Questions for creationists who ‘understand evolution’?

[Thief]

Really?
As if you were in any position to tell the difference between truth and your dogma...

Position?
Any third party reading this?

 

[McBell]

Position?
Any third party reading this?

I have often wondered who it is you are actually trying to convince, those you preach at or yourself.

 

[tumbleweed41]

No one said that.
In fact, biological evolution has nothing to do with the belief in supernatural spirit.

And yes....your biology has everything to do with your spirit.

Really. Do you have the biological research to back this claim up?

Or are you trying to draw us off the subject of how little about biological evolution you actually know?

And you think a biology study is needed to support my previous post?

Yes, I do. You're the one who made the claim.
Unless you are conceding the claim is based purely on faith?

 

[Thief]

Yes, I do. You're the one who made the claim.
Unless you are conceding the claim is based purely on faith?

And spirit of course is a matter of faith.....
and faith needs no proving.

Did you look in the mirror yet?
Did you call yourself an accident?

Prove otherwise?

 

[micrurus]

And spirit of course is a matter of faith.....
and faith needs no proving.

of course it needs no proving, faith is all about unfalsifiable hypotheses, theres no difference between a person who has faith in a spirit and a person who has faith in unicorns.

Did you look in the mirror yet?
Did you call yourself an accident?

Prove otherwise?

how is being an accident an argument against evolution? its not untrue just because it makes you feel less special.

 

[Thief]

of course it needs no proving, faith is all about unfalsifiable hypotheses, theres no difference between a person who has faith in a spirit and a person who has faith in unicorns.




how is being an accident an argument against evolution? its not untrue just because it makes you feel less special.

There was no offereing against evolution.
Back up and read my postings.

I believe in evolution.
I believe in God.

God did it.

Evolution and disbelief in God makes you an accident.
Look in the mirror.
Do you really think so?

 

[McBell]

There was no offereing against evolution.
Back up and read my postings.

I believe in evolution.
I believe in God.

God did it.

Evolution and disbelief in God makes you an accident.
Look in the mirror.
Do you really think so?

Your transference is showing.
believe it or not there are some people who do not need god to feel good about themselves, or to be good people, or even to have a purpose.

Just because you feel you have to have a god in order to feel important, and or be a good person, and or have a purpose, does not mean that everyone else has to.

 

[Thief]

Your transference is showing.
believe it or not there are some people who do not need god to feel good about themselves, or to be good people, or even to have a purpose.

Just because you feel you have to have a god in order to feel important, and or be a good person, and or have a purpose, does not mean that everyone else has to.

You keep transferring yourself on this and then fail to see it.

I don't care how you feel about it.

Have you looked in the mirror?
Are you an accident?

 

[McBell]

You keep transferring yourself on this and then fail to see it.

I don't care how you feel about it.

Have you looked in the mirror?
Are you an accident?

Poor poor thief.
Forever stuck in his merry go round dogma...

I can almost feel sorry for you.

 

[Thief]

Poor poor thief.
Forever stuck in his merry go round dogma...

I can almost feel sorry for you.

Aren't you the one to say so!

 

[tumbleweed41]

Prove otherwise?

 

[Thief]

Empty retort....
and you won't answer because?

saying you are an accident takes away your belief in a higher being...
and you will end when your chemistry fails.

or...
to say you have a form intended by a higher being...
and then have to deal with Something else.... on His terms?

 

[tumbleweed41]

saying you are an accident takes away your belief in a higher being...
and you will end when your chemistry fails.

or...
to say you have a form intended by a higher being...
and then have to deal with Something else.... on His terms?

Or...
I am one of many current results of a process started over 13 billion years ago.


(Your "prove otherwise" is an meaningless challenge.)

 

[Thief]

Or...
I am one of many current results of a process started over 13 billion years ago.


(Your "prove otherwise" is an meaningless challenge.)

It was altogether important.

Not much point in having the results of a '13 billion year' experiment...
only to have those results crumble to dust.

 

[tumbleweed41]

It was altogether important.

Not much point in having the results of a '13 billion year' experiment...
only to have those results crumble to dust.

So, your concerned more with finding meaning for your life than the actual biology of evolution.

 

[micrurus]

It was altogether important.

Not much point in having the results of a '13 billion year' experiment...
only to have those results crumble to dust.

so, you pick and chose your beliefs based on that which makes you fell special?

 

[darkendless]

It was altogether important.

Not much point in having the results of a '13 billion year' experiment...
only to have those results crumble to dust.

But they don't. The only people who can find something wrong with scientific methods who are not experts in their respective fields are people with irritating religious agendas who come up with some creationist website retort and then block their ears to being corrected.

 

[FDRC2014]

Haven't made a choice yet?

If you say chemistry begets spirit then you are the sum of your chemistry.
All that you are fails when your chemistry fails.

The spirit in you...the part of you reading this....will dissipate as if you were never born.
Body goes in the box.
Dust you are dust you will be.

If you say spirit first....
Then some consideration is to be made toward Something greater than yourself.

I remember having a similar feeling to what you are describing.
When i was younger and started to become sceptical about farther christmas (Santa). I remember thinking, well, if he is real and I chose to think he isn't, then i don't get any presents, but if he is fake and i think he is real, then there is nothing to lose.

This is a very valid point, believing in something, just because the alternative is negative.

Though, after indubitable evidence presents its self that santa is not real (well at least he didn't but the presents there), then i no longer have a need to believe. And yes, he could still be real and i am in denial, but this is unlikely and i would prefer to base my thoughts on sound evidence, as i am sure you do regarding santa.

 

[FDRC2014]

Your questions remind me of the question "How long has it been since you stopped beating your wife?"

Oh dear, oh dear.
I think you are ignorant towards biology.

Science has confirmed that life appeared suddenly, that different animals and plants appeared fully formed, and have not morphed into some other creature.

I would like to see your sources, as this is not true. Evolution does happen at different rates, but not in 6 days.

Neither the fossil record nor extensive experimentation support the idea of 'natural selection' ...

The fossil record and extensive experimental evidence support evolution. Which is different from natural selection. Natural selection is supported by, firstly, the result (i.e. the fact evolution has/is taking place); also non-natural selection; mathematical models; and obviously logic. This is the means in which evolution took place. It was one of two hypothesis, which was proven correct a number of years ago. Also it can be tested in the lab using bacteria.

...nor of mutations being beneficial as the mechanism for supposed 'speciation'.

Well, you are wrong. Mutations can be beneficial, tell that to an MRSA bacteria! As i have said in another post, it is clear our trichromatic vision has evolved form mutated (duplicated then mutated), monochromatic genes. I am sure you can appreciate the different morphological effects a mutation can have on a person, and the fact mutations take place. Also, another example of a beneficial mutation (remember a mutation is only beneficial for a set environment), would be the sickle cell anaemia mutation. Although in the western world this would be a disadvantage, in areas of malaria, if you are a carrier, you are immune from malaria. Therefore in africa, the sickle cell allele has a high frequency. This is a single base mutation, just one adenine swapping to a thymine, and it has this effect!
Regarding speciation. This requires some sort of separation of the species. Then the two niches evolve the species differently. For example species A is the common ancestor (say a deer like animal), and a mountain range forms and half of species A migrates north, and half migrate south. Say the south side is warmer and the north is cooler. So the species A on the north benefit slight mutations in hair length, this produces the species with longer hair, while those on the south don't. Since they have been separated, their genetics change until they can no longer interbreed, hence a new species is formed.

Mutations have been described as being like sticking a screwdriver into a [computer] or other complex machine. How often will such 'accidents' improve the performance of such a complex entity.

No. A mutation is not like this. This would be like burning the cells, or sticking them in acid (or the like), and hoping for a mutation. This is a very bad analogy. I would more compare it to randomly changing the letter in a code of a website and hoping for an improvement. For example you could change the code which makes the text appear very small (a bad mutation), or one that makes the colour aesthetically pleasing (a good mutation, e.g. camouflage).

In short, the ToE relies on scientific speculation and imagination, sleight of hand, propaganda, and outright dishonesty to convince rather than scientific evidence.

Sorry, are you talking about religion there?
Scientific speculation - To a degree, but this is speculating a hypothesis, not a theory. Evolution by natural selection is a theory, therefore proven by evidence (Learn your scientific definitions, it's one of the questions).
imagination - Hmm, well yes, it was imagined, but so was the laws of gravity. Just because something is imagined doesn't make it wrong (nor right!).
Slight of hand - hmm, not sure exactly what you are getting at here. Nothing magical!
propaganda - well, i suppose you can class a scientific journal as propaganda, but as is arguably anything. None are as bias with a lack of evidence as the bible or other such religious text. It is based upon strong evidence many papers and books can support (you don't know the evidence, as clearly demonstrated by your ignorant statements).
Outright dishonesty to convince rather than scientific evidence - well, you can take a look at the evidence, and spend your entire life and career analysing it. Then tell me evolution doesn't happen, but up until then you have to rely on accurate summaries of the evidence.

The evidence is here for evolution.
Please comment further...

 

[FDRC2014]

And spirit of course is a matter of faith.....
and faith needs no proving.

Did you look in the mirror yet?
Did you call yourself an accident?

Prove otherwise?

I suppose it is very convenient that faith needs no proving.

If i were to say "I believe there is no god", and i have undoubtable faith in this then the opposite view also needs no proving. Only one can be correct.
Obviously this is not an atheist view.

I hope you have seen Dawkins ted talk on atheism, here he presented some made up scientific articles. You would never see one that just said, Dr Huxain has faith that bla bla bla. No evidence.
What is the point of god then?

Anyway, I look in the mirror, I look out my eyes, and all I see is one big chance.

Its not a mistake, to have a mistake you have to have the ability not to make one.

I.e. if you drop a box or marbles and some of them form a certain pattern, its not a mistake, it just happens.

That is how I look at my self. Very privileged.

Just as i don't look at evaporating water, and think, oh look, a mistake.