Right to Die

[Draka]

Inspired by the Consequences of Suicide thread I thought I'd pose more specific questions. In some places there are laws concerning the right to die for terminally ill patients. What are your personal feelings on terminating life when one is already going to die? And how do you think your faith plays into your position? Does it? Does your religion have a stance on it at all?

 

[Unveiled Artist]

Inspired by the Consequences of Suicide thread I thought I'd pose more specific questions. In some places there are laws concerning the right to die for terminally ill patients. What are your personal feelings on terminating life when one is already going to die? And how do you think your faith plays into your position? Does it? Does your religion have a stance on it at all?

Yes. My religion has a stance that life is valued. We cannot live as Buddhas if we take lives. I would be conflicted because if my loved one wanted me to let her die it is not My say nor My religion that should interfer with her choice. I would disagree and let another family member do so. Just because I quote on quote let it happen, doesnt mean I support it nor would I do so myself.

If I were dying in pain, I am sure I would feel the same way. Just because I feel the need to do so/feel the same in pain that does not make it right.

 

[Erebus]

Inspired by the Consequences of Suicide thread I thought I'd pose more specific questions. In some places there are laws concerning the right to die for terminally ill patients. What are your personal feelings on terminating life when one is already going to die? And how do you think your faith plays into your position? Does it? Does your religion have a stance on it at all?

When it comes to assisted suicide under the circumstances you describe, my stance is probably best explained through a real-life example.
I had a dog who developed leukemia, he was in a lot of pain and clearly wasn't enjoying his life any more. He wouldn't eat, he barely drank, he couldn't go for walks or play with his toys. In the end, we all agreed that the kind thing to do would be to have him put down. It was an awful decision to have to make, anybody who's owned a dog can tell you they aren't just pets, they become a part of your family. Even so, I feel better knowing we didn't force a lingering death on him. I have also had human family who weren't so lucky.

 

[The Emperor of Mankind]

I see the fact that people oppose assisted dying while supporting reducing the pain of animals - whether in the food preparation process (stunned slaughter) or putting a family pet to sleep because it's in constant and terminal agony - as a matter of great cognitive dissonance. As a Pagan, I believe we're a part of nature and that humans, by dint of being human, are not inherently superior or more valuable than other species. So why do we force people to continue to live through the final days of painful conditions which will kill them while relieving the suffering of animals undergoing their own torture?

 

[jeager106]

Animals being "put down" is NOT even close to assisting a human by helping to kill a human.
Modern human medicine can at least make someone who is dying in great pain feel
less pain and be made more comfortable.
It's what humans do for humans.

 

[Erebus]

Animals being "put down" is NOT even close to assisting a human by helping to kill a human.
Modern human medicine can at least make someone who is dying in great pain feel
less pain and be made more comfortable.
It's what humans do for humans.

Would you mind expanding on why you feel the two aren't at all close?
Personally I see it as a mercy we extend to a loved one. The only way species comes into play is in legal terms.

 

[jeager106]

Would you mind expanding on why you feel the two aren't at all close?
Personally I see it as a mercy we extend to a loved one. The only way species comes into play is in legal terms.

I don't view animals on the same level as humans.
Do you?
If a race horse has a broken leg that can't be treated to at least save if for breeding stock
it is put down.
You don't see that a horse or cow or sheep can't be treated in the same way as a human?
Do you really see a pet cat as being on the same level as your mother?
Perhaps you can take out medical insurance on your pet cat with a $100,000,000
dollar limit on medical expenses?
If you have children and a dog and the dog was run over by a car with it's guts hanging
out would you take it to a vet and see if he could put it back together? If the vet could not
repair the damage and offered to end it's misery would you let him do such?
You'd do ANYTHING for your child.
You can't see the difference between an animal and a human?

 

[Erebus]

I don't view animals on the same level as humans.
Do you?

That really depends on the animal and the human in question. I held my dog in higher regard than I did most people. When he died, I lost a little brother.

It seems we have very different mindsets then. At any rate, thank you for taking the time to answer my question.

 

[arthra]

Inspired by the Consequences of Suicide thread I thought I'd pose more specific questions. In some places there are laws concerning the right to die for terminally ill patients. What are your personal feelings on terminating life when one is already going to die? And how do you think your faith plays into your position? Does it? Does your religion have a stance on it at all?

This would be under the area of what is called "bioethics" and is relatively new... I recall one case where a lady at a nearby hospital asked for consultation as she was interested in the Baha'i Faith... Her father the patient was not a Baha'i and was being on life support.. but clinically was near death ... As his daughter the hospital looked to her decision. I acquainted her with some of the Baha'i views of the after-life but advised her to consider what if the situation were reversed and she was the patient... What would she want. I believe she came to her decision.

Below is an excerpt from a bioethics paper that I could find on the subject from a Baha'i view:

"The holy writings are silent on the question of euthanasia. It has to be assumed that God, who has given life, must also dispose its end. Man is
forbidden to commit suicide. For the physician this means that euthanasia or assisted suicide is not permitted ethically. The so called “passive euthanasia” (the avoidance of life prolonging or life preserving measures, particularly
attempted revival, in accordance with the declared will of the patient) seems unobjectionable ethically. Beyond this it is again the case that, as long as the Universal House of Justice has not legislated on this question, every individual
must decide in accordance with his conscience."

http://bahai-library.com/pdf/s/schaefer_churches_religions_bioethics.pdf

 

[Nietzsche]

Animals being "put down" is NOT even close to assisting a human by helping to kill a human.
Modern human medicine can at least make someone who is dying in great pain feel
less pain and be made more comfortable.
It's what humans do for humans.

There comes a point where no amount of medication will help the pain. What then?

 

[Draka]

As I said in the other thread, I believe that suicide brings reincarnation into much the same hardships to overcome, however...I feel differently when it comes to this. If the person is terminal anyway and is just waiting to die in pain I just don't see what more they have to learn and for them to be able to go peacefully and with dignity is a mercy. A graceful bow out as it were.

 

[Sand Dancer]

Inspired by the Consequences of Suicide thread I thought I'd pose more specific questions. In some places there are laws concerning the right to die for terminally ill patients. What are your personal feelings on terminating life when one is already going to die? And how do you think your faith plays into your position? Does it? Does your religion have a stance on it at all?

I am for it. I would not want to be kept alive by machines or in severe pain for an extended period of time. I don't think there is a prohibition in my religion.

 

[Deathbydefault]

Inspired by the Consequences of Suicide thread I thought I'd pose more specific questions. In some places there are laws concerning the right to die for terminally ill patients. What are your personal feelings on terminating life when one is already going to die? And how do you think your faith plays into your position? Does it? Does your religion have a stance on it at all?

I believe a person has the right to do what they please with their own life and body.
I hold that in more value than I hold therapy, and so long as it does not directly affect others, it isn't someone else's concern.

On the topic of assisted suicide, I feel that if a person wishes to die then they have that right.
But when it comes to assisting that suicide, it is a two person action in respect to one persons decision.
You would need someone willing to help.

I take it to a much harder scale than that of pulling the plug on someone in great pain.
Say a friend of mine really wants to die, and he's really sure he wants to die, but he can't pull the trigger himself.
I wouldn't be against helping him.
But if someone else is, you can't blame them. Not everyone has the constitution to kill.

Of course many people's minds work a bit opposite of mine, so I'm sure my comment will seem rather strange to most.
But to those whom know my views on death and life, this post should not seem out of place for me

 

[whereismynotecard]

I believe if someone is sick and will die a slow, painful death, they should be allowed to choose to die sooner if that's what they want. Many people give their pets the courtesy of "putting them out of their misery" when they are terminally ill. (Although I have some reservations on that, since the animal itself is not choosing to die. I'm not sure when it's okay to decide that a dog's or cat's - or anything else's - life isn't worth living anymore.) I do think a human being should be able to choose for him or herself. If your religion says not to do this, then don't. Other people's religion might vary, so they should make the choice on their own.

I personally would rather die than live in agony. I always say that if I'm on life support for more than a week or so, I'd like to just die.

My religion does not play a factor in my opinion on this, as I have no religion.

 

[Deidre]

Once someone is dead though, he/she is dead. Would it be a decision you could live with, if you were in charge of helping that person to end his/her life? On the one hand, it seems more humane to assist in helping the person move past the suffering, but on the other hand, it might bring about a lot of emotional and ethical implications for those who are still alive, after that person is gone.

Hard stuff. My faith would tell me it's wrong, but on a human and humane level, I'm not sure if's 'wrong.'

 

[jeager106]

There comes a point where no amount of medication will help the pain. What then?

I can't answer that. I doubt anyone could without experiencing it.
I will, however, recount a story I witnessed.
In police work one is called on for almost any situation that isn't involving a crime.
Many are situations we responded to because people simply didn't know who else to
call upon. (think about that)
One in particular involved a boy about 15 years old. His caretaker was his mother, no
father in the picture.
He was dying of leukemia and was in gross pain as his body fought not to shut down.
Sometimes he would roll or fall out of bed and was unable to get up. His mother couldn't
help him as she was disabled her self so she'd call police.
This often occurred in the evening and I worked as a detective on 2nd shift. It was customary
to send a plain clothes officer(s) so as not to attract attention.
We'd help the boy as best we could and noted that he had a pre-loaded syringe of
morphine at his bedside. His doc made house calls in hardship case and left a syringe
of morphine for the poor lad in case pain became worse in the night.
After some months of helping this lad from time to time we never noticed more that
ONE syringe.
Well he died as expected. I took the call as we investigated any unusual death.
(he was just 15) I knew the case but had to photograph the body a do a brief report.
I took special note as there were SIX empty syringes at his bedside and SIX
fresh needle marks.
I knew what had happened. The doc, having mercy, left six doses of morphine
on purpose, likely at the boys begging.
I disposed of the 5 syringes and never said a word about it to anyone.
Never talked to the doc.
I just understood.
I don't think that makes me a bad cop.
It simply makes me human.

 

[psychoslice]

I think people should keep their fear based beliefs to themselves when it come to the right to die, its non of their business, gee I would even let a dog suffer, and God, well he should keep out of it also, he's done enough damage already.

 

[Eliab ben Benjamin]

I am somewhat thankful now that a legal right to die was not available some 30 years ago
when i had my massive head trauma in a car accident, (lost 40% brain, two comas
first from the injury and second as i caught meningeal meningitis from the untreated
open wounds ) I left hospital with Diplopia, Anosmia, loss of balance, massive pain,
exhaustion from the smallest effort oh and the receptors for pain meds were destroyed
so little relief .... Had it been available i would have demanded termination .

Since then (it took 5 years) i re-educated myself, learnt to walk with the aid of a cane
got prism, glasses to resolve the double vision, passed 2 more degrees, and have full
time gainful employment, live independently..
Founded the Head Injury Soc. of NZ, lobbied successfully for Cycle Helmet Laws,
a Disability Act, Human Rights Act, Rehabilitation Facilities and have 7 inventions
which improve life support equipment in Intensive care ...

No it was not entirely myself .. Hashem ( G-d ) was the driving force and instigator
of recovery ...

 

[psychoslice]

I am somewhat thankful now that a legal right to die was not available some 30 years ago
when i had my massive head trauma in a car accident, (lost 40% brain, two comas
first from the injury and second as i caught meningeal meningitis from the untreated
open wounds ) I left hospital with Diplopia, Anosmia, loss of balance, massive pain,
exhaustion from the smallest effort oh and the receptors for pain meds were destroyed
so little relief .... Had it been available i would have demanded termination .

Since then (it took 5 years) i re-educated myself, learnt to walk with the aid of a cane
got prism, glasses to resolve the double vision, passed 2 more degrees, and have full
time gainful employment, live independently..
Founded the Head Injury Soc. of NZ, lobbied successfully for Cycle Helmet Laws,
a Disability Act, Human Rights Act, Rehabilitation Facilities and have 7 inventions
which improve life support equipment in Intensive care ...

No it was not entirely myself .. Hashem ( G-d ) was the driving force and instigator
of recovery ...

Yes but that's you, that is your choice, don't take that choice away from others, you were just lucky to survive, where as many don't.

 

[Noa]

I personally take no issue with euthanasia assuming that the respective person has had a psychiatric evaluation prior. I extend this opinion to those without a fatal illness or condition.

My beliefs as to spiritual topics have no impact on that opinion.