Racist memes spread after false claims that immigrants kill and eat pets.

[Rival]

Example from one of your posts...
"But this doesn't mean animal sacrifice isn't happening and some may well be taking pets because there are lunatics or cultural differences everywhere."

Animal sacrifice isn't the issue.
It's Trump's unfounded claim of stealing & eating pets
for the purpose of demonizing immigrants (except for
his wife).
Your making it about animal sacrifice existing to some
unknown extent is a diversion from that issue.
You don't even know who's doing animal sacrifices.
How often they're doing it. Nor do you make this
relevant to politics.
Moreover, this intellectual slight of hand will increase
enmity against immigrants, & be seen by Magas as
justification to re-elect a treasonous felonious rapist.

I know who is doing them, thank you.

Jesus why is everyone here so aggressive.

Some immigrants are bad. Will anyone so much as admit that? It sounds as though no immigrant can ever be immoral.

In one post I said the media and politics has blown this out of proportion but if even one pet were stolen as a sacrifice that would easily blow up.

That is what I meant.

But some of you guys are so hell bent on just NOPE IT NEVER HAPPENED NOT EVEN ONCE AND SOME FOLKS PERHAPS JUMPED ON IT that a conversation is impossible.

It's like you don't know how humans work. If something happens once it is often treated as though it happened a thousand times.

But I give up. You are all just impossible and very defensive.

It's like you all want absolute proof instead of a rational argument as to why it could have happened.

 

[Revoltingest]

I know who is doing them, thank you.

I asked for evidence.
Your posts provided none.

Jesus why is everyone here so aggressive.

This would include your posts to me.

Some immigrants are bad.

What is the purpose of stating such
a fact, except to demonize them all?
It appears to be prevarication.

I could pick any poster here, & say to all
that they could possibly be a child rapist.
This possibility is also a fact. But it
suggests something evil, making it a
dishonest attack upon them.

Will anyone so much as admit that?

I will, since you insist.
But it's a mischievous ploy to imply
that it even needed to be "admitted".

It sounds as though no immigrant can ever be immoral.

Your posts supporting Trump make it
sound as though immigrants are all
dangerous criminals.

In one post I said the media and politics has blown this out of proportion but if even one pet were stolen as a sacrifice that would easily blow up.

You've not shown that it even happened
once. Yet your posts give it credibility by
the saying it's possible.

That is what I meant.

But some of you guys are so hell bent on just NOPE IT NEVER HAPPENED NOT EVEN ONCE AND SOME FOLKS PERHAPS JUMPED ON IT that a conversation is impossible.

That's a falsehood.
First, I am not "you guys". I am individual
who is responsible only for my own posts.
No one else's.
Second, no one I've seen has said that.
Could you provide a quote from someone?

It's like you don't know how humans work.

An ironic claim from one
carrying Trump's water.

If something happens once it will is often treated as though it happened a thousand times.

You' posts haven't provided the requested
evidence....only personal attacks.

But I give up. You are all just impossible and very defensive.

That just broke my irony meter.

Please, stick to the issues, & don't make
the arguments personal. We have rules
Tis best to honor them.

 

[Rival]

I asked for evidence.
You provided none.

This would include your posts to me.

What is the purpose of stating such
a fact, except to demonize them all?
It's prevarication.

I could pick any poster here, & say to all
that they could possibly be a child rapist.
This possibility is also a fact. But it
suggests something evil, making it a
dishonest attack upon them.

I will, since you insist.
But it's a dishonest game to imply
that it even needed to be "admitted".


Your posts supporting Trump make it
sound as though immigrants are all
dangerous criminals.

You've not shown that it even happened
once. Yet you give it credibility by the
tactic of saying it's possible.

That's a falsehood.
First, I am not "you guys".
Second, no one I've seen has said that.
Could you provide a quote from someone?

An ironic claim from someone
carrying Trump's water.

You've yet to provide the evidence
I asked for. All your posts have
offered is personal attacks.

You just broke my irony meter.

Please, stick to the issues, & don't make
the arguments personal. We have rules
Honor them.

Do you understand how hypotheticsls work and the type of logical argument I was making?

Because it sounds as though you are looking for absolute proof.

I made a case for the way it could possibly have happened and the response was a unanimous 'nope'.

As though my argument were flawed. It's not.

But when the news article appears you'll all suddenly change your minds. I think that is what you want.

I gave you a philosophical argument as to how it could have happened.

The response that was not aggressive should have been more like 'Yeah that could have happened but I don't think it did.'

So tired of this garbage.

 

[Revoltingest]

Do you understand how hypotheticsls work and the type of logical argument I was making?

Yes. But your posts appear designed
to give credence to Trump's false claims.
You've shown no evidence that any pets
were stolen for sacrifice or sustenance.

Because it sounds as though you are looking for absolute proof.

I asked for evidence.
That should sound like a request for evidence, not
"absolute proof". If I'd wanted absolute proof, I'd
have requested "absolute proof". Did you see
those words in my post?

I made a case for the way it could possibly have happened.....

For what purpose?

....and the response was a unanimous 'nope'.

When you say "the response", is this
to imply it was my response? Otherwise,
I can't speak for every other poster's
every post on the topic. Please address
my posts when posting to me.

As though my argument were flawed. It's not.

Your argument about animal sacrifice is
irrelevant to the claim that immigrants
are stealing pets to eat or sacrifice.

But when the news article appears you'll all suddenly change your minds. I think that is what you want.

What news article are you referring to?
I asked for evidence. Why suggest it's
there, but not provide it?

I gave you a philosophical argument as to how it could have happened.

To what end?
Are you aware that specious claims about
immigrant criminality causes them harm,
foments hatred, & even risks lives?

The response that was not aggressive should have been more like 'Yeah that could have happened but I don't think it did.'

So tired of this garbage.

RF is a tough place for sensitive souls.
I won't walk on eggs just to spare feelings
when I see injustice being enabled.

 

[Revoltingest]

=== Notice to all ===
Earlier today, I warned that tonite I'd be
back to my PC & strong internet connection.
No more posting from a phone in the wilds
of Colorado.
I warned that it would be "flame on".
Let women, children, & small animals take care.
Fur will fly.

 

[Revoltingest]

No one should support such unfounded bigoted claims.
No one should vote for a treasonous felonious rapey lunatic.

 

[RestlessSoul]

No. I'm sick of this. I can't have a meaningful discourse with half the people on here because even when I present a logical argument it's ignored.

So no I won't calm down I'm ****ing sick of this.

Pets are stolen every day for cash, what makes this any different?

Trump said it. That's it. Now it's partisan.

Tbf, 'Trump said it' is a pretty good reason to take it with a large pinch of salt - whatever 'it' is.

 

[Rival]

Tbf, 'Trump said it' is a pretty good reason to take it with a large pinch of salt - whatever 'it' is.

It's this kind of thinking that's problematic.

 

[Rival]

Yes. But your posts appear designed
to give credence to Trump's false claims.
You've shown no evidence that any pets
were stolen for sacrifice or sustenance.

I asked for evidence.
That should sound like a request for evidence, not
"absolute proof". If I'd wanted absolute proof, I'd
have requested "absolute proof". Did you see
those words in my post?

For what purpose?

When you say "the response", is this
to imply it was my response? Otherwise,
I can't speak for every other poster's
every post on the topic. Please address
my posts when posting to me.

Your argument about animal sacrifice is
irrelevant to the claim that immigrants
are stealing pets to eat or sacrifice.


What news article are you referring to?
I asked for evidence. Why suggest it's
there, but not provide it?

To what end?
Are you aware that specious claims about
immigrant criminality causes them harm,
foments hatred, & even risks lives?

RF is a tough place for sensitive souls.
I won't walk on eggs just to spare feelings
when I see injustice being enabled.

It sounds as though you are more worried about immigrants and have some investment in this. As though just pointing stuff out that could have happened is bad of itself. That sounds like your problem, not mine.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

There is something about sharing the sacrifice with everyone else, and so some Corinthians probably are concerned that eating resold meat from a Roman temple might be like sacrificing to the gods. Paul seems to think that its merely meat nothing magical about it and a way to get a discount, but he says not to do it around "Weak" Christians. I presume he means anyone that might misinterpret your actions or who might still miss going to the old temple festivities -- whatever he means by weak.

It's reasonable to assume he meant vegetarians as a part of that, given he did say those who only eat vegetables are weak, and ties it to faith (Romans 14:2)

But some of you guys are so hell bent on just NOPE IT NEVER HAPPENED NOT EVEN ONCE AND SOME FOLKS PERHAPS JUMPED ON IT that a conversation is impossible.

There is no evidence it happened. It's run of the mill xenophobia where even if something happened they still embellish it to make it seem worse than it is. Amd then they insist that because news media and government officials aren't discussing what they think happened it automatically means the "truth" is being covered up (just wait, that one is likely gonna happen soon with this as well).
But this one is as outlandish amd bigoted and false as baby eating Jews.

It's this kind of thinking that's problematic.

Windmills cause cancer. Bleach and light can "knock out covid" and maybe doctors can look into putting those in us.Crime is down all over the world but here. He's young and has big hands.
Trump has given the world reason to doubt his claims until demonstrated accurate.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

To what end?
Are you aware that specious claims about
immigrant criminality causes them harm,
foments hatred, & even risks lives?

Yes. This is why it is important to not let such hateful lies live unchallenged. Making up demonizing stories about outsiders is at least as old as our species. And it frequently gets people hurt, often killed and occasionally it leads to genocide.
These lies are dangerous and must be challenged, balked and thwarted--intolerated--in order to preserve peace, stability and the rule of law.

 

[Twilight Hue]

Haitian is a nationality not a race.

No one is demonizing Trump except Trump himself His constant use of fear mongering, his campaign adds about murderous immigrants and the demented rant about immigrants abducting pets to eat are all there to get out the racist vote. Or are we going to pretend that it is the millions of illegal criminal and mental patients that are secretly producing producing his racist campaign commercials and somehow forcing him to make bigoted rants?

Haitian is the term being thrown around here so make sure that term is continually repeated over and over regardless.

 

[Argentbear]

Haitian is the term being thrown around here so make sure that term is continually repeated over and over regardless.

as should his nutball claim that immigrants are abducing pets to eat.

 

[anna.]

Yes. This is why it is important to not let such hateful lies live unchallenged. Making up demonizing stories about outsiders is at least as old as our species. And it frequently gets people hurt, often killed and occasionally it leads to genocide.
These lies are dangerous and must be challenged, balked and thwarted--intolerated--in order to preserve peace, stability and the rule of law.

No surprise they were spread and amplified via social media. Demonization is indeed been part of the human experience, but never before social media have lies and rumors had access to such an instant and pervasive bullhorn.

 

[Pogo]

No. I'm sick of this. I can't have a meaningful discourse with half the people on here because even when I present a logical argument it's ignored.

So no I won't calm down I'm ****ing sick of this.

Pets are stolen every day for cash, what makes this any different?

Trump said it. That's it. Now it's partisan.

You do realize that this thread was not about hypothetical pet theft scenarios, It is about the racist/xenophobic memes being spread by right wing influencers and picked up by Republican candidates to use in their attacks on immigrants and the non-white?
Here is a statement from the father of the child who was killed most unfortunately in Springfield last year.

Father of Ohio boy, 11, tells Trump and Vance to stop using son’s death for ‘political gain’​

The father of an 11-year-old boy who was killed last year when a minivan driven by an immigrant from Haiti collided with his school bus has asked Donald Trump and JD Vance to stop using his son’s name for “political gain”.

During a city commission meeting on Tuesday in Springfield, Ohio, Nathan Clark, the father of Aiden Clark, addressed the forum alongside his wife, Danielle. Speaking at the meeting, Clark said: “I wish that my son, Aiden Clark, was killed by a 60-year-old white man. I bet you never thought anyone would say something so blunt, but if that guy killed my 11-year-old son, the incessant group of hate-spewing people would leave us alone,” the Springfield News-Sun reports.

Or are you going to continue with stories about Pakis and Towel heads maybe

 

[fantome profane]

Democrats ought to keep reminding people everwhere that they are Haitians, and to make sure they use the word Haitian as many times as possible, and to keep them categorized as Haitian because by doing so, you can use their race to demonize Trump and win the Democratic election!

Mwen se ayisyen!

 

[Daemon Sophic]

Honestly this dog piling is unfair.

Why do you guys do this.

Can you respond with logic instead of this.

Oh come now. Logic is being utilized by most of your responders.

It is your own baseless conjecture that is bringing others to illuminate you.


It is not usually referred to as "dog piling" when one person (you) tries to defend a fantastical statement sans proof, and many people who are accustomed to evidence, reason, and honesty all come back to challenge your claims (along with the claims you are trying to defend).
Usually that is called "being countered with overwhelming evidence".

And the sane mind reviews the wave of facts and reasoning -- carefully weighs it, while always harkening to reason and a basic comprehension of human nature (both good and bad) -- and as needed, changes their inner viewpoint away from supporting the proven falsehood, and over to accepting (hopefully graciously) the reality of what is.
IF however, the first speaker somehow concludes that 'No', I have always been speaking the truth, and my many evidence-wielding advisors are all misled; THEN the speaker is welcome to bring their own EVIDENCE to the table, and demonstrate WITH FACTS (and NOT conjecture) that what they are defending is indeed reality, while further demonstrating where the advisors were factually incorrect.
This is how a reasonable debate ensues.



.

So, let's review. Shall we?​

Your first post from page 1 (of this thread about the righties spreading lies about immigrants stealing and eating dogs and cats in Ohio)
is an attempt at reasoning why immigrants would be doing this thing that is definitely illegal and immoral, and to many Americans unthinkably viscerally disturbing. You rapidly advance from there, stating matter-of-factly that some pets probably ARE being stolen and consumed by immigrants in Springfield OH.
You have yet to acknowledge that there is no evidence at all, from any authority in Springfield or elsewhere, that pets are actually being captured and consumed by anyone, let alone by immigrants. Your posts are, at best, conjecture. Although, if you listen to yourself while considering the baser instincts of humanity, your posts are undeniably racist 'dog-whistles'.

You are aware of that term, aren't you?​

To top off your insults to the logical and fact-based, you take the 'Oh woe is me' stance of "this is unfair", "I'm just being logical", "if only your little pack minds could comprehend my grand vistas."
This is why you are being advised against your fantasies, with logic and evidence.
Overall, your "logic" as well as your understanding of history and human nature are all frail; and your sight, like that of an old carriage horse, seems to have blinders on it.
But don't worry. We Americans expect that from the British.

 

[SkepticThinker]

Because some probably are.

*Missing citation.

It's perfectly possible. I don't know either way but given some of their religious practices it's not a leap to assume some folks may be taking pets from the streets for sacrifice.

You just told us that a South American cultures sacrifices (and possible eat) birds. (Us North Americans tend to eat a lot of birds too, especially around Thanksgiving and Christmas). Those who live on farms even kill the birds themselves!

You've now somehow extended that to "some" Haitians in Springfield, Ohio are "probably" stealing peoples dogs and cats and eating them?


Whaa?

 

[SkepticThinker]

Step 1. Some people sacrifice animals

Step 2. Those people move to a country not known for animal sacrifice.

Step 3. They cannot easily access animals for sacrifice.

Step 4. They steal some.

It may not be happening, but the logical argument as to why it might be works.

Does anyone disagree?

"Logical" arguments aren't evidence.
They're arguments.

For instance, how did you get from Step 3 to Step 4?
And as I asked in my last post, how did we get from "sacrificing birds" to "maybe" stealing dogs and cats from peoples' backyards and eating them?

 

[icehorse]

Trump, JD Vance repeat baseless claim Haitian immigrants are eating pets as Ohio officials say there is no evidence

The viral claim about Haitian immigrants in Springfield, Ohio, has garnered millions of views on X, and former President Donald Trump repeated it in the debate.

www.cbsnews.com

It seems the right is doubling down even after local police claimed there was no evidence to support the accusations.

Yes but...

As a centrist I agree the far right is a problem in many ways. full stop.

But the far left is also a problem. Many on the far left make racism THE MOST IMPORTANT THING !! And it's just not. And over-the-top, far left activism on racism just feeds into what the far right does, AND it turns off many centrists.