Religious Nationalism in the US

[The Hammer]

'More than half of Republicans support Christian nationalism, according to a new survey"

This sounds like a terrible terrible position for the US to currently be in. We are not and have never been a "Christian Nation".

https://www.npr.org/2023/02/14/1156...rt-christian-nationalism-according-to-a-new-s


Do you support religious nationalism? If so, why? If not, why?

 

[Secret Chief]

No. Can go hand in hand with fascism.

 

[Wildswanderer]

This sounds like a terrible terrible position for the US to currently be in. We are not and have never been a "Christian Nation".

Wrong. We certainly were in principle, not always in practice.

 

[The Hammer]

Wrong. We certainly were in principle, not always in practice.

Wrong. Our founding fathers were far from Christian.

Deists mostly, a few Freemasons, etc. Nothing in our Constitution, or laws imply we are a Christian Nation.

 

[The Hammer]

Wrong. We certainly were in principle, not always in practice.

For instance.


"The Treaty of Tripoli announced clearly and succinctly to the world that “the Government of the United States of America is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion.” The document was initiated by George Washington, signed by John Adams, and ratified unanimously by the Senate,...".

America is not a Christian nation. The Founding Fathers said so

 

[Wildswanderer]

Wrong. Our founding fathers were far from Christian.

Deists mostly, a few Freemasons, etc. Nothing in our Constitution, or laws imply we are a Christian Nation.

Wrong. They were almost all biblical Christians... Anyone who has read their writings at any length knows this.

 

[Wildswanderer]

For instance.


"The Treaty of Tripoli announced clearly and succinctly to the world that “the Government of the United States of America is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion.” The document was initiated by George Washington, signed by John Adams, and ratified unanimously by the Senate,...".

America is not a Christian nation. The Founding Fathers said so

Nobody said it was founded on religion. It was founded on Christian principles.

 

[metis]

Do you support religious nationalism? If so, why? If not, why?

I truly think that is truly sick and on more than one basis, such as it is ignoring the rights of those in other religions or in none.

It reminds me of when Gandhi was asked what he thought of "western civilization", and his answer was "I think they should try it".

 

[Kenny]

Wrong. Our founding fathers were far from Christian.

Deists mostly, a few Freemasons, etc. Nothing in our Constitution, or laws imply we are a Christian Nation.

Wrong, most were Christian.

 

[metis]

Wrong, most were Christian.

So?

Many of them came here to get away from religious tyranny, so now we are to have it here?

 

[The Hammer]

Nobody said it was founded on religion. It was founded on Christian principles.

Not really no. We were founded on humane principles which Christianity does not have a monopoly on.

We were not founded on Christian principles or religion as per my post about the treaty of tripoli.

 

[Wildswanderer]

So?

Many of them came here to get away from religious tyranny, so now we are to have it here?

Says who?

 

[Wildswanderer]

Not really no. We were founded on humane principles which Christianity does not have a monopoly on.

We were not founded on Christian principles or religion as per my post about the treaty of tripoli.

I suggest you actually read the founding fathers.

 

[Twilight Hue]

'More than half of Republicans support Christian nationalism, according to a new survey"

This sounds like a terrible terrible position for the US to currently be in. We are not and have never been a "Christian Nation".

https://www.npr.org/2023/02/14/1156...rt-christian-nationalism-according-to-a-new-s


Do you support religious nationalism? If so, why? If not, why?

I support Nationalism definitely.

I think this is a Christian based nation, the history reflects that, but definitely not a Christian nation.

 

[metis]

We werev not founded on Christian principles or religion as per my post about the treaty of tripoli.

Ya, and I gotta feeling that having slaves live in deplorable conditions and killing Amerindians and Brits would have been very high on Jesus' list of things we should be doing.

 

[sun rise]

The fact that the founders were by and large Christian is not the point. "Christian Nationalism" is something quite different. Using the term as some Christians define it, I'm eliminated from being a true American because I'm not a Christian. Christianity Today: What Is Christian Nationalism?

I'm utterly opposed to giving any one religion a "privileged position" in America and especially not Protestantism to boot. The founders set the pattern as others have noted with the Treaty of Tripoli and in other writings. This is no different in principle from the Taliban in Afghanistan - only in degree. Further it changes "all men are created equal" to "Christians are more equal than others"

What is Christian nationalism?


Christian nationalism is the belief that the American nation is defined by Christianity, and that the government should take active steps to keep it that way. Popularly, Christian nationalists assert that America is and must remain a “Christian nation”—not merely as an observation about American history, but as a prescriptive program for what America must continue to be in the future. Scholars like Samuel Huntington have made a similar argument: that America is defined by its “Anglo-Protestant” past and that we will lose our identity and our freedom if we do not preserve our cultural inheritance.

Christian nationalists do not reject the First Amendment and do not advocate for theocracy, but they do believe that Christianity should enjoy a privileged position in the public square. The term “Christian nationalism,” is relatively new, and its advocates generally do not use it of themselves, but it accurately describes American nationalists who believe American identity is inextricable from Christianity.

 

[lewisnotmiller]

Wrong. Our founding fathers were far from Christian.

Deists mostly, a few Freemasons, etc. Nothing in our Constitution, or laws imply we are a Christian Nation.

Broadly you could split the Founding Fathers into three groups.

'Pure' deists, who were basically religious skeptics, such as Paine. Christians (Protestants, really) like Samuel Adams. And those that had somewhat of a boot in each camp, still Christians but with a somewhat more material view of the value Christianity had, like John Adams and James Monroe.

Discussions about 'how Christian the Founders were' often comes down to how you view this last group, since they were (at least) nominally Christian, but they often separated the wisdom of Jesus, the importance of religious community in social terms, and the various miracles and supernatural claims of the Bible.

That last group is pretty broad if you compared Washington to Franklin, for example.

Anyway, the more interesting thing to me is that a group containing Paine, Adams, Locke and Franklin were able to agree enough on the preferred direction for the Nation that they could combine their thoughts in a (mostly) coherent way.

That seems like a clear lesson on how a plural society can be managed.

 

[The Hammer]

I suggest you actually read the founding fathers.

You too.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Do you support religious nationalism? If so, why? If not, why?

This isn't religious, it is Christian Nationalism. There is no room for Jews, Muslims, Buddhists, Hindus, any sort of Pagan or any other religion in their proper society.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

The fact that the founders were by and large Christian is not the point.

But most of the ones people can name were definitely not, like Jefferson, Franklin, Madison, probably Washington and very definitely Paine.