Question about "answered" prayers......

[laffy_taffy]

Remember that mining accident where the miners died in that mine shaft?
I remember so many people gathering together at the churches and praying for the miners to be alive. Then, when they were told that all of the miners were alive, they all cheered and rejoiced proclaiming that "god answered our prayers." Now, hours later, when they found out that the miners were actually dead, how do they explain this?

Did god give them the "wrong answer"?

Did god give the same exact answer to all of those people who prayed? You mean to tell me that there was not one person there (even out of the clergy) who got the message from god that sorry, no, the miners were not alive and not coming home? Why did so many people get the wrong answer?

Did the people misinterpret what god's answer was? (in which case, it doesn't seem like prayer is of much use if you can't even reliably interpret the answer).

Did people really not get any answer at all from god, but were just deceiving themselves believing that god gave them an answer (which was wrong)?

Seems like "god's answer" is whatever man decides it is......

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

Weak bait. Do you have an honest question?

 

[McBell]

seems to me that is a case of "counting the hits and ignoring the misses."
Also known as Observational Selection.<---LINK

 

[laffy_taffy]

Weak bait. Do you have an honest question?

Yes, I actually had 3 honest questions about prayer in the op:

1)Did god give them the "wrong answer"?

2)Did the people misinterpret what god's answer was? (in which case, it doesn't seem like prayer is of much use if you can't even reliably interpret the answer).

3)Did people really not get any answer at all from god, but were just deceiving themselves believing that god gave them an answer (which was wrong)?

 

[Watchmen]

Part of asking God for things is the humility to accept the answer might be "no." After all, we are subject to his whims - not the other way around.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

Yes, I actually had 3 honest questions about prayer in the op: ...

On the contrary, I suspect that you had three rhetorical questions and an agenda. It's disingenuous and underwhelming.

 

[Ben Dhyan]

Seems like "god's answer" is whatever man decides it is......

Or again, it seems like man's anthropocentric concept of God is whatever man decides it is.....

 

[laffy_taffy]

Part of asking God for things is the humility to accept the answer might be "no." After all, we are subject to his whims - not the other way around.

But how do you know when his answer is "no"? As mentioned in the op, ALL of those people either were not able to interpret god's "answer", or god was wrong when his followers prayed for him to spare the miner's lives and their prayers were answered with a "yes" (which turned out to be wrong).

 

[laffy_taffy]

On the contrary, I suspect that you had three rhetorical questions and an agenda. It's disingenuous and underwhelming.

Whatever....feel free to not participate if you are so underwhelmed.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

Whatever....feel free to not participate if you are so underwhelmed.

And you feel free to be more honest. :yes:

 

[Watchmen]

But how do you know when his answer is "no"? As mentioned in the op, ALL of those people either were not able to interpret god's "answer", or god was wrong when his followers prayed for him to spare the miner's lives and their prayers were answered with a "yes" (which turned out to be wrong).

either/or fallacy

 

[laffy_taffy]

either/or fallacy

So how would you explain those people's "answer" from god? They prayed that he would spare the miners lives, and they rejoiced claiming that god answered their prayers, only to find out later that they were wrong.

 

[laffy_taffy]

And you feel free to be more honest. :yes:

I was up front about saying out of the three possible choices that I felt that it is man who decides what god's "answer" is. If anyone else can provide any other possiblities or show how we can even "know" god's answers when it is so often misinterpreted, or otherwise "wrong", etc, I would like to discuss that. Hence my op.......

 

[Watchmen]

So how would you explain those people's "answer" from god? They prayed that he would spare the miners lives, and they rejoiced claiming that god answered their prayers, only to find out later that they were wrong.

I think you just answered your own question.

 

[cardero]

Seems like "god's answer" is whatever man decides it is......

I couldn't have stated it better myself.

Watchmen writes: After all, we are subject to his whims - not the other way around.

It is not MY will that must BE done but the will and the PURPOSE of the individual BEing who has chosen a PURPOSE before incarnating into a physical existence that must BE done. Do you UNDERSTAND?

Do not BE ashamed or disappointed or regretful if your answers do not come out the way you have anticipated them. This is not the fault of GOD not caring or listening. This is the TRUTH that the prayer is not meant to BE, whether it is for you or someone else.

HELLO IT’S ME: An Interview With GOD
Chapter: The Purpose Of Prayer
Pg: 379, 380, 383

 

[laffy_taffy]

I think you just answered your own question.

But what good is it when people will misinterpret an "answer" from god anyway? The families of the miners rejoiced and praised god that he answered their prayers and spared the lives of the miners. How could they have been so wrong in misunderstanding god's answer? Or did god actually give them the (wrong) answer of "yes, their lives will be spared", and then they all ended up dead despite his answer?

What good is it to pray to god to ask for direction in life such as: Should I take this job in New York, or should I give my baby up for adoption, or whatever important decision you might pray on, only to not be able to interpret god's "answer"?

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

I was up front about saying out of the three possible choices that I felt that it is man who decides what god's "answer" is.

I suspect that your agenda is argument, not investigation. What would have been "up front" would have been to say: "The following demonstrates the worthlessness of prayer: ..."

Parenthetically, I also suspect that there is value in focus, articulation and surrender.

 

[laffy_taffy]

I suspect that your agenda is argument, not investigation. What would have been "up front" would have been to say: "The following demonstrates the worthlessness of prayer: ..."

Parenthetically, I also suspect that there is value in focus, articulation and surrender.

Why don't you address the actual questions rather than waste so much time posting post after post after post in a thread that you are so "underwhelmed" by?

The miners families rejoiced and praised god specifically for answering their prayers. The problem here is, that god's "answer" did not match up with the reality of what happened. How do you explain this?

 

[Heneni]

Pray 'your will be done' then get exited about it. Cause that is the only prayer god will answer.

Sometimes he tells us what his will is, and we pray his will and MAN its great when it happens then. But most of the time we dont know his specific will for a situation like what happened at the mine so we pray 'your will be done' and rejoice in the outcome. False hope breaks people's heart. That is why it is so important to never assume gods will. Put your hopes up on a wrong assumption and then loose trust in god because he seemingly does not answer our prayers. Any prayer that god does not answer, HAS to have been out of his will. He answers his own requests.

heneni

 

[Heneni]

I also have to add, that timing is important. Jesus has unanswered prayers. He prayed that we all be with him, and we are not all there ....yet.

Heneni