humanity.
Melt it down.

History books...sanitized things that kids grudgingly read to survive grade school.
Then they forget after the test. History dies a forgotten death.
Statues get attention. We should use that.