Russian Orthodox Church and the Ukraine

[Orbit]

This is a very interesting article about how the Russian Orthodox Church sees the west as "decadent", and thinks pride parades are a sin. All of this gets mishmashed into support for the Russian war on Ukraine.

In His ‘Forgiveness Day’ Sermon — a Slightly More Sophisticated ‘GloboHomo’ Rant — Kirill Lays Out an Authoritarian Vision in Which His Version of God Might Dominate and Rule the Human Race | Religion Dispatches

 

[amorphous_constellation]

various questions I have: is the patriarchate traditionally separate from state, like it became over here. Does this particular patriarch have authority to say what he's saying, since the head patriarch is in turkiye? Will this attitude carry over to the russian population, if they become economically closed off, from economic/western influence? And of course, how does the orthodox culture of ukraine see the situation

 

[Ella S.]

In my informal research on the teachings of the Russian Orthodox Church, I came across Patriarch Kirill, who is not only active on social media but also frequently appears in a number of sermons uploaded to YouTube. It is easy to cross-reference the article with these sources to examine whether the article is an accurate reflection of his views.

Personally, I disagree with most of what he says, especially when it comes to ethics.

To be fair, I do wonder if that is a Western bias of mine. After all, I am a Utilitarian, which is a philosophy that not only originates in the West but among English-speakers.

At the same time, I do try to be objective, referencing descriptive models of evolutionary ethics and moral psychology to gain a naturalistic understanding of morality. The Patriarch, by contrast, seems to believe in divine command theory. It's possible that he is being as objective about his ethics as I am about mine, if not more objective and well-read, and it seems that many see him as refreshingly honest about Orthodox ethics.

How do you argue with someone who not only disagrees with your conclusions, but your entire method of reaching those conclusions? It seems almost inevitable that some sort of cultural conflict would arise there.

 

[Orbit]

various questions I have: is the patriarchate traditionally separate from state, like it became over here. Does this particular patriarch have authority to say what he's saying, since the head patriarch is in turkiye? Will this attitude carry over to the russian population, if they become economically closed off, from economic/western influence? And of course, how does the orthodox culture of ukraine see the situation

My understanding, based on the limited reading that I've done, is that this particular patriarch is the head of the Moscow variant of Orthodoxy, and has close ties to the Russian government. This variant sees the Ukranian variant of Orthodoxy as illegitimate. In Ukraine, both groups oppose the war, however.

 

[stvdv]

the Russian Orthodox Church sees the west as "decadent"

Good observation of that Church

I do hope their priests don't abuse little children
Because sexully abusing children trumps being "decadent" when talking about sin

Better that Church be aware 3 fingers point usually back when pointing at others

 

[rational experiences]

Men are notified God caused the choice of human sin. As God gave humans free will choice.

As God owned the reason human body mind consciousness inherited the stone attack.

Nuclear radio waves transmitters given in fallout gases burning. Cooled ice saviour gases then were removed.

So they preach direct channelled to thought..
Told you so ....God has ruled over you.

God gave you the changed life bodies and mind scattered language changes.

No longer do you speak the language of a man to a man. Or a woman to a woman.

As I gave double transmitting of gods gases to machines. As Russian men understand nuclear science also.

You humans in the west are brain changed worse than our minds with ice.

We pretend nuclear attacks are safe as we have a colder climate.

So when you balance out earth mind changes by intent what it should be to what it becomes by any God advice in a mind is lying.

As you shouldn't believe nuclear is safe as you gained a direct earth star hit in Russia. And humans brain changed by gods scientists as mans causes shouldnt be brain changed either.

Memory said science caused it. Then powerful men murdered the victim when their choice science changed life.

Today humans parade back claiming I always owned human rights. Once you murdered me for being a victim of the God sciences. Now I'll be proud that I'm still alive.

 

[Stevicus]

This is a very interesting article about how the Russian Orthodox Church sees the west as "decadent", and thinks pride parades are a sin. All of this gets mishmashed into support for the Russian war on Ukraine.

In His ‘Forgiveness Day’ Sermon — a Slightly More Sophisticated ‘GloboHomo’ Rant — Kirill Lays Out an Authoritarian Vision in Which His Version of God Might Dominate and Rule the Human Race | Religion Dispatches

Yes, there's been quite a resurgency in Orthodoxy in Russia. Of course, for centuries Russia had been devoutly religious, probably more so than the West which became more liberal and secularized. The Communists opposed the Orthodox Church, as they were blamed for keeping Russia backward and behind the West technologically and industrially. But since the fall of the USSR, the Orthodox Church has been making quite a comeback.

Interestingly, the Soviets also thought the West was decadent and degenerative.

I wonder if some "holy war" is in the works.

 

[Revoltingest]

I wonder if some "holy war" is in the works.

I see that as a component of Putin's expansionism.
Think of it as the Crusades plus acquiring real estate
& fossil fuel reserves under contiguous seas.

 

[rational experiences]

In man's mind using words describing letters as by imposed numbers codings...men named all names about anything on earth.

Anything he said everything he said the All I name as a man.

Technology began in a desert landscape. Egyptian life changed inherited.... Muslim changed sacrificed man. Life attacked again secular split Iranian.

In UK Ra ine. Ukranian he says.

UK stands for a united kingdom.

UK English Roman who rejected the teaching church. Fought the holy war against rich men scientific nuclear destruction technology. Muslim resurgence to rebuild Egyptian technology.

Church teachings false science idealism. No man was God the churches hypocrite founding. Reasoned. Said self scientist a hypocrite.

So the church is meant to preach against any violence as all humanity the all is living breath.AH. Is not meant to be harmed as God the earth gods heavens protected life.

Was the religious teaching.

God status kept life protected only man chose to oppose gods protection.

And you are all in every country involved in that achievement.

You use technology. You use invented resourcing removal God holy.

So God owns a war against all men.

Says the predictions of all men anywhere and everywhere

The man direct name owner was The sky fall caused science history.

Warning life dies by artificial sky net man's technological war against his own self. Conscious spiritual mind changes. Was developing spirituality then gains irradiation mind leaves.

Told taught by all religions to their own nation by religious decree.

As no man is God a God or a deity.

The teachings said unity of the kingdom of God was stated in the past by the holy war teachings.

Men stopped technology temple pyramid sciences rebuilding.

It hasn't been rebuilt.

New technology was accepted by all men on earth. If all men now need to change their personal ideals about introduced techniques technology they need to unite in the agreement about self destruction all together.

United against causing it.

 

[Stevicus]

I see that as a component of Putin's expansionism.
Think of it as the Crusades plus acquiring real estate
& fossil fuel reserves under contiguous seas.

I suppose it just depends on which Putin we're dealing with. We have Putin the businessman, Putin the bloodthirsty nationalist, or Putin the holy warrior. It seems he's all three.

The "holy war" aspect does seem a bit disconcerting. Not that I think many will line up behind Putin's "holy war," but just the idea itself could be catching.

 

[Mock Turtle]

Rather ironic, given that there might be as much belief in religion in the USA as there is in Russia (but just different) so perhaps his ire is aimed at Europe where religions tend to be in decline. The usual? Backing some action that one might see as aiding one's own agenda, even if one had some reservations. But perhaps just the inertia of this belief system grinding on into the present and dragging along these damaging old beliefs.

 

[Revoltingest]

I suppose it just depends on which Putin we're dealing with.

This one....

 

[Estro Felino]

I see that as a component of Putin's expansionism.
Think of it as the Crusades plus acquiring real estate
& fossil fuel reserves under contiguous seas.

We have the Freemason Jesuit Bergoglio...
They have a real Christian as leader.

Bad luck.

 

[Revoltingest]

We have the Freemason Jesuit Bergoglio...
They have a real Christian as leader.

Bad luck.

I once had some antique Mason Jars.
That primitive glass, with its bubbles
was really pretty.

 

[Estro Felino]

various questions I have: is the patriarchate traditionally separate from state, like it became over here. Does this particular patriarch have authority to say what he's saying, since the head patriarch is in turkiye? Will this attitude carry over to the russian population, if they become economically closed off, from economic/western influence? And of course, how does the orthodox culture of ukraine see the situation

Technically yes.
De facto there is no cultural separation, because the Orthodox Church has autocephalous national Churches, so they are pretty linked to the Lay State.

As for the RCC;
The Vatican is a State on its own. So there is a full separation between the secular State and the Church.
And the Vatican has an international, non-national status.

 

[Stevicus]

This one....

That's perfect. It seems double agent @Wu Wei has successfully infiltrated Putin's inner circle.

 

[Wu Wei]

That's perfect. It seems double agent @Wu Wei has successfully infiltrated Putin's inner circle.

Sadly that is not me...... otherwise this whole Russian Ukrainian thing would be over...with one less despot in the world

 

[metis]

This is a very interesting article about how the Russian Orthodox Church sees the west as "decadent", and thinks pride parades are a sin. All of this gets mishmashed into support for the Russian war on Ukraine.

In His ‘Forgiveness Day’ Sermon — a Slightly More Sophisticated ‘GloboHomo’ Rant — Kirill Lays Out an Authoritarian Vision in Which His Version of God Might Dominate and Rule the Human Race | Religion Dispatches

Apparently, they didn't either get Jesus' message or have decided to ignore it. So sad.

 

[amorphous_constellation]

Technically yes.
De facto there is no cultural separation, because the Orthodox Church has autocephalous national Churches, so they are pretty linked to the Lay State.

As for the RCC;
The Vatican is a State on its own. So there is a full separation between the secular State and the Church.
And the Vatican has an international, non-national status.

Do patriarchs, or head patriarchs, conform or interact with those in other countries? Is the lead one in Turkiye, is he pope-like, or is that an incorrect analysis

 

[Estro Felino]

Do patriarchs, or head patriarchs, conform or interact with those in other countries? Is the lead one in Turkiye, is he pope-like, or is that an incorrect analysis

Pretty correct. Not rrally pope-like...but the first among equals. A guide, not a head.